Who is correct Book or manufacturer
- Thread starter Canucklehead67
- Start date
if you're using varget, use varget data provided it's reasonable- say within -1-2 grains- the bullet manufacturers use a " collection" of data from various sources, provided you use THEIR bullets - I have 3 reloading manuals and I don't "trust" any of them, but work up my own loads using a ladder- ie cci primer, cci magnum primer, ww748 powder and a Remington 180 grain spire point- then go shoot 20 rounds, see how it groups and ck it with a chronograph
go back and ck the recipes posted here and elsewhere - I c that you have an ar10- there might be even caveats for that- there is for the m14- no bullets heavier than 173 gr- I don't have any data for varget, and some folks tell me it's too slow for the 308
go back and ck the recipes posted here and elsewhere - I c that you have an ar10- there might be even caveats for that- there is for the m14- no bullets heavier than 173 gr- I don't have any data for varget, and some folks tell me it's too slow for the 308
+2, proper ladder method and you can't really go wrong. Start low, no shortcuts. My ar-10 type rifle likes the lower end of the charge weight, and 155gr projectiles, especially after I changed barrels. Was the data for the same projectile or just the same weight?
I've always looked at multiple sources, and made a decision from there.
For example (I'm making these numbers up), Hodgdon may say 42-45 grains
Hornady, 41-43
Nosler 42-44.5
Lyman 40-43.5
I'd then consider if ANY of these take in to account the type of firearm (IE an AR10 VS a bolt gun and I'd lend more credence to that load data) or are they all for bolt guns? and I'd probably start at ~41 grains working my way up, expecting 45 (which is listed by hodgdons) to potentially be a little stout for a semi (but it may not be, your mileage may vary). Before doing any reloading, you need to make sure you understand what the signs of overpressure are, and you need to be willing to look at every case fired during load development. Sure you have some redundancy in your eyes, but personally, I've grown attached to having 2.
For example (I'm making these numbers up), Hodgdon may say 42-45 grains
Hornady, 41-43
Nosler 42-44.5
Lyman 40-43.5
I'd then consider if ANY of these take in to account the type of firearm (IE an AR10 VS a bolt gun and I'd lend more credence to that load data) or are they all for bolt guns? and I'd probably start at ~41 grains working my way up, expecting 45 (which is listed by hodgdons) to potentially be a little stout for a semi (but it may not be, your mileage may vary). Before doing any reloading, you need to make sure you understand what the signs of overpressure are, and you need to be willing to look at every case fired during load development. Sure you have some redundancy in your eyes, but personally, I've grown attached to having 2.
^^^ This
When loading for an AR-10 start with service rifle data (Hornady manual has a separate section) and keep your projectile weights below 180gr. The heavier the projectile the harder it is on the action as it will cycle harder. Also use a slightly slower burn rate powder for the bullet weight if possible, you need to consider the gas system requirements when loading for a semi auto.
You don't need to run the heaviest, longest, best BC projectiles in a rifle like this, you're looking for reliable cycling and feeding more than 1000 yard accuracy so I personally prefer 168gr and occasionally 175gr for my semi auto's but never heavier than that.
Depending on what barrel your rifle has try to be reasonable with your accuracy expectations, sub moa is definitely achievable in an Ar-10 but if you have a cheap rack grade barrel be realistic and don't expect to see 1/2 moa groups, if you find a good load that feeds, ejects and gives you around an inch at 100yds be happy and enjoy shooting. If on the other hand you have a match grade stainless barrel then you may eventually be able to achieve consistent sub moa groups.
Both are correct. They show the data for THEIR rifle. They are not attempting to suggest the loads for YOUR rifle. That is your job.
You have to start with the START load in the book, and work up to find what works well in your rifle.
You are looking for 2 things. 100% reliable cycling and best accuracy.
The first test could be the START load and then 5 rounds each in 0.5 gr increments to the book MAX. Shoot these as a quick orientation, to rule out loads that won't cycle, find the powder charge worth exploring for accuracy and to find out where MAX is for your rifle. Check primers, etc, as you work up and be prepared to bring some hot ammo home.
START LOADS MAX
155 gr - 36.0 gr 45.0
168gr - 33.0 44.0
180 gr - 32.0 43.0
190 gr - 31.0 41.0
After your test, select the promising load, and load 10 of that, with 10 more plus and minus 0.3 gr and test again.
Your brass should all be the same.
You have to start with the START load in the book, and work up to find what works well in your rifle.
You are looking for 2 things. 100% reliable cycling and best accuracy.
The first test could be the START load and then 5 rounds each in 0.5 gr increments to the book MAX. Shoot these as a quick orientation, to rule out loads that won't cycle, find the powder charge worth exploring for accuracy and to find out where MAX is for your rifle. Check primers, etc, as you work up and be prepared to bring some hot ammo home.
START LOADS MAX
155 gr - 36.0 gr 45.0
168gr - 33.0 44.0
180 gr - 32.0 43.0
190 gr - 31.0 41.0
After your test, select the promising load, and load 10 of that, with 10 more plus and minus 0.3 gr and test again.
Your brass should all be the same.
it looks like you need to do some research, so that you can understand why both sources are correct for their rifles and components. Since you are not using their rifles, or their lots of components, neither is correct for you. Compare multiple sources, select a starting load, based on those sources, and work up a load while watching for pressure signs. If you don't know how to recognize pressure signs, you need to do some research to learn how to recognize them.
TBH, with the calibers I load, I find Hornady loads some of the more conservative loads, Hodgdon's to be the highest, and everyone else in between somewhere with Nosler closer to the "average"
Wow thanks everyone for all the info, some great stuff !!!!
FYI I did a step up ladder load, I went with the Varget data, started at 42 up to 45.
Lower loads had cycle issues good groups medium loads cycled well but grouping was terrible
higher loads both cycled and grouped well. just went through all the brass and no issues.
Again thanks to everyone for chiming in on this, really appreciate the offerings !!!!
FYI I did a step up ladder load, I went with the Varget data, started at 42 up to 45.
Lower loads had cycle issues good groups medium loads cycled well but grouping was terrible
higher loads both cycled and grouped well. just went through all the brass and no issues.
Again thanks to everyone for chiming in on this, really appreciate the offerings !!!!
