Which .223... CZ, Remington...

pazzo

pazzo

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so, now that i've decided that i'm in the market for a .223, i'm not sure which is the Best one of the bunch? i wanted to spend around $1000.
here's my list thus far: CZ, Remington, Winchester, Ruger and Savage (please add to my list if you suggest another brand w/in the aforementioned price).
i want the most accurate, best quality, and overall 'Audi' of the bunch. note that i didn't say Mercedes cause i know i'd be spending a whole lot more than $1000 ;) and i read the Tikka T3 is a POS :p
now i'm hoping to compare quality/ accuracy to my friend's Brno Fox in .222!

thx

pazz0
 
Interesting that you heard that Tikka is a POS, I doubt you'll have too many people on this board agree with that observation. What do you want to do with your 223? Hunt, shoot targets, compete? $1000.00 is that just for the rifle or are you including a scope with that figure? Most companies these days make accurate rifles, from a Stevens at $360.00 to a CZ at 860.00. FS
 
Is this for hunting or target?
If for hunting where you gonna carry the rifle, go with T3 Lite.
It is an accurate and will not break your budget.
 
interesting replies, thanks everybody! i actually read an article yesterday on the Tikka T3 and how they took every cost cutting shortcut imaginable. i too thought it was a good rifle until i read the reviews... hmm...
ok, so the Tikka is in the list then!

but would the quality be like my friends Brno?
i would like my $1000 to include a scope, but like i said, i'm not trying to cheap out. there's few things i enjoy, and one is quality. i initially felt i was being cheap by limiting my price, but now i've been reading that all the guns manufacturers i mentioned are about that price!? so that's why i would like to keep it at that, cause i can't afford a Sako or something like that... and i need a scope on it, but that's a different issue :)

the rifle will be used for nothing larger than a Coyote.
 
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pazzo said:
$1000 ;) and i read the Tikka T3 is a POS
Click to expand...

uhhh.. where did you read this?

I have three T3's in different calibers and I tell you they are the best rifles I have owned. Accuracy, smooth, reliable.. flawless.
did I mention they are accurate?

If you call 1/2 minute of angle a POS.. what do you consider good?

I would take a T3 over any of the ones you mentioned. Seriously.
I suggest you look at a laminated stainless.
http://www.tikka.fi/

take one of these in .243 and you are good to go. You have to actually see one for it to be done justice. My wife has one and it is beautiful and accurate as hell!

BTW:
the article you are reading.. isnt that the American guy who hates everything that isnt made in the USA? hates polymer and anything new or imported? The guy stuck in yesturday?

My Tikka's shoot just as accurate out of the box as guys who have spent big bucks at the gunsmith. They come factory free floated etc.... dont get all caught up by one bad vote in some article.

cheers,
 
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Chuck Hawks' material is useful if the Liberal Party's website is down, or if you have nothing else to use in the crapper.
 
Pazzo try not to get caught up in all the hype. Fact of the matter is all rifles made these days shoot good. Some rifles like Savage and Tikka, CZ,tend to shoot even better. There is a great thread on the Precision rifles forum by Mystic that takes the least expensive 223 in the market place, a stevens and for very little extra money turns it into a long range tack driver. Now this fellow is a very exp. long range shooter and owns an assortment of custom rifles and hand loads ammo to an exact spec. But he was still amazed at how accurate this inexpensive rifle shot. Now a Stevens isn't going to be the nicest looking rifle you have ever seen, but most folks here realize that a rifles accuracy is much more important than its looks. You may be better off buying a Stevens for $369.00 and put a scope on top thats worth roughly the same money, like a Bushnell 3200 4-12x40, plus rings and bases and gst and your at about $870.00, that leaves some money for ammo and other range accessories like a bipod. FS
 
tikka

I recomend you go to the shop and actually feel the rifle and go with the one that feels right to you, looks don't play into it, also pick up a tikka and work the action, I have never felt anything so smooth and others will agree. the tikka has very little bolt slop when it is open unlike the savage, the savage bolt when open wiggles around pretty good. The savage guys will know what I am talking about, both are excellent shooters however. Check out the new line of weatherbys, I am not sure what their moa rifle line costs are but I would consider them as contenders also....
 
pazzo said:
i came across this interesting article... discuss?
http://www.chuckhawks.com/critical_look_T3.htm
Click to expand...

I am sorry, but this guy whole article is based on personal options and assumptions and not facts like-

- Plastic vs metal for parts - sure metal might be better than cheap plastic, but what about all the other more resilient materials that everyone assumes is plastic like polymers (used in Glocks and various other weapons) - Yes I know all the old school guys out there LOVE their wood stocks but even the M16 is made of plastic!
Personal experience - my all metal mag for my M14 is no better than my plastic mag for my T3.

- Checkering - complaining about the amount and type of checkering - is this guy a manufacturing expert? also, how does he know what is easier to produces? I am sure the mould that is used to make the plastic stocks or the CNC machines (or whatever they use to manufacture wooden stocks) that carves the wood stocks don't care how many checkered patterns there are or there size.

Yes I am sure all rifles were made better 'back in the day', but what happened to Winchester in 1964? and why are they out of business now?

I am sure a lot of the criticisms can also be applied to Savage, Ruger and most modern day firearm manufactures.

Like a lot of stuff on the internet, you have to use your judgment on what is said and taking everything with a grain of salt....

But I would recommend going to your local gun shop or range and handling each of your choices and make your own determination of fit, qualify and workmanship.

/cl
 
There are in fact, 3 problems I can think of with the CZ-527; I own one, so I can make objective criticisms.

1) The magazine is right in front of the trigger, so that it makes a bit ackward for carrying.
2) Another issue is that the barrel is 1-12 twist so it will not stabilize bullets above ~50grs, so if you intended to handload for it with bullets 50grs+ then it wouldn't be the best. That is a common problem with most .223's of course.
3) They run around $900. It's going to be $1100 and up, depending upon the scope cost.

The CZ-527 has an awesome single set trigger. They are superbly accurate when using bullets from 40-50grs. Extremely well built Mini-Mauser action.

Mine is the CZ-527 Varmint Laminated (with which I have never shot a coyote). ;)

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This gun has a Monte Carlo stock; mine is the straight Classic stock.
 
Ive shot some yote's with my CZ 527 .223 and its worked just fine even with the 55gr blitzkings that it shoots into less than 1" 3shot groups at 200 yds.

On the other hand Demonical has some valid points and the rifle does have some shortcomings

1) backwards safety
2 )magazine arangement makes it a pain in the ass to carry slung on your back all afternoon or carried by hand.

The set trigger can be disabled if you prefer (mine is) and both are completely adjustable and work very well.

Im keeping mine but in all fairness if I was to buy a "varmint" gun again would prefer something without the detachable magazine and a floorplate instead, a"normal" safety would be a big plus too. Although all of my other rifles are CRF I dont really think its nescessary in a yote gun.
 
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Bwana I think the safety is a non-issue. I think it's hella-cool to have that mini-CRF action too! :)

Are you getting those groups with factory or handloads? I've only used El-cheapo Wal-Mart factory stuff so far. If I use 45gers I can get sub 1" 5 shot groups.
 
Well I had my eye on a Remington 700 LVSF .223, then I switched to a Tikka T3 Lite stainless. I had the 2 side by side and the Tikka is far superior in fit and finish.

SO I came home with a Tikka .223 today. Range report tomorrow.
 
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