Which WW2 Rifle?

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MattG666

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I hope this is in the right forum:

I am going to be sending in my PAL/RPAL papers very soon and while I wait (I live in Ontario) I want to get an idea as to what guns I want to buy first.

I have always been an avid WW2 buff so naturally I would like to own at least 1 WW2 rifle. Seeing as I am a complete beginner and do not know much about cleaning and maintaining firearms yet, which WW2 rifle would you reccomend to a beginner?

Ease of use/maintenance, reliability, and availability (for the ammo as well) are my main consideration but I am open to all suggestions.

Thanks in advance!
 
Lee Enfields, they are plentiful fun to shoot and can take almost any game you'd want. (Deer, Moose, and Elk) The bullets can be found at any store that sells ammunition, CO-OP and Home Hardware stores have them.
 
First, I would suggest a .22 rimfire for cheap practice to learn proper shooting techniques without having to fight an impending flinch problem. After a rimfire, I would suggest:

1) Lee-Enfield, for the reasons suggested above
2) Yugo M-48 Mauser in 8x57. Relatively cheap, plentiful, good shooters and the classic Mauser 98 action.
3) Swede M38 or M96 Mauser in 6.5x55. A great cartridge and a quality rifle, but ammo availability is not as good as either .303 or 8x57 and pricier.

Mark
 
It all depends on which country you liked. If Canada is your flavor, you will want a Long Branch made, Lee Enfield No.4Mk1*. If the US was your label, then the M1 Garand. Germany, the K98, Russian the Moisin Nagant, Switzerland the K31, the list goes on.

From my Opinion, Every Canadian need a Long Branch No.4Mk1*.
 
On the other hand, what are your interests, historically? The list above which has been given in Post 3 by mmattockx works very well, except that I might change the order from "Friend-Enemy-Neutral" to "Friend-Neutral-Enemy" as the Kar 98k does have a nasty wallop that some folks have a bit of trouble with.

And there is always loading your own. Keeps costs down, also you can load what works best in your own rifle and ALSO you can load 'down' a bit so as to minimise recoil (if that is a problem for you.... certainly is for me).

If you are interested in BOTH World Wars, the ONE rifle you will need is an SMLE: Short, Magazine Lee-Enfield, in its Mark III or Mark III* style. This rifle is correct for BOTH wars; it was developed toward the end of the Boer War, did both World wars, soldiered on into Korea and is still in service in Pakistan and India both. After you get one of those..... well, the next step, obviously, is to get its WW2 replacement, the Number 4.

But a .22 rimfire should be first: no recoil at all, very little noise. It will teach you technique and control. And find a shooting buddy who can give you some GOOD coaching; there are too many yahoos already. I will be using a .22 later this Summer, teaching a friend (a very small woman) how to have a lttle more fun than she can have in her city.

Most important of all: have fun!

Welcome to the club!
 
True words. They tend to look MUCH better inside than they do outside.

AND they are genuine World War 2 German rifles with the swastikas ground off and the Seal of Solomon applied and brand-new barrels using something that we can get anywhere.

For a German rifle, you might also look at some of the Russian captures that come in from time to time. Friend of mine picked up a couple to play with: one was a J.P. Sauer & Sohne, the other a Gustloff. He's happy.
 
Actually, I would suggest something more along the lines of a Russian SKS for a starter gun. You can feed it for peanuts, and as a semi it takes the fun factor up a notch. Maintenance is a step above most bolt guns, but not hard, and that is part of the learning process anyway. You can pick them up cheaper than almost any other milsurp as well.

As you and your friends get over the mass brass approach, and begin to seek accuracy, you can venture into the world of .303, 30-06, and .308 service guns. The ammo for these is plentiful, but not truly cheap. A day at the range with your .303 and a couple of friends can cost you a hundred bucks easy ($1.00-1.50/round). An SKS can be shot all summer off of one case for the same amount.
 
What panman says regarding cost is quite correct; that's why I handload. I can shoot just about any military battle rifle (the types used in both World Wars) for about half a buck a shot. That's a lot better than $3.75 a shot for Swedish-made 7.62 Russian Long ammunition... which is one of the cartridges that I load for half a buck a shot: 7.62x54R for the Moisin-Nagant and Tokarev.

The SKS is a fun little gun, but it does require strict maintenance, especially as just about ALL of that cheap-oh 7.62x39 ammo is violently corrosive. It is also not very accurate except as the exception which proves the rule.

IMO, you would be better off to shoot something less, save your brass, and shoot well. You get more fun out of HITTING a tin can at 100 yards with a single round than you do out of SPRAYING 50 rounds in its general direction.... and NOT hitting it.

But that's my way of thinking.

I might be wrong.
 
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"...they are genuine World War 2 German rifles..." Sometimes.
"...reccomend to a beginner?..." No. 4 Mk I* Lee-Enfield. Don't buy one without proof of good headspace. Mind you, the felt recoil takes some getting used to.
 
If you want a really good rifle, get yourself an M1 Garand.

If I can hit a 2'x4' target at 1000 meters with iron sights and a bone stock Garand, you can sure have fun at whatever distance your range allows. 8 Rounds are legal in the Garand as well, which is a big bonus.

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you're forgetting he said he was a BEGINNER- that lets the garand out b/c of the gas system- unless he can get SOMEONE TO MENTOR
him - the lee enfield and the mauser, esp in 308, or possibly one of the brazilians, springfields or eddystone/remmy/p14/17 enfields are better choices for the beginner-
 
Or a Mosin nagant 91/30. 7.62x54r surplus is a rather cheap milsurp to shoot. Supply of 54r is a little short but more should be on the way.
 
Great to see so many suggestions in such a short time, I really appreciate the advice!

Because I am a beginner I am a little skeptical when it comes to cleaning guns and making my own ammo. I have had some awful experiences with disassembling paintball guns (anybody know how a valve becomes oval in a round chamber?) and I have never taken a gun apart, so I do want to keep the complexity to a minimum.

Really my favourite weapons had to be Garand and K98, with the mosin being my least favourite. But to be honest I would be happy to have any of them, as I may end up having them all anyways :p.

I also thought about getting a .22 as my first. I may be young, but I am not stupid and I would take the time to learn to shoot first if that is the smarter thing to do. I have no idea what the 'flinch' is you guys are talking about. I'm guessing it is a natural reaction to the big bang/kick you are expecting to hear when you shoot larger guns?
 
Yes, a natural reaction to the noise and physical recoil of the rifle. You flinch (anticipate) at the moment of pulling the trigger which is about the worst habit to get into. Your accuracy will go out the window, and once you have the habit it will follow you around (like herpes) and cause you to flinch when shooting smaller/lighter recoiling calibers.

Most people will recommend a .22 for two reasons, you can practice lots for a little cash, and you can develop good technique without developing a flinch. At least after shooting lots with a .22 if you buy an enfield or a K98 and you start flinching, you can identify your problem and fix it. It's easier to work your way up than it is to start at the top.
 
I'm agreeing with the .22 crowd. Way back in the day once I learned trigger control and breathing on an air rifle I stepped up to a .22 Mauser LR. This baby has history of her own, having been made pre-ww2 and "liberated" from a sports store.

But getting back to the point, you can find several .22 rifles in the military surplus section that are actually military trainers. I think this would be the best choice for you as it would give you the experience of starting with something smaller, as well as fulfilling the historical aspect. Here are a couple examples:
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=431484&highlight=trainer
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=421519&highlight=trainer
Don't discount all of this .22 advice. You will come out a much better skilled marksmen for it.
 
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