Why so few short barreled bolt action hunting rifles??

rral22 said:
The noise thing is actually quite serious. One shot can do permanent damage. If your ears are ringing after a single shot without protection, you can assume you have some permanent hearing loss. Maybe it isn't much from one shot, but they ALL accumulate over your lifetime.

I have a .300 Win. that I have often thought about shortening because the velocity difference is not an issue. The only factor that stops me is increased muzzle blast. I just can't afford any more hearing loss, and that 24 inch barrel is already too loud for hearing safety without protection.
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I never suggested hearing loss is not a serious issue.

What I'm saying, is that in a relative sense, the difference in hearing loss between a handful of shots per year without protection, between, say, a 24 inch barreled rifle and a 20 inch barreled rifle is small.

Do you think that in a lifetime of hunting, men who carried and shot longer barrels will have better hearing than men who carried short barrels?
 
I'm all for safety and protecting our ears, but the truth of the matter is we live in a day and age of information and most of us are over the top careful about everything. I have a few uncles that are in there 70s and 80s that have shot more ammo than probably all of us on this site combined (I'm exaggerating a bit of course), all without hearing protection and they have better hearing than most.

I wouldn't worry about the few shots during the hunting season. Protect your ears at the range and you will be fine. Heck, there are day to day noises that do more long term damage to your ears than the yearly few hunting shots.
 
I always preferred a short, light rifle over over a heavy full length job. I did a lot of still hunting when alone. So I shortened the barrel to 19 inches and went to a synthetic stock. My chrono indicated a loss of about 60 fps velocity in 3" of barrel. The muzzle blast did increase but the game didn't care.
I used a low powered optical sight(yes I could've used irons but I found the optic faster) in light weight mounts which gave me less weight to carry. It was very slick and pointed like a dream. Those few ounces shaved meant a lot by the days end.
When I started hunting from a fixed stand I gradually went back to a heavier optic with a bigger objective that yielded better light transmission at days end. The weight meant less as I only walked to the stand and sat down, I didn't pack it all day long.
I have noticed that the fixed stand type of hunting has increased drastically and I assumed the longer heavier guns/bigger optics was a natural result of this.
Just my 2 cents.
 
aikidoforever said:
I'm all for safety and protecting our ears, but the truth of the matter is we live in a day and age of information and most of us are over the top careful about everything. I have a few uncles that are in there 70s and 80s that have shot more ammo than probably all of us on this site combined (I'm exaggerating a bit of course), all without hearing protection and they have better hearing than most.

I wouldn't worry about the few shots during the hunting season. Protect your ears at the range and you will be fine. Heck, there are day to day noises that do more long term damage to your ears than the yearly few hunting shots.
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The only people I hear arguing this line tend to be young, to not have tinnitus, to have not yet noticed their own hearing loss, and to have uncles whose hearing has never really been tested.

It isn't that I am "over the top" about being careful. I am just trying to give everyone the benefit of real experience. Never forget that experience is what you get from making mistakes.
 
rgv said:
I never suggested hearing loss is not a serious issue.

What I'm saying, is that in a relative sense, the difference in hearing loss between a handful of shots per year without protection, between, say, a 24 inch barreled rifle and a 20 inch barreled rifle is small.

Do you think that in a lifetime of hunting, men who carried and shot longer barrels will have better hearing than men who carried short barrels?
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Yes, without a doubt.

I once had a Remington 600 in 308 and it was so loud that I got rid of t, for that reason. I did just not to take one shot with it, without earmuffs.
I was shooting at the range, after I walkked into the clubhouse. Two shooters there asked me what calibre magnum I was using!
I couldn't get normal ear muffs adjusted so my ears wouldn't ring after a shot.
 
each to their own but IMHO a magnum with a 18 inch barrel just doesn't make sense to me...plus not a lot of takers on that one if you want to sell it.
cheers
 
H Wally said:
Today I handled a nice mauser in 7x57 that had an 18.5 inch barrel that was light, easy to shoulder and aim, and I got to thinking...

Why are there so few short light rifles out there?

OP, I'm not sure about your question when it seems to me every major manufacturer of rifles offers at least one model with 20" bbl or less. I'm not sure why you seem to think there is a shortage.

Rem mod 7
CZ 550 FS
Win ftrwt ultra light
Ruger compact
Ruger RSI for many years
I believe Sako makes a 20" model (not 100% sure anymore)

That's 5 or 6 off the top of my head, probably more.
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Several years ago I bought a Ruger Hawkeye in 358 Win. with a 16.5" bbl. because it seemed like it would be a handy little rifle for a truck / quad gun.
I don't think its any noisier than my 20" rifles, but then again thats just me.
It has all the pointability of a curling rock, but it works well for my needs, first time in the field it put meat in the freezer so I can't complain... :)
 
I bought a Ruger compact in 7-08 a few years ago and it has become my favorite hunting rifle. It is noisy and has a large muzzle flash but its also both deadly and accurate. And by using some of the faster powders I can minimize the velocity loss to were it's not an issue.
 
Good thread.
Personally the barrel length has been dictated by the rifle manufacturer for me.
I've never considered a 24" tube an issue.
I added a few inches to one (muzzle brake) and never found an issue with it either.
I do have an opinion on the noise of shorter barrels- reload and choose a powder that burns in the tube. Factory hunting loads are designed to maximize velocity out of 22 to 24" tubes in standard calibers.
As for the light concept, sorry but a rifle needs to weight 7+ pounds, if you can't pack it you can't haul the animal out either so go hit the gym. Light rifles kick, the heavier the caliber the uglier it gets and not many people shoot heavy calibers in light rifles well or often.
My current lock up is mostly longer but my eye seems to be fixating on several shorter options;
A Marlin ss guide gun is one, the Ruger Compact is another.
In the end what makes you confident?
That is the one
 
Interesting replies - frankly my fascination with carbines stems from some sort of synthesis between laziness and the need for utter efficiency. I find I have a far easier time keeping short guns on target... somewhat counter intuitive, but my eyes are good so long sight radius' aren't super necessary and it ends up coming down to what can be dragged or pushed through salal and forest and up and down steep ferned slopes with the minimum of effort. I also find that in these smaller cartridges (243, 6.5x55, 7mm08, 260 rem) the recoil is far less of an issue than is keeping a long barreled gun on target while I get my breathing just right. I take a lot of standing freehanded shots with irons, and have yet to be able to keep a heavy gun on target without support (I love my mosins and rosses, but they're bench or supported shooters only :p)

I'm thinking I might have to put together a nice short barrelled rifle in 6.5 on an m96 or k98 action this winter :)
 
Some may laugh but the most accurate short barreled rifle I ever shot is my dad's old 760 Gamemaster carbine 308. He bought it brand new in '68 and it's got that 18.5" barrel that is of medium thickness. That rifle has always shot lights out without any effort or modifications. It's also a very nice rifle to handle in ground blinds when a long barrel becomes cumbersone. I do think there are lots of short barreled rifles out there but just not many in the dangerous games calibres which is what I'd like to see more of. My Marlin Guide Gun is also a gem to shoot and very accurate but again, can't seem to find much in a Lott or 416 Rem in something 22" or shorter.
 
Some years ago i sighted in a Rem 760 carbine 30-06 for a fellow, that was not pleasant. Even with ear muffs it was loud. I fall into the need for speed catagory for a given cartridge, while trying to make the rifle handle well. No need for a 28 in. barrel on a dirty thirty. Some just don`t look right with a short barrel and some do. The best way to look at this is that at least we have a large number of rifles to choose from. Wouldn`t want to be like Sksavenger and have tunnel vision, there is life beyond a Salvage.:D
 
rgv said:
I never suggested hearing loss is not a serious issue.

What I'm saying, is that in a relative sense, the difference in hearing loss between a handful of shots per year without protection, between, say, a 24 inch barreled rifle and a 20 inch barreled rifle is small.

Do you think that in a lifetime of hunting, men who carried and shot longer barrels will have better hearing than men who carried short barrels?
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H4831 said:
Yes, without a doubt.

I once had a Remington 600 in 308 and it was so loud that I got rid of t, for that reason. I did just not to take one shot with it, without earmuffs.
I was shooting at the range, after I walkked into the clubhouse. Two shooters there asked me what calibre magnum I was using!
I couldn't get normal ear muffs adjusted so my ears wouldn't ring after a shot.
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I find that quite remarkable that, without evidence other than a single subjective experience with a Remington 600 and inadequate hearing protection that you can conclude "without a doubt" that in a lifetime of hunting, men who carried and shot longer barrels will have better hearing than men who carried short barrels.

In my own (also subjective) opinion, the volume of muzzle blast changes far more with grains of powder the cartridge holds than with the length of barrel. If you google up some Pressure data for different cartridges that shows chamber pressure at the time of bullet exit, you will see this effect as well.
 
This whole line of hearing loss is way off thread but, I'm at a loss because when I hunt and fire at game I never hear or feel the rifle go off. My ears never ring when hunting and firing at game, is this just me? My 340 scoped me 6 times while making a goats life extremely exciting, and I had no idea until I finished and went to swat at what I thought was a mosquito on my cheek and came away with a hand covered in blood.
My son says the same as does my old sheep hunting partner, never hear or feel the recoil when shooting at game and ears never ring.

Thoughts?
 
c-fbmi said:
This whole line of hearing loss is way off thread but, I'm at a loss because when I hunt and fire at game I never hear or feel the rifle go off. My ears never ring when hunting and firing at game, is this just me? My 340 scoped me 6 times while making a goats life extremely exciting, and I had no idea until I finished and went to swat at what I thought was a mosquito on my cheek and came away with a hand covered in blood.
My son says the same as does my old sheep hunting partner, never hear or feel the recoil when shooting at game and ears never ring.

Thoughts?
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It's one of the effects of the adrenaline. It's called auditory exclusion. Your hearing may be reduced as the adrenaline kicks in, your pupils dilate, blood flows away from the surface of the skin towards muscles and internal organs.

It's all very "caveman". I LOVE a good adrenaline rush :D.
 
Although adrenaline can make you "unaware" of the sound, or the scope damage at the time, it will not prevent the hearing loss any more than it prevented the scope from drawing blood. Your brain is an amazing device and can ignore many things, but it can't prevent physical damage.
 
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