Yes. One option to abate this would be a mercury recoil tube in the stock and a quality pad like a limbsaver. I used to really like my limbsavers but I'm finding now that the way they stick to outer clothing is a little annoying.
Working man's .470 Nitro Express
- Thread starter 1899
- Start date
Yes. One option to abate this would be a mercury recoil tube in the stock and a quality pad like a limbsaver. I used to really like my limbsavers but I'm finding now that the way they stick to outer clothing is a little annoying.
Just put a wrap of electrical tape on the outside and it'll slide like KY.
I can see the problem with a PH having a single shot DGR, but for the average joe...isn't it ok? What about the fine single shots from Alexander Henry, Jeffery, Westley Richards and others? Correct me if I am wrong but the .450 NE was a popular chambering in turn of the previous century single shots.
I wouldn't count on any guide or PH protecting you in the extremely unlikey chance of needing protection.
You can bet on a couple things; you probably (by nature of being a gun-nut) shoot more than the average PH. Second, things that need to be shot big will probably need to be shot lots. There's not a lot of buffalo with less than 3 or 4 holes in them. Don't expect a buffalo to go down like a deer, and even if it does it's pretty easy to shoot a bolt gun dry ending the matter.
It seems like the 1898 Mauser was also turn of the century. Notice which way the market shifted?
The singleshots are classier than hell though, even I can appreciate that.
You can bet on a couple things; you probably (by nature of being a gun-nut) shoot more than the average PH. Second, things that need to be shot big will probably need to be shot lots. There's not a lot of buffalo with less than 3 or 4 holes in them. Don't expect a buffalo to go down like a deer, and even if it does it's pretty easy to shoot a bolt gun dry ending the matter.
It seems like the 1898 Mauser was also turn of the century. Notice which way the market shifted?
The singleshots are classier than hell though, even I can appreciate that.
An interesting thread about in an interesting topic.
Would opting for doing up your own Wildcat load be unique enough to satisfy your goals?
Seems to me that starting with a more pleantiful and easily acquired brass and then die stretching or fire forming it to take bigger bullets would provide as much satisfaction as seeking out expensive and obscure ammo or reloading components.
Like say... oh... what about a 50BMG case shortened and necked down to take .480 bullets....
OK OK, the BMG thing is just a joke. But what about considering your own wildcat load?
Would opting for doing up your own Wildcat load be unique enough to satisfy your goals?
Seems to me that starting with a more pleantiful and easily acquired brass and then die stretching or fire forming it to take bigger bullets would provide as much satisfaction as seeking out expensive and obscure ammo or reloading components.
Like say... oh... what about a 50BMG case shortened and necked down to take .480 bullets....
OK OK, the BMG thing is just a joke. But what about considering your own wildcat load?
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I had a #1 in .416 Rigby that I carried for a few years. I don't recall having had any issues with shooting full power loads; I could hold 3 rounds shooting prone, although 3 was enough. I think the key was that the rifle fit me, and I didn't shoot it until it hurt me. As a result I rate the .416 as the largest cartridge that I would consider for general purpose use and I rate the #1 highly as a choice of a powerful rifle.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
A better option would be the 450 NE. Ruger factory chambers them and there's no shortage of good .458" bullets available. There's a lot of work needed to build a 470 on a #1 due to the larger rim diameter.
Loading isn't too bad...figure $.50 per round for powder, $1.4 per round for a 500gr Woodleigh SN, about $.10 for a primer. That's $2 per round without figuring for brass ($3 a piece). So first loading is $5 per, then $3.50 for the second, then $ 3.00 for the third loading. Load a piece 5 times (easily doable at the pressure levels of the 470 NE) and you're averaging $3.37 per round. Sure, it's pricier than a 308, btu it's so much more fun too.
But in a a 7.25lb rifle it's going to be tons of fun. Probably more fun than you'll want.
Loading isn't too bad...figure $.50 per round for powder, $1.4 per round for a 500gr Woodleigh SN, about $.10 for a primer. That's $2 per round without figuring for brass ($3 a piece). So first loading is $5 per, then $3.50 for the second, then $ 3.00 for the third loading. Load a piece 5 times (easily doable at the pressure levels of the 470 NE) and you're averaging $3.37 per round. Sure, it's pricier than a 308, btu it's so much more fun too.
But in a a 7.25lb rifle it's going to be tons of fun. Probably more fun than you'll want.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
This is a very interesting thread and I'm not trying to side-track it, but I have a #1 in 450/348 AI and it works very well.
It has considerably more than a 45-70 ( I know cause I have two ) with perhaps a tad less than a 458 Win. Mag.
Easy to form cases from 348, easy to load for, excellent case life, and all the recoil a sane man could wish for.
I have tried cast bullets from 330 to 560 gr., and jacketed from 350 to 500 gr.
Also I have some 600 gr Barnes Original to try when I build up the nerve, but that may take a while.
It is one of the most fun rifles I have played with in a while, hopefully I can put something in the freezer with it....
It has considerably more than a 45-70 ( I know cause I have two ) with perhaps a tad less than a 458 Win. Mag.
Easy to form cases from 348, easy to load for, excellent case life, and all the recoil a sane man could wish for.
I have tried cast bullets from 330 to 560 gr., and jacketed from 350 to 500 gr.
Also I have some 600 gr Barnes Original to try when I build up the nerve, but that may take a while.
It is one of the most fun rifles I have played with in a while, hopefully I can put something in the freezer with it....
BC Bigbore
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- BC's Peace Country
Isn't the .450/348 (not AI) aka the .450 Alaskan?
The 450/348 is the 450 Alaskan, but the 450/348 AI is a bit of a different bird in that it has a straighter case wall and a 40 deg. shoulder.
End result being a wee bit more capacity......just a wee bit.
It is a cool rifle with one of the worlds coolest cartridges.
It should be more than reasonable with 500 grains at 2100fps.
Some times a guy just has to do that thing...Life is short...What are you asking us for?
You know what to do!
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
Some PHs are better than others in this respect, Mark Sullivan and Jeff Rann are a couple of examples of the breed who at least can define what a charge is, and know what to do about it, once it occurs. There are other top PHs, but the PH banner is applied too loosely in my opinion. All the same, a dangerous game hunt in Africa should not and cannot be without some element of risk. Its up to the client to determine how much spice he can handle. My limit came quickly when I found myself following a large black mamba in thick grass, once the significance of this foolishness struck me I went into full retreat!
Not even MS could save you from the seven step snake. (Once bitten you'll b e alive long enough to take 7 steps)..........My limit came quickly when I found myself following a large black mamba in thick grass, once the significance of this foolishness struck me I went into full retreat!
Truth be told if you were hunting with me you'd have running shoe marks down your back.
Nothing makes me more nervous than a big venomous snake....The black Mamba flat scares the sh1t out of me....There are a lot of places in Africa where a Mamba could run you down...Those things are fast (15-20kph) and super aggressive.
I'd rather go in after an injured buff than crawl in tall grass that I had just seen a Mamba go in to...No thanks!
Here is a quote from wikipedia for those interested.
The black mamba uses its speed to escape threats, not to hunt prey.[1] It is known to be capable of reaching speeds of around 20 kilometers per hour (12 mph), traveling with up to a third of its body raised off the ground.[1] Over long distances the black mamba travels 11 to 19 kilometers per hour (6.8 to 12 mph), but in short bursts it can reach a speed of 23 kilometers per hour (14 mph),[6] making it the fastest land snake.[7] It is shy and secretive; it always seeks to escape when a confrontation occurs.[1] If a black mamba is cornered it mimics a cobra by spreading a neck-flap, exposing its black mouth, and hissing.[1] If this attempt to scare away the attacker fails, the black mamba will strike repeatedly, injecting large amounts of venom.
I believe the .450/400 NE in the Ruger takes a .410" bullet. I looked at that too, and the chambering seems like an excellent choice - mild recoil and effective - but it is only available in the 1H, which is 9lbs.
I didn't have an issue with recoil in my .416 RM - just over 10lbs with scope, nor with any of my .375 H&H's - including a No.1, but they were a bit too heavy for me. (before anyone suggests I hit the gym and turn that mush into muscle, I broke my back in an accident, so I'm about as muscley as I'll get). That is why I was thinking about the .350 RM as a parent case in the other thread.
Boomer - what do you mean by: "There are other top PHs, but the PH banner is applied too loosely in my opinion"?
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
As in every profession, there are those PHs who don't rate their title. It is to every client's benefit to research the safari comapny they intend to use and find out as much about their PH as possible. Most can provide refrences and it is prudent to call a few of them.
I just like the history of the big old cartridges - an example that is the same caliber and would be easier to load is the .470 Capstick.
I also think pretty much everything has been done - and done by folks who know much more on the topic than I do. Look at the short mags - RSAUM and WSM - I remember reading about a "short, fat" magnum long before these came out. IIRC it was called the .30 Warthog, and was based on a necked down and shortened .425 Westley Richards.
