winchester 1905

bps540

bps540

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i just inherited an old winchester model 1905,35 cal self loader.
a box of ammo came with it but it reads 351 self loader
i've always beleived the markings on the gun must match the ammo...
35 cal stamped on the barrel...351 ammo.??
is 351 sl the same or has someone been playing with fire?
there were some empty casings in the box. as i examined them i noticed that the primers seemed to be really"flattened" out. could this be due to excessive
pressures using what i think is the incorrect ammunition?
couls someone explain the differences in ammunition to me?
Thanks...
 
I am pretty sure that .35 Win and .351 SL are different cartridges. The .351 was the cartridge that belonged to the 1907 WSL rifle/carbine. From what you say some .351's may have been fired in the .35 with excess pressure signs on the primers.

Darryl
 
There was a 35Win, but it was a very much larger round made for the 1895. It would never go close to a 351, I think the small .35Win for the auto is the right ammo. Could the brass you have ever been handloaded? I remember that these were loaded with pistol primers and are normally flat as normal. Not certain on the factory stuff though. As if you weren't confused enough right?
 
the 1905 WSL is 35 wsl cartridge--- I have several wsl rifles & the 351 wsl should not chamber in a 1905 as the cartridge case is much longer (357 mag length & the 35 wsl is 38 spcl length-- you can make the cases for 35 wsl by turning off the rim & cutting extractor groove on a 38 spcl case-- same as 357 mag to 351 wsl
 
is it possible that the rifle was rechambered for the 351?
the ammo that came with the gun was factory(in the 'dominion' box)
i don't beleive that handloads were ever used
the cartidges fit the magazine & even chamber(although i have not fired it)
i had purchased some 35sl to compare & yes they are a bit shorter. i like the 357-38spl analogy(makes sense).
both cartidges feed, chamber & eject just working the action.
is there a way to tell if the rifle has been modified?
the more i research the more confused i become.
i took it to my local gun store but they couldn't verify anything.
would it be safe to fire 35sl in a 351sl?
perhaps i should leave it as an heirloom but curiousity is killing me.
 
Winchester sold 1905 self loading rifles in 32WSL and 35WSL.
35WSL got promoted as a deer cartridge, but when it proved useless
for the purpose Winchester came up with 1907 rifle chambered for a more
powerful 351WSL cartridge.
Many 1905 rifles got send back to the factory for conversion to the
new cartridge.
I own one of these rifles the botom half on the tang is stamped 1905,
and the barrel is stamped 1907.
Your factory cartridges should be saved as they are kindof rare.
Many people shoot 38 Special and 357 Magnum cartridges through these
rifles, but the rim wont fit in the mag. so single loading only.
 
bps540 said:
is it possible that the rifle was rechambered for the 351?
the ammo that came with the gun was factory(in the 'dominion' box)
i don't beleive that handloads were ever used
the cartidges fit the magazine & even chamber(although i have not fired it)
i had purchased some 35sl to compare & yes they are a bit shorter. i like the 357-38spl analogy(makes sense).
both cartidges feed, chamber & eject just working the action.
is there a way to tell if the rifle has been modified?
the more i research the more confused i become.
i took it to my local gun store but they couldn't verify anything.
would it be safe to fire 35sl in a 351sl?
perhaps i should leave it as an heirloom but curiousity is killing me.
Click to expand...


Measure the length of the cases marked 351- they may have been shortened, when I got my 1905 it came with some 351 brass that had been shortened to accomodate the 1905 35 wsl.
the 1905 has a straight buttstock- the 1907 & 1910 have pistol grip stocks;)
If reloading jacketed bullets make sure they are .351 dia, you can get away with using .356 or 357 soft cast.
I have clip that will feed 38 spcl without turnig the rims off-- but only shoot soft cast 38 spcl ammo in it.
The pressure is much too high using jacketed bullets over >351 dia:(

You could have a ferrosafe chamber mould made to see if it has been rechambered -if this has been done your safe to use 351 wsl ammo- the mags are marked different , but will function just fine
 
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i have to say i'm intrigued with the thought of firing 38spl in it...
i checked the gun closely,winchester model 1905 on rear tang, barrel has some patent stampes & dates but nothing newer than 1905, stamped '35cal.'
on barrel. these older gun/cartridges can be cunfusing, just don't want a kaboom.
 
ok guys, now i'm really confused.
the markings are as follows
barrel..manufactured by the winchester repeating arms co. new haven conn. u.s.a.
self loading model 1905 pat aug 27. dec10 1901 feb 26 1902 feb 17 dec 22 1903 - 35cal
barrel also has a flip up front sight with 2 different blades
rear tang...model 1905
winchester
trade mark
seems to have a brass colored punch mark covering the nc in winchester on the tang(?)
rifle has a 4 digit ser#8###

this is where it gets weird..no markings on the magazine that i can find.
the mag sits flush with the bottom of the trigger guard & holds five rounds
351 win sl cartridges fit perfectly .
35 slr cartridges lack approx 1/4 inch from front of the mag
38spl & 357 mag cartidges will not load into the mag.
please note that i have not fired anything in the rifle, just cycling the action by hand.
351..feed, chamber & eject perfectly
35...trouble feeding from mag(diving into feed ramp), do chamber & eject.
38 & 357 chamber & eject single rounds
the 35 & 38 casings are near the same size however the 351 casing is a touch longer than the 357.

i'm almost convinced that my rifle is chambered for the 351 sl (just like my uncle's box of ammo) regardless of what is stamped on the gun.

is there much ballistic difference between the two, which is better?.
is it really safe to fire 38's & 357's from it, if so i may look for another mag to tinker with

thanks again for sharing your experience & knowledge
 
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