Why are my groups doing this

you are likely adjusting your body position and the rifle.. the recoil impulse of the rifle is getting different resistance from your body halfway through completing your group. always get directly behind your rifle, and have it seated in the same position of chest/shoulder. If you are using a bipod, have a consistent preload against the legs.
 
Based on the single 5 shot group shown, I think easiest explanation is random / chance / statistics. Shoot 4 x 10 shot groups and see how many touching pairs and triplets there will be, and what realistic precision capability is. From statistics, one instance of 5 is not a very robust sampling from which to draw conclusions. 3 or better 4 instances of 10 is more certain, especially if shot round-robin (1st shot target #1, 2nd shot target #2, 3rd shot target #3, 4th shot target #4, 5th shot back to target #1 and so on). I confirm sighting in on my hunting rifles with 3 rounds on three targets, shot that way. I recently had a sported 6.5x55 Swede that first two holes touched at 100 yards, then proceeded to walk the "group" low and to the right, finishing up about 12" right and 4" low with the 20th shot, compared to the first two. Something wonky with it, but not that the first couple shots would have showed.
 
Caramel might have something there. Is the barrel free-floated? If so, could it bind somewhere on the stock? If it is free-floated, I would check when it is cold, and after shooting, when it is warm to find out if there are changes in the two cases. I would also check the torque of the action screws.
 
tazzman said:
Caramel might have something there. Is the barrel free-floated? If so, could it bind somewhere on the stock? If it is free-floated, I would check when it is cold, and after shooting, when it is warm to find out if there are changes in the two cases. I would also check the torque of the action screws.
Click to expand...

Stag 10 is semi, no action screws, did you properly torque the barrel? Like. Tighten, loosen tighten, loosen with grease? This would pre stretch the threads and would let you get a constant torque and good lock on the threads, when your barrel heats up it should help with POI flyers since there should be less movement on pre stretched threads....that's what I do and how I justify it anyways....
 
Diagonal groups are usually bad posture. When you breath the rifle should go up and down, if it moves at a diagonal, it means your either twisted up or holding the rifle crooked. you need yo adjust your position

Quick tips for correcting yourself (this is for right hand, reverse for left hand)
Diagonal groups with the group string up to the right is trigger control (snatching or palm twisting) or posture/hold
Diagonal groups string down to the right is posture,
Vertical stringing is breathing
Split groups is a change in position
 
Last edited:
Potashminer said:
Based on the single 5 shot group shown, I think easiest explanation is random / chance / statistics. Shoot 4 x 10 shot groups and see how many touching pairs and triplets there will be, and what realistic precision capability is. From statistics, one instance of 5 is not a very robust sampling from which to draw conclusions. 3 or better 4 instances of 10 is more certain, especially if shot round-robin (1st shot target #1, 2nd shot target #2, 3rd shot target #3, 4th shot target #4, 5th shot back to target #1 and so on). I confirm sighting in on my hunting rifles with 3 rounds on three targets, shot that way. I recently had a sported 6.5x55 Swede that first two holes touched at 100 yards, then proceeded to walk the "group" low and to the right, finishing up about 12" right and 4" low with the 20th shot, compared to the first two. Something wonky with it, but not that the first couple shots would have showed.
Click to expand...

This right here. If that size group is reproduced over multiple 5-10 round groups, it's simply the accuracy potential of your rifle with that load. Just because 3 rounds touch doesn't mean that's the accuracy potential of the rifle and the other rounds are "flyers" or something is up with your rifle. That's just how tight it shoots. Expecting 1/2 Moa with a factory Stag barrel is a bit optimistic...
 
I was shooting off a sled.
I’m capable of shooting sub MOA groups, at least I used to be:)

What I’m finding odd is that it’s been doing this since I started testing powder weights.
Always get the first two touching and then the next 3 touching, only separated by an 1/2 inch.

I’ve torqued barrel to proper specs using proper procedure.

I haven’t tried tweaking the max load yet .

I could understand a flyer due to barrel heat up or improper shooting tecnic, but it’s always first two touching,then a small POI change and next three touching.

I guess I’ll get a ten end mag and try shooting first one random and next five for group.

Also the barrel only cost me a touch over $100 off the EE,
So maybe I’m expecting to much from it.
 
If the shooting form and support is good, then we look for patterns... if the first 2 ALWAYS touch... and then the next ones form another group, I would suggest a barrel concern.

Easiest way to test this is to shoot a group and track each shot and location. Then shot a 2nd group with enough wait to fill that mag. If this is a thermal problem, the 2nd group will stabilise and you will see a decent group.

If the pattern persists, first two in 1 group and the next shots in another group, maybe it is something shifting like a forend contact, scope mount or scope rattling inside.

finally, how is your loading? Consider components like brass prep and charge consistency. Maybe another type of powder... some surplus powder can be irratic.

Whatever repeats, we can likely diagnose.\

Jerry
 
So far I’ve only used Varget.
44.5 and 46.5 shoot identical groups.
Brass is all same headstamp, trimmed to min length,powder is dropped with a trickler
The scope is a Bushnell 3-12 LRHS.

I’ll check all the mounts ,bolts etc.

I have a couple lbs of VN 540, maybe I’ll try that?
 
Try a 7 shots group instead of 5, from a cold barrel if your 2 first shots hit together and the next 5 ones cluster tight, temp
barrel change is the difference. Repete 3 times and see if there is a pattern.

On this target the 5 groups were shoot with one minute between each shot, you can figure out by looking at it,what group was first.:)

SAM_4397_zpsc8f6g5lf.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom