Winchester 38-55

L

Light Infantry

CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Rating - 100%
354   0   0
I hope this is in the correct forum. If not please let me know and I will remove and repost in the proper forum.

I am trying to figure out what I have here. This is not my normal area of collecting, and I hope this one will be easy for the experts.

Its a Winchester lever, falling block, single shot in 38-55.
The barrel is 21 and 1/4 (will assume it was cut down?). It is an octagon barrel which measures 15/16 across the flats at the muzzle.

Under the lever it says "PAT. OCT 7th 79. Funny hting is , is that the "7" in "7th" seems to be have been added after a small circle of metal was ground out very nicely and then re stamped.

top of barrel has " -MANUFACTURED BY THE -"
"- WINCHESTER REPEATING ARMS CO. NEW HAVEN CONN. U.S.A.-"

Serial number is 8###x.

I assume that somewhere, i can find some ammo?

Can someone give me an approximate value? Is this something that is valuable, should i shoot it?

P1070885.jpg


P1070892.jpg

P1070889.jpg

P1070890.jpg
 
Looks like a pretty standard Model 1885 High-Wall. I'd say the barrel is about a #4 (the heavy) profile. A serial number search might turn up the year of manufacture. .38-55 components are pretty easy to get nowadays. I would stick to lead bullets and black powder, but that's just my way.

The barrel has perhaps been chopped at some point, the front sight looks to be a bit far back. Some of the Winchester experts will chime in soon.
 
I will give you a little info, although no expert, just someone that has had several and still have one of these . What you have is very very nice--it is the model 1885 Hi-wall, the patent date is correct. DO NOT assume the barrel has been cut down until someone that knows looks at it, the hi wall could be ordered with barrel lengths I think from 15 inches to over 30. It is in a common caliber, 38-55 and ammo is can be found easily. From the picture and your measurement I would say you have a number 3 weight barrel, if you look on the bottom of the barrel just ahead of the forearm that number should be there , the rear sight does look correct. If the ser # is under 82,000 it was made in 1898 so is an antique in the US where the value on these is quite high. Yes it is valuable. Of course it's all about condition, Wood looks pretty good, looks like some blue on barrel, wore off on tang, the case hardening on receiver looks typical of one of these used, looks to be rust? needs a little oil and the right kind of cleaning? Also as to value, condition of bore is very important. I don't like getting into telling someone what I think the value of something like this is, If you are asking--- maybe you want to sell it and then I would get a few more pictures of it from you and make you an offer. I would love to have it to go with my 32-40. The strongest action of their time , you can shoot the sheet out of it., Sure someone else will add to this. Feel free to PM me. Cheers
 
Love the .38-55

I picked up a no-collector value, late-19th century Winchester 1894 in this calibre. I got the brass at Wholesale Sports and 400 cast lead bullets for it from "The Bullet Barn" (in BC, by mail). I think Starline carries brass by mailorder too. In Calgary both WSS and Bass Pro carry dies, if you can believe that. Winchester has re-instated the cartridge in two of its lever guns this year, too. Maybe it'll make a comeback?

I loaded up 50 200-grainers and had a blast with them, and so I loaded up another 50. Surprisingly accurate with open sights at 100 yards.

For a "high wall" there are some published loads for what Handloader magazine called "Group I" loads:

http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/hl61partial.pdf

Try 18 grains of A110 (same as the old WW-296) or SR-4759. Lots of fun, and not blackpowder mess...


Bill
 
Should be a number stamped into the barrel, just in front of the ebony insert of the forend. Probably a number 3. That tells the barrel size, which was sort of standardized at the two ends, even if the length was different ( a number 3 barrel had the same muzzle and chamber end dimensions, while the length could vary up to well over 30 inches.

By memory, the front sight should be 1 1/2inches back from the muzzle, if the factory installed it. If you want to do some reading on the 1885 Winchester, hit the library and order in a copy of the two books by Campbell, called The Winchester Single Shot Rifle. LOTS of info !

Buy some ammo. It's still available.

Cheers
Trev
 
Trev, just measured mine it is 1.122 from breech end of dove tail to front end of barrel. The 21 1/4 barrel length doesn't sound quite right either, I guess depending on what was measured , now 22 would be . Like short knife said sight does look too far back. Need more pics, I like pics. :) Cheers
 
I'll dig out the correct measurement from my copy of the Campbell books, and get back to you in a bit.

Yours seems awfully close to 1 and 1/8th inch, which may well be the correct measurement.

Cheers
Trev
 
The ammo is available, quite pricey. About $85 for 20 rounds around here. With Winchester starting to make the 38-55 in rifles again hopefully the cost of ammo will go down with a greater supply available. I have the reloading dies for my press already. Hard to find 38-55 brass for a decent price. I am going to fire form some 30-30 brass since the cost difference is great. I still want to get the bullet mould for mine just haven't gotten one yet since I don't have the rest of the mould gear yet.
 
Wow! Some great info. The knowledge here is quite humbling!

To address soem of the points brought up:

It is a #3 weight barrel.
Looks like the rifle was manufactured in 1900.
Not sure if the dark marks are/were rust as the metal is very smooth and even and i would expect some roughness and pitting there.
Havent had the opportunity to clean the barrel out, but rifling is very good from first glance.
Remeasured barrel. Stupidly done yesterday. it look like it just over 22 inches. maybe by a 1/16
I was wondering if that ebony insert was the way it was made or a very good repair!

Front sight from muzzle to leading edge approx 5/8" and to muzzle to rear end approx 1 1/8. if measured as per BSA Jack then it is approx 1 1/16.

What specific pictures do you guys want?
 
Flying_Finn said:
The ammo is available, quite pricey. About $85 for 20 rounds around here. .
Click to expand...

at that price, you could pay for a reloading set up pretty quickly. Make your cases from annealed and fire formed 30-30 shells if necessary. With jacketed slugs, I would expect the price to drop to about 40 cents each or with home case lead slugs around 15 or 20 cents

cheers mooncoon
 
Cast bullets for that beauty, and load for black powder for the fun factor.

You have no idea what a nice gun you have there, when you shoot it you will have a better idea. Those guns are very "shootable".
 
Looked up the front sight details in Campbell, and he notes that the distance from the muzzle to the front sight cut should be very close to 3/4 inch, with a 3/8 inch wide dovetail.
Barrel length should be an even number, in general.

The ebony insert is pretty much standard.

FWIW, anyways.

Cheers
Trev
 
I have a 1916 production Winchester 94 in .38-55, good info here about the cartridge that I was unaware of as I've never shot it.

Thanks guys.
 
It's worth noting that there are two different lengths of 38-55 brass out there, they vary by about a tenth of an inch.

But 30-30 brass is everywhere, and it's not a huge effort or expense to blow out the sides of a dozen or so of them to use. Some fast powder, some cream of wheat cereal (only use the stuff is worth having for, yech!), and a bit of tissue on top to hold it all in place. Look up "Case Forming Loads", for more info.

That's a pretty sweet rifle. I'd be pretty pleased to have one of those fall into my lap.
Were I in your shoes, I'd be alll over that offer to get the info from the Cody Museum. The gun is in reasonable shape, and worth following up on.

Cheers
Trev
 
Here is the news on the rifle that Light Infantry sent me the serial number on.

Based on the Cody information records:
SN applied 7-26-1900
In Warehouse 6-26-1901
Shipped from Warehouse 5-2-1902
Rifle
Caliber .38-55
Barrel Shape, octagon
Barrel Weight, #3
Barrel length, 30"
Trigger; Plain
 
So, not quite 'unmolested', but still a pretty sweet bit o gear.

Wish I hadn't sunk my spending money into as many things as I had, of late. It'd be a great deer rifle.

Cheers
Trev
 
All of the Winchester 1885's had that ebony insert in the forearm tip. That's just the way they did things way back when the best rifles were made :)

If I were you I'd buy a can of Goex FFg, some Starline brass and find some soft lead bullets. An 1885 Winchester in .38-55 loaded with black powder is one of the most enjoyable rifles you'll ever find to shoot.

Your rifle will probably want the original length of .38-55 brass (2.125" rather than the newer short stuff ). Starline sells both and it'll work very well after fire forming. Groove diameter is probably a little larger than you'll find in a modern .38-55 too.

As far as collector value goes, it doesn't look like it has a lot of expensive options that would make it a rare piece. That barrel length, assuming it's a special order from the factory would be a bit unusual though. EDIT: I just read the other post that said it was originally a 30" barrel.

Chris.
 
An old thread back up. Its time for me to sell this rifle. I have no idea on value of this Winchester. Based on the input above, I know there are quite a few extremely knowledgeable people that can help put a value on this.

Anyone care to provide me with a selling price on this? It would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom