chrisward3
Regular
- Location
- Ottawa, ON
sorry if this is a repost. but cmonnnnn....
Why Bullpups are SICKKKKK!
- Thread starter chrisward3
- Start date
hugehodge83
Regular
- Location
- Halifax NS
I dunno man... I gotta say I love the look of bullpups... but in this one you are comparing a hunting knife to a scalpal.
A bullpup is great for mounted troops and for shooting at range. (Hunting knife)
The LMT is a CQB rifle... made to be short with adjustable length of pull. (Scalpal)
I would choose both at different times for different uses. That being said... I definatly have an addiction to unobtanium
A bullpup is great for mounted troops and for shooting at range. (Hunting knife)
The LMT is a CQB rifle... made to be short with adjustable length of pull. (Scalpal)
I would choose both at different times for different uses. That being said... I definatly have an addiction to unobtanium
thats whats great about the bull pup it can be used cqb because it doesn't stick out like the long c7 ,its over all length is the same as the lmt.
in terms of actual combat the rifle u get has a set trigger u can not adjust the trigger unless ur a weapons tech and they have to have the trigger set to a curtain weight . and when ur gettin shot at trigger pull is the last thing on ur mind.
bull pup is the swiss army knife does it all ....... only if they could get one to look good.
aug is probably the best looking to me but thats all subjective.
in terms of actual combat the rifle u get has a set trigger u can not adjust the trigger unless ur a weapons tech and they have to have the trigger set to a curtain weight . and when ur gettin shot at trigger pull is the last thing on ur mind.
bull pup is the swiss army knife does it all ....... only if they could get one to look good.
aug is probably the best looking to me but thats all subjective.
All depends on the rifle and the user, I've gotten mag changes on the Tavor down to close to that of an AR.
It depends how you use it - notice the Length of Pull of the AUG is as long, if not longer, than the AR with the Somop stock( which is already longer than normal)
sorry if this is a repost. but cmonnnnn....
angryeyebrows
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Oscar Mike
Bull pups are pretty sick. The reach of that 20" barrel in a very small package make them useful in real world applications. Although GT is right....the length of pull on some is ridiculous. That AUG is probably the worst rifle I've ever picked up for length of pull. Especially when you are wearing armor!
Yep yep. The stock on the AR is extended too far. The fixed LOP on bullpups is bad for business. The inability to switch shoulders without significantly altering your hold or eating brass is also bad for business. The vast majority of combat is done inside 100 yards for the urban work, the benefits of a 20" barrel are negligible. Again, shot placement is far more important than velocity or calibre. We haven't even touched on the difficult manual of arms encountered in bullpups.
Both rifles have their roles, you choose the right tool for the job.
TDC
Both rifles have their roles, you choose the right tool for the job.
TDC
Gunnerlove
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver Island
I have never seen anyone change mags with a bull pup as fast as one can with an AR.
True for the jungles of Vietnam, not true for Iraq (100-300) or the Stan (300-500).
According to US Army.
CatfishSteve
CGN Regular
- Location
- in front of computer
Bullpups are the future if you ask me. Most modern bullpups have gotten past most of the traditional problems associated with the design such as mushy triggers and some are ambidextrous . As to those who suggest the rifles in question have different roles I would have to disagree. The non bull pups here are limited in their roles because of either limited barrel length or long overall length. It's not practical for the soldier in the field to have two rifles. As a standard issue rifle gimmie a bullpup anyday
At 300-500 you're pushing the limits of the soldier. Short of kicking doors all day long a 14.5" or ideally a 16" barrel would be the best overall length. The advantages of the bullpup are lost when considered the negatives associated with the design.
Fixed LOP
Not ambi friendly
Difficult reloads
High offset(on most bullpups)
Difficult and time consuming manual of arms
Aside from the above I don't feel overly comfortable with the violent events of firing taking place a few millimeters from my face.
TDC
If the rifle isn't 100% ambi it is severely limiting. Try running a lefty bullpup as a right handed shooter. The fixed LOP is the real killer. Its taken big army both here and in the US a long time to finally realize that adjustable stocks are for proper fit, not storage. Fixed LOP rifles are dead.
As for role specific firearms. The 10.5" LMT above is ideally suited for shorter range engagements. I never said, nor would I ever condone such a short barrel as suitable for most roles. I prefer 16" barrels as the sweet spot capable of adequately performing in 90% of situations and/or roles. That being said, I don't think barrel length plays any role in determining how lethal the guy is who's trying to kill you. Getting shot from a 10.5" or 20" barrel still hurts. I doubt anyone could distinguish the difference. Maximizing the terminal performance of your system and the ammo associated is always a good idea. Banking on these attributes at the cost of ones manual of arms and/or ease of use is a non starter.
TDC
As with most military info on CGN context is often forgotten:
-about 95% of the worlds soldiers are never trained to fire proficiently support hand so being ambi is moot so long as the rifle can be setup for the soldier such as the Tavor. This has far reaching ramifications. when under stress people do what they need to think the least about so the 95% will shoot primary.
-90% of soldiers are right handed and many military orgs still train people to shoot right handed despite their left hand dominance.
-Unlike North America most of the world has high population density which means fighting in close quarters and urban environments add to that most modern infantry units don't conduct a lot of dismounted operations and when they do generally it is after they have been delivered by a vehicle.
Bullpups just offer a lot of logistical flexibility on the ground for the infantryman and commanders. The real world limitations are overshadowed by the real world flexibility, Bullpups are just as useful at 300m as they are @2m. For many they just make sense.
LOP is a concern with all the modern battle rattle but that is being addressed in the newer designs, The AUG is an old design, developed around the same time the M16 was coming into full service, you can't hold it up to a shorty AR carbine and pick them apart as they are two rifles with two different purposes and contexts.
-about 95% of the worlds soldiers are never trained to fire proficiently support hand so being ambi is moot so long as the rifle can be setup for the soldier such as the Tavor. This has far reaching ramifications. when under stress people do what they need to think the least about so the 95% will shoot primary.
-90% of soldiers are right handed and many military orgs still train people to shoot right handed despite their left hand dominance.
-Unlike North America most of the world has high population density which means fighting in close quarters and urban environments add to that most modern infantry units don't conduct a lot of dismounted operations and when they do generally it is after they have been delivered by a vehicle.
Bullpups just offer a lot of logistical flexibility on the ground for the infantryman and commanders. The real world limitations are overshadowed by the real world flexibility, Bullpups are just as useful at 300m as they are @2m. For many they just make sense.
LOP is a concern with all the modern battle rattle but that is being addressed in the newer designs, The AUG is an old design, developed around the same time the M16 was coming into full service, you can't hold it up to a shorty AR carbine and pick them apart as they are two rifles with two different purposes and contexts.
CatfishSteve
CGN Regular
- Location
- in front of computer
