Winchester Model 12 16 gauge issue

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RustyCanuck

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Dundas Ontario
Recently acquired a nice old 16 gauge and have a small issue. All was well until I took it down and put it back together(the Model 12 separates into two pieces in front on the receiver. Now when I pump it and dry fire it requires and little extra push forward or requires the slide release to be pushed to allow the pump to be activated.
Any ideas?
 
Built that way. Old school feature to prevent premature opening if a hang fire occurs. Under live fire the recoil will move your hand forward with inertia causing the action to unlock. With modern ammunition it is an unnecessary feature. It has no effect on the actual firing of the gun.

Darryl
 
I have never heard the 'hang fire explanation' before but it is part of the design. There is a spring on the tube under the forend. It acts as a cushion when slamming the forend forward and on recoil. On firing, the shotgun recoil and foreward momentum of the forend compress this spring slightly and this allows the action slide lock to disengage. On dry firing there is no recoil and momentum so you have to push the forend forward against this spring to release the slide lock.

You can check to see if the fit of the slide lock is correct. With the gun unloaded and the slide fully back, safety off... hold the trigger depressed and slowly move the slide forward. The hammer should not drop until the rear of the bolt raises up into it's locked position. Many worn Model 12's will drop the hammer well before the bolt locks up.

You can also check how worn the locking lug area is with the action fully open. Feel with a finger the area immediately behind the locking recess inside top of the action. Feel if there is a 'lip' pounded out from a lot of shooting. Close the action (unloaded) and dry fire it while watching the bolt. A worn action will have the rear of the bolt move upwards quite a bit.

Model 12's are nice old guns, I think considerably over rated and they are expensive to repair.
 
Aha, makes sense now. Thanks for the help! Wasn't really looking to buy anything but stopped into my LGS for some 16 gauge ammo for a couple others I have and the guy behind the counter says "16 gauge? Hey, we've got a nice one for sale in our used rack." Long story short I took it home, it's a 1957 in very nice condition, no rust and a tiny bit of bluing off the barrel, but boy it is nice to hold, very slim and handy. Makes my 70s 500C 20 gauge feel like a 2x4 (which is likely is in comparison). Going up north for grouse in a couple of weeks, this is just the ticket.
 
"After the Hammer falls the breech block remains locked until automatically unlocked by the recoil or by a forward push of the Slide Handle, if the gun has not been fired. This is the third positive automatic locking device in the Model 12's famous triple safety design." Quote from Winchester press ad. Madis states that " this was an important feature to prevent the action from opening too soon after a "hang fire". It was indeed designed for this purpose. Source The Winchester Model 12 by Madis copy right 1982.

Darryl
 
It is interesting how things changed over time... the modern pump Winchesters will blow open and eject a shell if you don't hold the forend on firing.. I had many customers bring them in worried about it blowing open.
 
I have to agree, at one time the model 12 design was considered super safe and now the 1200 series "speed pump" is heavily marketed. I also agree the model 12 was and is a good shotgun but it is just too far outdated to be practical for a modern shotgunner.

Darry
 
madtrapper143 said:
I have to agree, at one time the model 12 design was considered super safe and now the 1200 series "speed pump" is heavily marketed. I also agree the model 12 was and is a good shotgun but it is just too far outdated to be practical for a modern shotgunner.

Darry
Click to expand...

The 'super safe' (your words) Model 12... I have seen so many altered (mostly by trap shooters) so you could more easily open and remove an unfired round... this alteration when incorrectly done and/or when the parts wear a bit allow the hammer to be dropped when the action is not fully closed...

The design of the Model 12 is very complicated and if you have to work on the trigger, you may have to work on the disconnector and the hammer... no parts swap from action to action without fitting. Compare that to an 870... you can take a 1952 870 and mix the parts up with a 2002 870 and simple assemble both guns... no fitting required. The Model 12 was a fine gun for a 100 + year old design.
 
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