A vicious killer? Seriously? It doesn't matter what type of wolf. The fact is, wolves were re-introduced where wolves once were. Nothing wrong with that.
Just be honest, you don't like wolves period? Anywhere?
Patrick
Wolves - The Curse That They Are
- Thread starter ronecol
- Start date
A vicious killer? Seriously? It doesn't matter what type of wolf. The fact is, wolves were re-introduced where wolves once were. Nothing wrong with that.
Just be honest, you don't like wolves period? Anywhere?
Patrick
God! I hope you are as willing to pay $500.00+ per pound for the next ground beef you buy!
Our "pastures" here in Western Canada - where most of the reasonably priced Canadian beef comes from - are measured in square miles, not acres! How many millions of dollars will need to be spent to fence off 100 sections of summer range in the manner you propose? What will happen to all the wildlife that also shares that range? Will migration patterns be halted and the local ungulates starve to death during the winter when they can't reach their wintering areas?
Loss of stock due to predation is one of the costs of doing business but when the predators population doubles or triples in a couple of years their numbers must be controlled.
Seemed to me the point was that the grey wolf wasnt native to where the timber wolf used to live and destroyed the grey wolf population and prey animals. As cruel as they seem to the deer and elk, we as humans are much worse. Humans are just as "wasteful" and way more cruel to our own kind nevermind other animals. The wolf population will decline once they exhaust the deer population, just natural cycle.
Well I don't know what the cost would be to fence off a farm to protect ones livestock but would be much more than what the sheep or cattle would be worth. In the summer they bring bus loads of people from toronto to Algonquin Park so they can hear the wolves at night. Raw nature. Suppose they are happy. Myself, I shoot them on sight.
blasted_saber
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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Ummmm, wrong. Wolves don't kill for fun. While its true at times they wont consume the whole animal, but this is only in times of high prey abundance. At these times they will eat the rear end and entrails, then will make another kill, because these portions alone are worth more then the rest of animal.
I can guarantee when times are tough, they strip the carcass.
I canty stand guys who think wolves (or all predators, for that matter) should all be killed because they kill prey animals. Of course, most guys wont say it, their pi$$ed because the wolves are killing "their" moose, "their" elk, "their" deer.
The attitude that the only good wolf is a dead one is still alive and well.
Myself, I fully intend on thinning out the pack around my area. I know it is very strong, and very healthy. Other years, theirs not a chance i'd shoot one, as things werent so warm and cozy for them.
God! I hope you are as willing to pay $500.00+ per pound for the next ground beef you buy!
Our "pastures" here in Western Canada - where most of the reasonably priced Canadian beef comes from - are measured in square miles, not acres! How many millions of dollars will need to be spent to fence off 100 sections of summer range in the manner you propose? What will happen to all the wildlife that also shares that range? Will migration patterns be halted and the local ungulates starve to death during the winter when they can't reach their wintering areas?
Loss of stock due to predation is one of the costs of doing business but when the predators population doubles or triples in a couple of years their numbers must be controlled.
I agree.Its the same old thing "dont hurt the nice wolves,cougar,coyotes"unless they eat my yappy poodle or cat and then look out.Farmers and ranchers are the people that know whats going on out there with mother nature not some book reading weekend hunter with a shiny gun.Dont even think about trying to tell a farmer or rancher that nature is cruel as they see it every day.
From what I have read and understand there are many sub species of the Timber and the Canadian Gray which was introduced into the American west is a much larger sub species than the Timber that originally inhabited the area.
Ron
Wolves will and do kill for sport which anyone who knows anything about them will attest to. Read the report below for a case in point.
Wolves kill 120 sheep near Dillon
Posted: Aug 28, 2009 08:59 AM
Updated: Aug 28, 2009 08:59 AM
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DILLON, Mont. (AP) - U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service officials say wolves killed 120 sheep in a pasture south of Dillon, more than were killed by wolves in the entire state a year earlier.
The dead sheep were found on the Rebish/Konen Livestock Ranch on Aug. 16.
Carolyn Sime, statewide wolf coordinator for the Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks, says it's one of the most significant losses she's seen.
Sime says wolves killed 111 sheep in Montana in 2008.
Suzanne Stone with Defenders of Wildlife, a group that pays ranchers for livestock lost to wolves, says this is the first time she's heard of such a mass killing.
Kathy Konen says the sheep were killed, but their carcasses were almost all intact.
Federal trappers shot two wolves in the area and were searching for a third, but declined Jon Konen's request to kill two adults and five pups in a nearby pack.
Ron
The reason I say they are a vicious killer is two fold:
a) they kill for sport
b) they eat their prey alive often leaving it to suffer & die after only being partially eaten
I think that qualifies as "vicious killers".
As for liking wolves...I do like them....in my sights.
Ron
Wolves are Killers. They do kill for fun.
A year ago I was up by Fox Creek, AB working in camp. There were some scientist staying there. They are there to study the woodland Caribou. They say the number one problem with the woodland caribou population is the wolves are killing them off. When they were up there they were trying a new program. They were nuttering the alafa males of the packs. There are trying everything they can do to get the wolf numbers down in this are. They are doing this from Fox Creek to Grande Cache to Jasper and into BC where these caribou travel.
They are not just effecting the Caribou numbers, it all the wild game.
Shoot every wolf that you see.
A year ago I was up by Fox Creek, AB working in camp. There were some scientist staying there. They are there to study the woodland Caribou. They say the number one problem with the woodland caribou population is the wolves are killing them off. When they were up there they were trying a new program. They were nuttering the alafa males of the packs. There are trying everything they can do to get the wolf numbers down in this are. They are doing this from Fox Creek to Grande Cache to Jasper and into BC where these caribou travel.
They are not just effecting the Caribou numbers, it all the wild game.
Shoot every wolf that you see.
I heard of wolves(and seen dogs) kill domestic animals in large numbers. When there's no work to it, it's like they don't know when to stop. Never heard them doing it to wild animals, but I wouldn't doubt it, there's a lot about nature we don't understand.
Get rid of wolves and coyotes will move into the area. Your not solving much.
Ranchers in the US never wanted the wolf to be reintroduced in the first place, I can't blame them, but I still disagree with them.
Get rid of wolves and coyotes will move into the area. Your not solving much.
Ranchers in the US never wanted the wolf to be reintroduced in the first place, I can't blame them, but I still disagree with them.
the spank
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Planet Earth Wearing My Tinfoil Hat
QUOTE "There is a common misconception that wolves only kill "sick, weak, old" animals. That is utter bulls**t, they kill every class of animal, and they will often kill for fun, and waste the meat, just like many of these pictures show. Wolves can and will decimate an area of ungulates, then move on to the next area, and do the same"
Halleluja, a person who has actually been out in the bush and not some arm chair biologist slash farley mowat ***wipe!! I have seen alot of wolves in 10 years working in the logging industry and 35+ years tripsing along behind my grandfather in the bush and in his words, "I have never seen a wolf running around with a stethascope and thermometer"!!
Halleluja, a person who has actually been out in the bush and not some arm chair biologist slash farley mowat ***wipe!! I have seen alot of wolves in 10 years working in the logging industry and 35+ years tripsing along behind my grandfather in the bush and in his words, "I have never seen a wolf running around with a stethascope and thermometer"!!
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Wolves just being wolves. Don't get me wrong, I don't like them, niether hate them. They are just part of nature, and they'll do what comes naturally to themselves until a top predator called humans have them in check.
I seriously doubt this will ever happen in the near or distant future. I believe we can shoot & trap wolves all we wish, and we'll probably never keep thier numbers in check. Unless society is willing to poison them out of existance
(or allow helicopter hunting at taxpayer's expense, such as the Alaskan example) along with most of the other mammal species that live in our natural environment. And I think we don't want that so, we are condemned to co-existing.
Most of us, are well aware of the USA reintroduction program, in the lower 48.
So you have a great excuse to purchase that 243 or 25-06, you have been thinking about.
Even better, take a trapper's course!
I seriously doubt this will ever happen in the near or distant future. I believe we can shoot & trap wolves all we wish, and we'll probably never keep thier numbers in check. Unless society is willing to poison them out of existance
(or allow helicopter hunting at taxpayer's expense, such as the Alaskan example) along with most of the other mammal species that live in our natural environment. And I think we don't want that so, we are condemned to co-existing.
Most of us, are well aware of the USA reintroduction program, in the lower 48.
So you have a great excuse to purchase that 243 or 25-06, you have been thinking about.
Even better, take a trapper's course!
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When I saw the replies to the original posting in the first page or two, I thought I must have strayed onto the PETA sight, or the grandmothers for Bambi. It is settling down now, with a lot of good opinions.
A lot of people are agreeing now, an over abundance of wolves should be controlled. If hunters shot every wolf they could, year long, they could not keep the packs down, when numbers are high. However, I am all for hunters shooting every one they get a chance at, when wolf numbers are high, or extreme, like they seem to be in some places now.
No one, on here or any place else, is calling for wolf extinction.
Without doubt, the largest governmental wolf control program in Canada, took place in the 1950s in most of BC. If you find a story written about it today, one of the first things you will read is that the BC government of the day, tried to exterminate the wolves in BC.
This is a lie.
By 1950 wolves had increassed to far beyond their normal numbers, and as a result the province was suffering severe losses. Thus a great effort was made to reduce their numbers, by dropping poison bait from aircraft. This went on for about six years and brought the wolf numbers down and the game, principally moose, caribou, goats and sheep, back up.
I know something about that program, because I was actively engaged in it, almost from day one. I was informed and aware of, all the happenings and the information learned from it, including the best evidence possible, that wolves kill any moose they want to kill.
I have a full chapter on wolves in my book, Outposts and Bushplanes, Hancock House Publishers, and give a lot of details on the poisoning program.
I note that Ronecol, the original poster, and Gatehouse, are two of the quite a number of members on here who have the book. In the early pages of this thread, those two were the principal "anti Farley Mowat" posters!
A lot of people are agreeing now, an over abundance of wolves should be controlled. If hunters shot every wolf they could, year long, they could not keep the packs down, when numbers are high. However, I am all for hunters shooting every one they get a chance at, when wolf numbers are high, or extreme, like they seem to be in some places now.
No one, on here or any place else, is calling for wolf extinction.
Without doubt, the largest governmental wolf control program in Canada, took place in the 1950s in most of BC. If you find a story written about it today, one of the first things you will read is that the BC government of the day, tried to exterminate the wolves in BC.
This is a lie.
By 1950 wolves had increassed to far beyond their normal numbers, and as a result the province was suffering severe losses. Thus a great effort was made to reduce their numbers, by dropping poison bait from aircraft. This went on for about six years and brought the wolf numbers down and the game, principally moose, caribou, goats and sheep, back up.
I know something about that program, because I was actively engaged in it, almost from day one. I was informed and aware of, all the happenings and the information learned from it, including the best evidence possible, that wolves kill any moose they want to kill.
I have a full chapter on wolves in my book, Outposts and Bushplanes, Hancock House Publishers, and give a lot of details on the poisoning program.
I note that Ronecol, the original poster, and Gatehouse, are two of the quite a number of members on here who have the book. In the early pages of this thread, those two were the principal "anti Farley Mowat" posters!
]
Ummmm, wrong. They sure do kill for fun..
Sure when times are tough they will strip the carcasss. But other times they kill for fun. It's play for them, just like domestic dogs that kill wildlife and livestock. They arent' killing for food purposes, so it's for some other reason, and the closest I can tell from observations is that it is becuase it's fun to run down a deer/moose/sheep/cow.
I'm not the only one to have noticed this....Why do you think the 120 sheep in Montana that were killed over a span of a couple of days and not consumed were killed? It sure wasn't some sort of "training" session for pups, it was because they started to kill and found it was fun chasing sheep around, so continued.
I'd say that most hunters would prefer that ungulate population management is done by hunters, not wolves.
It's not a case of them eating "thier" moose, it's more a situation that if the wolves decimate a population, the wildlife managers will shorten seasons and hunters will lose opportunity to hunt.
Wolves aren't an endangered species, but hunters and hunting opportunity is.
Ummmm, wrong. They sure do kill for fun..
Sure when times are tough they will strip the carcasss. But other times they kill for fun. It's play for them, just like domestic dogs that kill wildlife and livestock. They arent' killing for food purposes, so it's for some other reason, and the closest I can tell from observations is that it is becuase it's fun to run down a deer/moose/sheep/cow.
I'm not the only one to have noticed this....Why do you think the 120 sheep in Montana that were killed over a span of a couple of days and not consumed were killed? It sure wasn't some sort of "training" session for pups, it was because they started to kill and found it was fun chasing sheep around, so continued.
I'd say that most hunters would prefer that ungulate population management is done by hunters, not wolves.
It's not a case of them eating "thier" moose, it's more a situation that if the wolves decimate a population, the wildlife managers will shorten seasons and hunters will lose opportunity to hunt.
Wolves aren't an endangered species, but hunters and hunting opportunity is.
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I have your book H4831, it's a great read my friend.
PS: My ex-wife's Dad grew up and farmed in Fort St. John/Goodlow BC, he has many memories much like yours of wilderness life in the backwoods of BC, back in the day. He has fond memories of Blackwater too.
I remember one story he told, of a starving & poor local farmer, whom shot a deer out of season during the Depression Era.
He is stopped by a game warden and this sad fellow is literally crying as he relents his family is starving to death!
The responce from the game warden was,
"I don't know what you are talking about and be on your way, I just stopped to get a bee out of my truck!"
PS: My ex-wife's Dad grew up and farmed in Fort St. John/Goodlow BC, he has many memories much like yours of wilderness life in the backwoods of BC, back in the day. He has fond memories of Blackwater too.
I remember one story he told, of a starving & poor local farmer, whom shot a deer out of season during the Depression Era.
He is stopped by a game warden and this sad fellow is literally crying as he relents his family is starving to death!
The responce from the game warden was,
"I don't know what you are talking about and be on your way, I just stopped to get a bee out of my truck!"
We had this conversation last year over on huntingbc.ca, and I asked H4831 to chime in about his experiences, which was highly enlightening. I highly recommend his book for this wolf program and other information, as well as the good entertainment value
This is just crazy talk. You want to bury hundreds of miles of fences? Make them impossible to jump? If you want to tip the scale to favour wildlife, you aren't doing the wildlife any favours installing high fences! A decent sized dog like animal can easily clear a 6 foot fence, how about a fawn?
Where I live we have farms backed onto forests and river bottoms, including my gals family farm. This area has wolves, cougars, coyotes, bobcats, black bears, grizzly bears, foxes and some wolverine.
The fences are to keep the livestock in, not to keep predators out, as that is virtually impossible. What keeps the predator loss to a minimum is that they get shot at. There is no way to make fencing as you describe except on a very small scale.
