When do I need to anneal?

Suther

Suther

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I have some cases that have a few firings on them, and was wondering about annealing. I've been working up a load, and have settled on using a 150gr partition with 51.5gr of IMR4350, but the cases have a few firings on them...

They are 270 win cases, on the 4th firing (maybe 5th, but I'm pretty sure 4th). They are going to be my hunting ammo for this particular rifle, so the ammo won't be used much (partitions are too cheap to punch paper with). I figure I'll load up 20 rounds, use them to sight in the rifle come hunting season (the scope will be set to 130gr cheap range stuff over the summer) and still have plenty left over. Rinse and repeat for future seasons (reload any that got shot, and set them on the shelf).

So with 4 firings on them now, I could probably go another few years without getting to 10 loads on these cases. Is there any real reason to anneal these cases now?

When do you normally anneal new cases?

Does how hot the load is matter? My current 270 load is right near book max, some of the loads I tried were a bit over (although without any pressure signs)?

Im just about to work up a load with 130gr Winchester PP (got them dirt cheap at WSS closing sales) with 1F cases. I'm looking to make the most accurate load I can with this rifle and bullet combo, within reason. I won't be doing them every firing, thats just too much effort for screwing around at the range. With that in mind, how often would you anneal these cases?
 
Unfortunatly this is one of those things with no straight forward answer , brass quality , chamber size , load spec all play a part. Quality brass in a tight chamber and minimal sizing will work harden a lot slower then garbage brass in a excessively large chamber .. some guys will do every 2nd or 3rd firing while other guys never do and have other brass issues befor having to worry about annealing.. if your load is on the higher end and quality brass I'd say every 4th or 5th firing should be more then enough
 
ultimate_monkey said:
Unfortunatly this is one of those things with no straight forward answer , brass quality , chamber size , load spec all play a part. Quality brass in a tight chamber and minimal sizing will work harden a lot slower then garbage brass in a excessively large chamber .. some guys will do every 2nd or 3rd firing while other guys never do and have other brass issues befor having to worry about annealing.. if your load is on the higher end and quality brass I'd say every 4th or 5th firing should be more then enough
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Winchester Brass, sized in a full length sizing die but only enough to chamber without issues.
 
Win brass is ok (imo) if you really want to extend the life of.the brass you can't really over anneal , in terms of to often . But like most things it comes down to time vs savings .

Just make sure you don't soften the body of the case to much or there really isn't much else to do but toss it
 
I anneal every 4th firing, just because that's the frequency I'm comfortable with. I'm loading 243 Win in moderate loads. I usually get 8-10 firings with Federal brass, most of my Winchester brass is just getting to 4 loading cycles now. Annealing more often will always be better, how much you gain from annealing every time around is a matter of opinion.
There are two reasons to anneal, one is to extend the life of your brass, the second is to possibly get more consistent neck tension.
I don't have enough experience with reloading to give a definitive answer about neck tension, but it will definitely extend your brass life if done correctly.
 
Annealing is a relatively recent fad, prompted by benchrest shooters that are trying to wring out every last bit of accuracy they can. For your purposes, the benefit may be intangeable. Moreover, if you don't know what you are doing, you can do more damage than good.
I would think that loose primer pockets, and possibly case separations would be more concerning. Finally, I would suggest using relatively fresh brass for hunting rounds. A case failure during a hunting trip can be a major drag..... Ask me how I know.
 
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My normal hunting brass I don't anneal,but I only use it 3 times. It lasts awhile, practice shoots plus hunting shoots. My black powder stuff gets annealed every 3rd time. Some of my is over $10 apiece so I don't like loosing them. The method I use is an over an inch of water ,heat the necks with a propane torch until I just see them turn red then tip them over. It works good for me. 45 Colt I do because i don't like Sooty deposits. Brass is to hard for low pressure loads to seal the case properly.
 
For myself, annealing was introduced because I couldn't get consistent neck tension on factory Federal brass originally shot in the rifles we own. (started with neck turning that brass and it didn't solve the issue to satisfaction) Seating depths and forces were changing frequently.

Annealing was by necessity to fix the problem. Variability regarding spring back and case hardness from case to case was greatly reduced.

In hindsight after a few years, if I had started with Lapua brass I may have never gotten into annealing or neck turning. A curse and a blessing at the same time for me. Can be time consuming but I believe I am a better trouble shooter for more consistent reloads as a result.

I am a hunter that enjoys shooting paper and developing loads. Early on had some hunting round bullets move 30 thou or so into the case. I learned that lesson once.

FWIW
Regards
Ronr
 
Suther .... I bought an AMP annealer and I have been annealing for friends and family when the need arises. I don't charge them . Never know if there is someone close to you that could help you out. Put a few feelers out.
 
wolf19534 said:
Suther .... I bought an AMP annealer and I have been annealing for friends and family when the need arises. I don't charge them . Never know if there is someone close to you that could help you out. Put a few feelers out.
Click to expand...

That's one idea, but for this particular set of brass I'm just gonna pass on the process all together because they won't get used much once loaded again. I'm going to start working on a new load with another lot of brass, might start dabbling with annealing then. My brother is just about to get into reloading 223 for a target rifle, so I'll probably just try to convince him he needs to get into annealing if he wants the most accurate ammo...
 
cosmic said:
Annealing is a relatively recent fad, prompted by benchrest shooters that are trying to wring out every last bit of accuracy they can. For your purposes, the benefit may be intangeable. Moreover, if you don't know what you are doing, you can do more damage than good.
I would think that loose primer pockets, and possibly case separations would be more concerning. Finally, I would suggest using relatively fresh brass for hunting rounds. A case failure during a hunting trip can be a major drag..... Ask me how I know.
Click to expand...

I've been thinking about it, and I'm going to follow your advice on this. I'm gonna keep this lot of brass for load development, and use some 1F brass for my hunting loads just in case.
 
I am not sure where I come in on this discussion. I have a Savage in 6mm BR using Lapua brass that I have reloaded about 20 to 25 times with no problems. I just grabbed the first 30 cases out of the box and used them. I figured if one of my bright ideas went bad, I wouldn't ruin the whole box.

I have considered annealing but haven't done that yet.

To the OP, why not take 5 of your cases, reload and shoot them, keep them separate from the rest. If you get 20 reloads before you split a neck, it would be fair to assume you could go to the original batch, get 15 reloads and still safely take them hunting.
 
The problem with case failure in hunting loads isn't so much split necks as it is case separation.
If you're deer hunting, a separated case will ruin your hunting trip, and may prevent a follow-up shot on an animal.
If you're hunting something that will eat you if it gets the chance or if you pi** it off badly enough, a separated case can be life and death.

Some calibers seem to have different failure modes, or it just may be the brand of brass you're dealing with. For instance, I've yet to have a separated case with a .243, but I've had quite a few necks crack. I anneal every 4th firing, although if it's 100% effective is anyone's guess. Just because the case neck and shoulder was heated and cooled doesn't mean it's properly annealed.
Most of the cases I've had fail (cracked necks) have been Federal or Remington, my Winchester and Lapua brass don't have enough miles on them to compare yet.
I'd be interested to hear of other's experiences with failure modes of different calibers and brands of brass. What fails first, typically?
 
I think it's rifle specific. Case head separation is the normal failure mode for my Savage 99 .250-3000, I have had it happen dozens of times in that gun. I will point out that though that never once has it tied up the gun. The two pieces of brass are always connected by a remaining ligament of material, and both pull out cleanly. I only notice the issue when I go to pick them up. I've only used Winchester brass in it.

Take away the Savage, and I've had maybe 2 case head separations in anything else. Everything fails by split necks.

I hear lots of people say they lose most of their brass to loose primer pockets, but I have never experienced that, personally.
 
For hunting I'd strongly agree with Cosmic, use NEW brass. After all, how many rounds do you go through each season hunting big game??
If you're reloading for high volume practice or competition, some accuracy guys do it EVERY TIME.
 
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