Will the Sightron line of scopes drive down the prices of the competition?

[Hitzy]

So even if the STAC truly is made by the wonderful Nikon factory in the Philippines.... at the same plant Nikon makes their scopes at. How do we explain the most expensive Nikon scope you can buy has an MSRP of $689, yet the STAC is $400-$500 more?
The "Japanese components" argument is going to need some proof as the manufacturer doesn't even claim that on their website....

 

[Mystic Precision]

You do realise that scopes is about as low down the totem pole for technical optics as you are likely to get.

At the Nikon plant, the real interest is in Binos, medical equipment, likely telescopes, spotters, Cameras.

Sweat shop maybe as it does get very hot and humid in the Philippines but as the stereotypical unfortunate worker trying to survive, I doubt that very much. more like white smocks, clean rooms, robots, CNC manf, and full on laboratory capabilities.

Stuff that you will be hard pressed to find on this continent.... even in silicone valley

Nikon continues to produce some of the worlds highest rated binos and cameras. You don't get there by rubbing lenses with the bottom of your shirt. Think many thousand dollar objects.

http://www.nikon.com/products/instruments/index.htm

If the link works, have a look at what Nikon lists as manf at their Philippines facilty. Good luck with your sweat shop ideas.

I think many need to step back and take a good long look at the world and how it has changed. Many so called developing countries have developed and are on track to blow past NA for manf capacity and eventually quality and standard of living.

What NA did post WWII, they are going right now and it will not be too long into the future, they will be the suburbanites with solid middle income lifestyles that rival if not supercede ours - Taiwan, South Korea and Singapore come to mind.

the Brits felt the same way with us lowly Colonials as just a place to get cheap raw material. The Backwoods and Savage laden landscape. Look at how that world changed.

QC is a part of the procurement cycle. Some do it better then others. Let's see what Sightron can establish. And I have no idea where Sightron may be assembling in Philippines. maybe it is not in association with Nikon???? Anyways, I doubt it is with a bamboo hammer over a chicken crate.

Jerry

 

[bearkilr]

Really? Where do think the vast majority of consumer electronics are made these days?

Yup, junk out of China, along with most everything else made there. They're famous for copying existing designs and building them with cheaper parts or they build things designed by others for less, thanks to cheap labour and a total lack of humanitarian efforts. Nothing innovative is developed there.

Anyhow, back to the Phillippines.

 

[derrick1978]

You do realise that scopes is about as low down the totem pole for technical optics as you are likely to get.

At the Nikon plant, the real interest is in Binos, medical equipment, likely telescopes, spotters, Cameras.

Sweat shop maybe as it does get very hot and humid in the Philippines but as the stereotypical unfortunate worker trying to survive, I doubt that very much. more like white smocks, clean rooms, robots, CNC manf, and full on laboratory capabilities.

Stuff that you will be hard pressed to find on this continent.... even in silicone valley

Nikon continues to produce some of the worlds highest rated binos and cameras. You don't get there by rubbing lenses with the bottom of your shirt. Think many thousand dollar objects.

http://www.nikon.com/products/instruments/index.htm

If the link works, have a look at what Nikon lists as manf at their Philippines facilty. Good luck with your sweat shop ideas.

I think many need to step back and take a good long look at the world and how it has changed. Many so called developing countries have developed and are on track to blow past NA for manf capacity and eventually quality and standard of living.

What NA did post WWII, they are going right now and it will not be too long into the future, they will be the suburbanites with solid middle income lifestyles that rival if not supercede ours - Taiwan, South Korea and Singapore come to mind.

the Brits felt the same way with us lowly Colonials as just a place to get cheap raw material. The Backwoods and Savage laden landscape. Look at how that world changed.

QC is a part of the procurement cycle. Some do it better then others. Let's see what Sightron can establish. And I have no idea where Sightron may be assembling in Philippines. maybe it is not in association with Nikon???? Anyways, I doubt it is with a bamboo hammer over a chicken crate.

Jerry

You're so full of #### lately and sound like a used car salesman. You're defending the brand you sell, I get that.....but so very hypocritical on your part and anyone who knows you would likely agree.

 

[derrick1978]

You're so full of #### lately and sound like a used car salesman. You're defending the brand you sell, I get that.....but so very hypocritical on your part and anyone who knows you would likely agree. Most of these scopes, even the Japanese, are incapable of lasting five years under even moderate use. The only proven brand to go the distance is s&b. It's apparantly not as simple of a feat as you elude, to engineer and manufacture a high mag scope that will track reliably with huge ammounts of internal adjustment. I have my doubts the Philippines are up to that task, they'll be pumping out tacti-cool poser scopes to a target market that wouldn't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

 

[Can-down]

I think people need to chill and evaluate products through hands on experience instead of old prejudice.

I've been blown away lately with the quality of optics coming out of China.

 

[SND]

In the end its either a satisfactory product at a reasonable price/value, or its not, regardless or where it comes from or the name on it.
Turns out so far Sightron seems to do a very good job at that. I'm definitely happy with the 2 I have.

As to what other brands will do, or are doing to adjust, time will tell I guess. Its certainly a very competitive market, I kinda wish there was less to choose from in some cases.

 

[Mystic Precision]

Yup, junk out of China, along with most everything else made there. They're famous for copying existing designs and building them with cheaper parts or they build things designed by others for less, thanks to cheap labour and a total lack of humanitarian efforts. Nothing innovative is developed there.

Anyhow, back to the Phillippines.

Isn't it great that people like Steve Jobs didn't think Asia was such a backwater hickville.

You might want to look up FOXCONN.... on your smart phone. You'll understand the irony... hopefully.

Asia has its issue, no doubt but you are way behind the curve on this.

Jerry

 

[Mystic Precision]

You're so full of #### lately and sound like a used car salesman. You're defending the brand you sell, I get that.....but so very hypocritical on your part and anyone who knows you would likely agree.

Hey, believe what you want. Research what you feel. Doesn't stop the world from barreling on.

Those that know me well, share my concerns.... for our children. But that is a topic vastly removed from this little debate.

YMMV.

Jerry

 

[wheels]

We're not discussing consumer electronics. We're discussing optical devices which can't even be manufactured with 100% reliability by the Germans while carrying a $4000 price tag, let alone some sweat shop in the Philipines.

Perhaps you should re-read and try to figure out what I was responding to.

 

[wheels]

Yup, junk out of China, along with most everything else made there. They're famous for copying existing designs and building them with cheaper parts or they build things designed by others for less, thanks to cheap labour and a total lack of humanitarian efforts. Nothing innovative is developed there.

Anyhow, back to the Phillippines.

I think you'd be surprised how many models from the 'good' brands are also manufactured in China.

 

[Hitzy]

Isn't it great that people like Steve Jobs didn't think Asia was such a backwater hickville.

You might want to look up FOXCONN.... on your smart phone. You'll understand the irony... hopefully.

Asia has its issue, no doubt but you are way behind the curve on this.

Jerry

Steve Jobs was not about selling a quality product, he was about marketing a substandard product to the mass of idiot consumers at grossly inflated profit margins, who buy #### as a status symbol, do no research on the product before hand, and literally are technologically retarded. Every NEW iteration of the iPhone was 2 years behind the competition at release. Basically obsolete off the shelf by technology standards.
I hope Sightron isn't trying to follow that business model?

 

[bearkilr]

Isn't it great that people like Steve Jobs didn't think Asia was such a backwater hickville.

I didn't realize Apple was a Chinese company, interesting. Here I thought they only manufactured and assembled as directed by Apple. Somehow I believe that Apple would do all its manufacturing and assembly in Silicon Valley if they could do it for the same costs. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
And yes, I'm totally against outsourcing and will happily pay more for a product actually made where the company is headquartered. Quigley Ford, King Optics, Huskemaw, Nightforce, Sightron, Mueller, Vortex......they can all go to hell.

 

[Mystic Precision]

I didn't realize Apple was a Chinese company, interesting. Here I thought they only manufactured and assembled as directed by Apple. Somehow I believe that Apple would do all its manufacturing and assembly in Silicon Valley if they could do it for the same costs. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
And yes, I'm totally against outsourcing and will happily pay more for a product actually made where the company is headquartered. Quigley Ford, King Optics, Huskemaw, Nightforce, Sightron, Mueller, Vortex......they can all go to hell.

Why I have concerns about the future of our children..... and country

Apple can't manf what they sell. They haven't been able to for a very long time. But then that can be said for the vast majority of companies we call domestic brands. The statement earlier was that Asia can't produce anything of value or complexity.

The irony is that it is the West that can't produce much.

I'm with you on the very real downside to this gravy train. Happy stockholders today is going to lead to an economic wasteland tomorrow.

I am very hopeful that in the coming year, there will be another player in the high end scope market. Sure sounds promising and will give the well heeled another option. You might like them very much.

Will this change the consumer market? Not a hope.... I think that ship is long gone over the horizon. So after a very long thread departure, we are still left with the question what role Sightron will have on the marketplace going forward?

Time will tell but they are certainly upsetting the balance of what is a scope at a consumer price point. will they keep improving? will they flop? Let's ask this question again in a couple of years.

Didn't Apple become the most valuable company in the World by stock value? I guess far more believe their products are worth buying.

Jerry

 

[mightyhunter]

Man you need to step into the 21st century. You're funny.

I didn't realize Apple was a Chinese company, interesting. Here I thought they only manufactured and assembled as directed by Apple. Somehow I believe that Apple would do all its manufacturing and assembly in Silicon Valley if they could do it for the same costs. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
And yes, I'm totally against outsourcing and will happily pay more for a product actually made where the company is headquartered. Quigley Ford, King Optics, Huskemaw, Nightforce, Sightron, Mueller, Vortex......they can all go to hell.

 

[Hitzy]

BULL#### on all the Apple can't make their own stuff in North America. BlackBerry made phones, better phones, then the iPhone could ever hope to be. Problem is we pay unskilled labour way too much....nobody here would assemble phones for 30 cents an hour afterall. Don't kid yourself that #### is made is China or the Philippines because its better....its made there cuz its cheaper.....only reason.

 

[SND]

There's a lot more to it, and a fair bit of manufacturing is moving back to the US, for various reasons.

And yes there will be very interesting new products in the coming year.

 

[wheels]

Blackberry phones aren't made here either.

Most of the components are sourced from China and are assembled in Mexico, Hungary, Malaysia.. The Rim factory in Canada is mostly for R & D, IIRC.

Apple hasn't even built a computer here since the mid 90's.. while i'm no fan of anything Apple, most of it's users would claim it's a better made product.

Of course manufacturing is moved off-shore to save money, but it is possible to have a quality product manufactured in these countries.

 

[derrick1978]

Blackberry phones aren't made here either.

Most of the components are sourced from China and are assembled in Mexico, Hungary, Malaysia.. The Rim factory in Canada is mostly for R & D, IIRC.

Apple hasn't even built a computer here since the mid 90's.. while i'm no fan of anything Apple, most of it's users would claim it's a better made product.

Of course manufacturing is moved off-shore to save money, but it is possible to have a quality product manufactured in these countries.

who gives a ####, the discussion revolves around scopes.

 

[tiriaq]

who gives a ####, the discussion revolves around scopes.

With the question being if the availability of Sightrons would affect the prices of other higher priced scopes.
This thread has been off the rails for a while, with nothing to show for it.