Which solvent?

nelly

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Sorry if this has been asked already... I normally clean all my corrosive stuff with a good flush of boiling water, but am assembling a field cleaning kit to fill that last pouch on my chicom bandolier.

I see many references to using "old" GI solvent, as it was designed to be effective against the corrosive primer salts.

Can anyone be a little more specific about WHICH "old" solvents to look for, and where to find 'em? I have seen some 2 oz bottles in surplus stores that seem to be of Vietnam era, so I would suspect they would NOT be effective? (I mean, the US army was telling their poor folks that the M16 was self-cleaning for a while there, right?).

Cheers,

Neal
 
I don't think any solvents will actually be effective against the salts, some of the old old stuff maybe, but chances are one touch and your hair will fall out. I heard a lot of people carry around a can of WD-40, it coats the rifle in a layer of oil and will block moisture from getting to the salts. Not a cleaning, bt will last until you can run some water through it.
 
Sorry if this has been asked already... I normally clean all my corrosive stuff with a good flush of boiling water, but am assembling a field cleaning kit to fill that last pouch on my chicom bandolier.

I see many references to using "old" GI solvent, as it was designed to be effective against the corrosive primer salts.

Can anyone be a little more specific about WHICH "old" solvents to look for, and where to find 'em? I have seen some 2 oz bottles in surplus stores that seem to be of Vietnam era, so I would suspect they would NOT be effective? (I mean, the US army was telling their poor folks that the M16 was self-cleaning for a while there, right?).

Cheers,

Neal

I actually use (and sell) this stuff I bought by the crate from Brooklyn NY. It is circa 1943 and was made for the U.S. military for their M1 Garands. It's a creamy white liquid. I use it on my SKS's after shooting, and it's awesome. Comes in a period tin coated in oil (so they are hardly corroded) with a metal screw cap. Made specifically for corrosive ammunition.

Looking at the MSDS sheet, it's mostly kerosene, which is what Hoppes 9 or Ed's Red is anyways.
 
Sorry if this has been asked already... I normally clean all my corrosive stuff with a good flush of boiling water, but am assembling a field cleaning kit to fill that last pouch on my chicom bandolier.

I see many references to using "old" GI solvent, as it was designed to be effective against the corrosive primer salts.

Can anyone be a little more specific about WHICH "old" solvents to look for, and where to find 'em? I have seen some 2 oz bottles in surplus stores that seem to be of Vietnam era, so I would suspect they would NOT be effective? (I mean, the US army was telling their poor folks that the M16 was self-cleaning for a while there, right?).

Cheers,

Neal

Canada Ammo sells this stuff, looks like what you are looking for.

http://canadaammo.com/product.php?productid=68&cat=2&page=2
 
Hmmmm.... Too bad canada ammo won't over the counter sell, as I work right near them.

CLP, eh? Interesting idea.

And WD-40 just displaces water, so I am suspicious.

Hmmmmmm......
 
I like the picture, so...

OTG531lg.jpg
 
Here is some info posted on another forum which makes some sense to me.

The link: http:// castboolits. gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-5640.html

"The issue G.I. bore cleaners during the corrosive priming era were water-based. There are two commonly-encountered formulations: the first type is a brownish color and smells like creosote; the second is milky-white and is based on a water-soluble oil (Hatcher called it a 'polarizing oil'). Either of these will work to dissolve and remove the corrosive salt residue from firing corrosive-primed ammunition.
The formula given by Hatcher as having been used at SA was not an issue item, and does not contain any effective solvent of the salt, Potassium Chloride - KCl. In fact, like Hoppe's #9, it was formulated in the days before the real cause of firearms corrosion was understood (at least in the United States - the Europeans had non-corrosive priming formulae long before the problem was recognized here), and was intended to dissolve any remaining powder residue, which was then thought to be acid.
In fact, there is no readily available chemical which is even one-tenth so efficient a solvent of the salt residue as plain water, with or without additional ingredients.
Neither will formulations containing ammonia 'neutralize' the salt, which is, in fact, of neutral pH, being neither acidic nor basic. Only by dissolving and removing the salt residue can after-corrosion be prevented, and no bore cleaning compound which does not contain water can be relied on to do this.
So long as water is the most efficient, readily available and cheapest substance for the job, why not use it? All that is necessary is that the bore and parts exposed to firing residue be thoroughly swabbed (and a brush helps in the bore) with water, hot or cold, with or without additives, then thoroughly dried and oiled before being put away.
I proved to my own satisfaction that Hoppe's and other bore cleaners which are not water-based will not work to remove corrosive priming residue sufficiently to prevent after corrosion, advertising hype to the contrary notwithstanding. This was more than 40 years ago, with my first .45 auto, and when gun cleaning was MUCH more interesting to me than it is today. After a session with surplus ammo from the 1920's, I cleaned the pistol thorougly with Hoppe's, oiled it and put it away - two weeks later, when taken out, the bore was brown and fuzzy - I cleaned it again with water, and have never since suffered any after-corrosion in firearms so treated.
I recently had occasion to discuss label claims of Hoppe's in this regard with the manufacturers - after being completely unable to point to any chemical explanation of how their formula or any of its components might effectively dissolve the salt residue (which is the only way to remove it with any certainty), their response boiled down to a dependence on 'brushing and flushing' - that is, mechanical agitation and flooding - to remove the salt. This approach was thoroughly discredited more than 70 years ago.
Modern shooters are often unfamiliar with the history of the problem, and all too prone to accept that the latest and greatest commercial nostrums MUST be good for all things - I'm more sceptical, and actually did some research on chemical solvents of KCl - I'd suggest that anyone who wants to know more about exactly HOW the current commercial formulae accomplish whatever they may claim in this case should contact the manufacturer(s) and request their explanation in chemical terms. Also, you might want to do as I did, and try to find alternatives to water as a solvent of KCl: there are NO good ones.
Do what you think best, but, by all means, read the discussion of corrosion in 'Hatcher's Notebook' for the background."

This also makes sense in the context that even with this stuff available, I have heard first hand that during the time of corrosive ammo it was standard to pour boiling water down the barrel if possible.
 
Yes, agreed on the water issue - I use it all the time at home. My issue is trying to find a wee bottle of magic juice that will fit in a bandolier for field use. That said, maybe I should just look for a folding funnel and a water bottle at m.e.c.; I LOVE going in there and asking the wee granola girls for help to find product 'A' or 'B', and telling them WHY I want it... They look SO scandalized!
 
Simple Green works well for cleaning my SKS. It's water based and the degreasing action helps to remove crud more thoroughly than straight water as a bonus. Any other similar product such as Windex, trisodium phosphate (TSP), etc. will accomplish pretty much the same thing.
 
water soluble oil as used for coolant in machine tools works well. I think simple green has lye in it, it may cause corrosion.

Ed's red is not just ATF, it is a mix of ATF, Paint Thinner, Kerosene, and Acetone.

I have used Diet Coke a couple of times, it seemed to work.
 
Simple Green is alkaline, like most other cleaning solutions, including soapy water. Certainly, any such solution has the potential to cause corrosion if you were to leave something damp for an extended period of time, but not if you clean it off.

Basically, anything that can dissolve corrosive salts has the potential to itself cause corrosion. For that matter, many bore cleaners, such as Sweets 7.62, should not be allowed to dry in the bore either, as they are also quite alkaline due to their ammonia content.
 
Buckbrush, it's funny you should mention water soluble machine oil. I've been eyeing the bottle of it sitting by the lathe for a while and thought it might do the trick. I wonder if there's anything you could add to it to increase it's cleaning ability.

Currently I use window cleaner. I know it's little better than water but it's convenient and evaporates a bit faster. I follow up with Ed's red (love the stuff!).

Robin
 
I've been having some issues with rust inside the gas chamber. I'm guessing I need to go at this stuff with a brass wire brush of some sort... Will any of these solvents named above help in removing these rust deposits completely or are you guys namely referring to removing the salts BEFORE it gets this nasty...
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What would you recommend I do in my current situation I have here^
 
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