why is all bulk ammo FMJ?

Fixit

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I can understand surplus being all FMJ, but why do manufactures usually only sell FMJ ammo instead of SP or HP ammo? is it cheeper or something?

i think it sucks to have a stash of X# of 1000 round boxes of ammo that you cant use for hunting.
 
FMJ bullets are likely the least expensive to make of any jacketed bullet.

FMJ may not be suitable for hunting, but can be cheaper for paper punching, so that more expensive expanding bullets can be saved for sighting in and hunting.
 
It's because most cheap bulk ammo even if it's not surplus is produced as production overruns of military ball. Military ball has to be FMJ ( I understand per the Geneva convention, but I'm not really sure about this, since i'm told snipers use BTHP without any repecussions on themselves.) FMJ is probably cheapest becasue they produce it in such huge quantities for military purposes that the cost of setting up the production line is spread over much larger quantities. It also appears to me that ammo manufacturers buy their hunting bullets from specialized bullet manufacturers (like say Nosler or Speer) so there has to be a margin ( profit) component to the price they pay these manufacturers. That and smaller quantities would explain the higher unit price.
 
SP's and HP's aren't government surplus. You can order any ammo by the case through your local gun shop. Be prepared to pay up front.
 
FMJ's are mostly used by the army because they're cheap and have a better chance of piercing armour than HP's or SP's. also from my own experience they tend to drop less at a given distance making the hit probability higher in combat.
 
A crate of 1000 .45 Auto fmj's are about 400 bucks...... I wonder what a crate of HP's would be from the same manufacturer.... 550?
 
9guns, FMJs aren't really cheaper to produce. They just make more profit because they sell them in the billions and hunting bullets in the millions. Cost is about the same for both at the factory to produce but because of the quantities and change over costs to various hunting calibres and weights the cost is higher. If the military was buying billions of rounds of soft point ammunition in any given calibre, they would be cheap as well. Bullets today are cheap, when you compare the quality we get.
 
Actually, the military use of "ball" has little to do with armor piercing as a rule and more to do with the Hague Accords (not the Geneva Convention).

As per the First Hague Conference, 1899:

The Undersigned, Plenipotentiaries of the Powers represented at the International Peace Conference at The Hague, duly authorized to that effect by their Governments,

Inspired by the sentiments which found expression in the Declaration of St. Petersburg of the 29th November (11th December), 1868,

Declare as follows:

"The Contracting Parties agree to abstain from the use of bullets which expand or flatten easily in the human body, such as bullets with a hard envelope which does not entirely cover the core, or is pierced with incisions."

The present Declaration is only binding for the Contracting Powers in the case of a war between two or more of them.

It shall cease to be binding from the time when, in a war between the Contracting Parties, one of the belligerents is joined by a non-Contracting Power.


The US is not actually a signatory of this accord, but tends to respect it as an informal matter of military policy.

Further, one accord to which the US is a signatory is the Hague Convention IV of 1907 - Article 23(e), which states (in part):


…it is especially forbidden -
To employ arms, projectiles, or material (sic) calculated to cause unnecessary suffering...


I put 'sic' because 'material' should actually be either 'materials' for consistent parallel plurality with the sentence, or 'materiel' for further correctness in military jargon of the time.

And, as covered very nicely on this page:

http://www.thegunzone.com/hague.html

The use of frangible ammunition has been authorized when engaging "non-state-affiliated" forces, such as insurgents in Afghanistan. The Sierra MatchKing projectile, which many may recognize as a jacketed hollow-point (albeit a very, very small hollow point), has also been authorized for use since its design is due to an accuracy requirement rather than intentional frangibility. However, with the earlier ruling that even purpose-built frangible ammunition may be used against "non-state-affiliated" combatants, this point is somewhat moot. However, it does hold water when, in the future, such occasion arose to engage an enemy's standing military forces or affiliated reserves.

At any rate, the long and the short of it is that - and ask any of our resident bullet-swagers who are on the forum, which doesn't describe me at present time but is something I have planned for the future - when creating jackets and complete projectiles, the open-bottomed FMJ is king when it comes to overall tooling simplicity.

-M
 
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