Why get a LMT over stag over norc?

Tom_Swift said:
Laugh2

Quiet surprisingly you'll be hard pressed to find something made in China in my apartment. Almost all my t-shirts are made in either Canada or the United States, all of which far better quality than most of the t-shirts I've owned in the past made in China.
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You are either very prudent in your shopping, own very very few items, or do not read the label.

How "Foxconn" are your electronics for example?
 
djmay71 said:
Buy a model of AR that you find suits your needs and wants. That being said, don't go overboard and buy the most expensive AR you can get- because you know what's worse than an anti-gun liberal? - Being a GunNut, who owns a ridicuously expensive rifle and can't afford to shoot it.
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If that's the case, the guy couldn't afford to shoot the rifle in the first place. We've only talking a difference of approximately $700. If you shoot much at all $700 isn't going to buy you a whole lot of ammo.

Personally, I agree 100% with AlexF's comments. However, I think the OP should educate himeslef first before he buys anything.

As the owner of 2 cheap AR15 and 1 quality AR15, I can tell you this:
simply get the best AR15 that you can afford now. In the long term, the quality AR15 will be cheaper to own (really).
You'll end up shooting so much 223 that the price of the gun will have been forgotten in 10 years (10 000 - 30 000 rounds later) but you'll still be paying for the ammo.
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http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=684596&page=2

All I see are threads like this in regards to Norinco unfortunately. From all the Norinco's I have seen thus far there was always something wrong with it, Could i manage with them in a real gun fight??? I would say Yes...but I certainly would not try it, unless it was the only option.

For range fun it is fine, the problem is you are taking a risk with it, you might get a good one, or might get a bad one. For the extra money I see people putting into them I would just save for and extra few months and get a LMT or Stag.

As for NEA, I can not comment, I have little experience with them.

Also I buy enough stuff from china already and when things break down I know there is no warranty and usually I just have to replace it, kinda what I see Norc users doing all the time. It seems to just cost more anyways...When Tax's are in and all is said and done it just adds up to the point you may have just bought more of what you really wanted. The price is the most tangible pro of the whole thing, if all you want is to say I own an AR, then that will be the quickest and easiest to swipe the credit card and there she is sitting your gun safe.

For a dealer though selling more magpuls stuff and upgrade parts.... the Norinco is a "win win situation" so you are making the dealers more money in many circumstances.

If i were to gamble i would just buy a NEA instead of a norc, or just buy a gun of the EE instead. In the end to each there own...
 
omegaboost said:
Do it once, do it right.

Im sure the LMT will last longer and give you much better service life than the norc. Not to mention if ever one day your life depends on it (God forbid), I definitely wouldnt trust the norc. At least you know the LMT is battle proven quality.

Also, if you get the norc, you'll always envy the LMT. Its like getting the lesser model of a car. If you buy a civic but wanted the SI in the first place, you'll end up regretting it later and always wanting it.
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I have the Norc clone of the Sig P226. Does the Norc shoot ok? For what I do, yes. Is there a difference? Absolutely. It was what I could afford, I bought it. No regrets, it's better than I thought it would be. And when I can afford it, I'm going to replace it with a Sig.

And over-charge for the Norc on the EE. :D
 
It's funny how people always seem to think Norinco doesn't manufacture reliable firearms that are durable. Everyone always seems to mention the steel used on their 1911's. How is Norinco not battle proven? Norinco Ak's, Ar's, etc are used and operating all over including Afghanistan where the conditions are the worst. What kind of maintenace do you think these firearms are seeing? It's unfortunate that they are being supplied to the Taliban.
 
Maintenance is another factor that seems to be ignored. If you treat your rifles poorly, they will fail on you no matter the make or model.

I've only owned two makes of AR15s. Colt and Norinco. Honestly, both makes shot just fine and groups were very similar between the makes. That said, I elected to keep the Colts. The CQ-311 I had for a while shot wonderfully tight groups with 55gr bullets. It was a gem, but the A1 style iron sights were a no-go for me. So I patched together a Colt R6700 (upper and lower from different locations). It's a rifle I will never let go of. Finish, function and interchangability of parts is head and shoulders above the CQ-311.

As for the carbines, I've own about 5 different LE6920s and I've had my hands on a couple Norc CQAs. Main difference is that the finish can be quite rough on Norcs and there are occasional issues with aftermarket parts not fitting quite right. What it all boils down to is that the higher end guns work just the same as the low end guns. You're not paying for results, your paying for fit, finish, durability and history. If those things are important, then get a North American AR15. If not, then get a cheap norc. Your scores on paper aren't going to notice the difference.
 
Pistolwhiptricks said:
It's funny how people always seem to think Norinco doesn't manufacture reliable firearms that are durable. Everyone always seems to mention the steel used on their 1911's. How is Norinco not battle proven? Norinco Ak's, Ar's, etc are used and operating all over including Afghanistan where the conditions are the worst. What kind of maintenace do you think these firearms are seeing? It's unfortunate that they are being supplied to the Taliban.
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Nobody claims most Norinco's are not functional - they are. But they aren't made to be as interchangeable as most brands. Anyone who's ever tried to fit US-made hanguards to a Norinco AR knows all to well that they are not dimensionally in spec.
 
Leibermuster said:
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=684596&page=2

All I see are threads like this in regards to Norinco unfortunately. From all the Norinco's I have seen thus far there was always something wrong with it, Could i manage with them in a real gun fight??? I would say Yes...but I certainly would not try it, unless it was the only option.

For range fun it is fine, the problem is you are taking a risk with it, you might get a good one, or might get a bad one. For the extra money I see people putting into them I would just save for and extra few months and get a LMT or Stag.

As for NEA, I can not comment, I have little experience with them.

Also I buy enough stuff from china already and when things break down I know there is no warranty and usually I just have to replace it, kinda what I see Norc users doing all the time. It seems to just cost more anyways...When Tax's are in and all is said and done it just adds up to the point you may have just bought more of what you really wanted. The price is the most tangible pro of the whole thing, if all you want is to say I own an AR, then that will be the quickest and easiest to swipe the credit card and there she is sitting your gun safe.

For a dealer though selling more magpuls stuff and upgrade parts.... the Norinco is a "win win situation" so you are making the dealers more money in many circumstances.

If i were to gamble i would just buy a NEA instead of a norc, or just buy a gun of the EE instead. In the end to each there own...
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If you had to manage in a gun fight? Do you live in Somalia?

If your life depends on it, sure pony up to the ferrari of AR's, if your local range depends on it, the Norc works just fine.

I find the "theoretical" go to gun debates hystarical. If SHTF in Canada, you would most likely be far away from your firearms that are trigger locked/secured in a locking gun case seperate from their ammo.

As has been stated already, Norinco makes guns for many millitary/LE organizations around the globe. The company actually makes a lot more than low cost AR/SIG/1911 clones... they make tanks, aircraft, and much more

From Norinco:
As a conglomerate integrating R&D, manufacture, marketing and services, NORINCO has been continuously developing up-to-date high-tech defense products. It has demonstrated the strong capabilities in providing customers with systems and solutions in the fields of precision strike, amphibious assault, long-range suppression, anti-aircraft & anti-missile, information & night vision, high-effect destruction, anti-terrorism & anti-riot, and small arms.
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I am not advocating on behalf of Norc, buy according to your needs/wants/conscience. If you don't want to support Chinese companies, that is a valid reason to avoid Norinco. If you want to buy Canadian to keep money here, that is a great reason to pick up an NEA. If you want to buy a Stag or a LMT because you want the best or just because you WANT it, then by all means buy it, they are fantastic products. That being said we can only use them at the range and they all do the same thing, shoot paper. So if the OP wants to know what to buy my advice is to buy what you can afford, and shoot the hell out of it. Enjoy it. If you don't like AR's, sell it. If you do, either upgrade it, build one or buy one with the features you determine you want in the future.

Also AFAIK, the Stag, Bushmaster, LMT all lack Magpul products from factory, so I don't see how you can claim Vendors are selling $700 ARs because they are going to make the big profit on the $20 magpul accssories vs selling a $1,400 AR hahaha
 
AlexF said:
As the owner of 2 cheap AR15 and 1 quality AR15, I can tell you this:
simply get the best AR15 that you can afford now. In the long term, the quality AR15 will be cheaper to own (really).
You'll end up shooting so much 223 that the price of the gun will have been forgotten in 10 years (10 000 - 30 000 rounds later) but you'll still be paying for the ammo.

Life is too short (to be cheap on guns).

Alex
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Exactly. The difference in price is really minimal when you add in the cost of ammunition. The price spread may be a month or two of shooting - a minuscule amount of the rifles life. Might as well shoot that ammo with a quality rifle.
 
c0ntract said:
If you had to manage in a gun fight? Do you live in Somalia?

If your life depends on it, sure pony up to the ferrari of AR's, if your local range depends on it, the Norc works just fine.

I find the "theoretical" go to gun debates hystarical. If SHTF in Canada, you would most likely be far away from your firearms that are trigger locked/secured in a locking gun case seperate from their ammo.

As has been stated already, Norinco makes guns for many millitary/LE organizations around the globe. The company actually makes a lot more than low cost AR/SIG/1911 clones... they make tanks, aircraft, and much more

From Norinco:


I am not advocating on behalf of Norc, buy according to your needs/wants/conscience. If you don't want to support Chinese companies, that is a valid reason to avoid Norinco. If you want to buy Canadian to keep money here, that is a great reason to pick up an NEA. If you want to buy a Stag or a LMT because you want the best or just because you WANT it, then by all means buy it, they are fantastic products. That being said we can only use them at the range and they all do the same thing, shoot paper. So if the OP wants to know what to buy my advice is to buy what you can afford, and shoot the hell out of it. Enjoy it. If you don't like AR's, sell it. If you do, either upgrade it, build one or buy one with the features you determine you want in the future.

Also AFAIK, the Stag, Bushmaster, LMT all lack Magpul products from factory, so I don't see how you can claim Vendors are selling $700 ARs because they are going to make the big profit on the $20 magpul accssories vs selling a $1,400 AR hahaha
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holy crap norc actually makes anti aircrafts as well as nvg stuff. Now the question is, how much for the nvg? :D
 
Reliability is only a real world gun fighting issue until you have spent hundreds (thousands) of dollars to get to a match where one stoppage will drop you from 1st to 10th.

When standing at the wailing wall it becomes a recreational issue.
 
Main difference is in quality control. All LMT bolts and barrels are high pressure tested and magnetic partical inspected. Stags are batch tested. And, from what I hear, I would suspect Norcs have no quality control what so ever.
 
AlexF said:
As the owner of 2 cheap AR15 and 1 quality AR15, I can tell you this:
simply get the best AR15 that you can afford now. In the long term, the quality AR15 will be cheaper to own (really).
You'll end up shooting so much 223 that the price of the gun will have been forgotten in 10 years (10 000 - 30 000 rounds later) but you'll still be paying for the ammo.

Life is too short (to be cheap on guns).

Alex
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Bingo
Have fun with what ever you have.
I always seem to buy better then I can afford and never regreted it.
Have seen many good Norcs but have seen many bad ones also.
Loved my Stag and plan to buy more.
LMT that I got to shoot in the states was great too.

Have fun and see what you like.
I regret every gun I ever sold.
 
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Mirk said:
Main difference is in quality control. All LMT bolts and barrels are high pressure tested and magnetic particle inspected. Stags are batch tested. And, from what I hear, I would suspect Norcs have no quality control what so ever.
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Related thread:

New M-14 range report FAIL
<http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=702246>
 
1 thread of an M14 failure isn't indicative of a whole line of Norinco AR failures. They're not even the same gun. Any manufacturer has had threads pop up on the internet of their product failing...as an example I just found this about a Colt http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/20/colt-ar-15-kaboom/ Lets not feed the fire. I haven't had any problems with my Norc AR (nor my M305...nor my NP22). Don't get me wrong and think I don't like the better higher end AR's (I do...and I own them)...but a Norc is fine for what it is (and at the price it is).
 
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