Would you buy this? Importers take note:
- Thread starter Clobbersauras
- Start date
- Location
- Thunder Bay ON Canada
EH?
I don't think any amount of B.S. would convince me that stamp collecting is fun, but being a live and let live kinda guy, I'm not against that either.
I'm not much one for hockey either, but it seems to be all people live for where I call home.
Yes, I'd buy one, and at first blush 20 gauge might be preferable, but I guess I could just make up some very light loads in 12 2 3/4. Being an anacronism I'd probably want to load with black powder.
IF this firearm were widely available I'm sure it would find it's way rather quickly into cowbay action shooting in Canada, and mitigate in some way the fact that we cannot reasonably compete in the derringer catagory because of the stoopid barrel length thing.
- Excellently said!Well, here's why I would want one:
1) I loved Sean Connery in The Untouchables.
2) Short-barrelled shotguns are quite Canadian - just witness the DLASK push, etc.
3) Mad Max...eh, maybe not. I've sort of lost interest in Gibson.
4) Awsome ROF, not counting reloads...
5) It has so many cool names ready for it. I've read of Delta's calling it a "masterkey" (before the M-4 SOPMOD underbarrel became available and stole this name), and the SAS called it a Barclay's because, like the credit card, it could get you "accepted anywhere" (door-breaching, for those not "in the know"
). 6) Mr. Bale in 3:10 to Yuma...
7) That fellow who couldn't shoot in Rio Bravo (or was it the other one?).
8) One of Brendan Fraser's many great toys in The Mummy 2 (blasting a little jungle-gremlin to shreds; he wore it on his back).
9) Puts the .45 ACP and its barrel to shame as a "restricted pistol".
10) Anti-zombie, of course.
Just some ideas...
1bigrn
CGN Regular
maybe if I was a pirate
Well if I had a patch over my eye, walked on one wooden stump leg, sailed he world stealing loot and treasure and had a parrot on my left shoulder. I would take one for sure.
Otherwise it is a piece of ####e!!!
Well if I had a patch over my eye, walked on one wooden stump leg, sailed he world stealing loot and treasure and had a parrot on my left shoulder. I would take one for sure.
Otherwise it is a piece of ####e!!!
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
i love the idea, i would/
- Location
- Vancouver, BC
agreed, for the price point its a no go, price point is too high
Clobbersauras
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Waaay out west.
The price point was hypothetical..the Norc Coach goes for $350 ...
who knows maybe someone could get in for under $350...
Any importers out there care to comment? Can Am?...Marstar??
Ok now lets discuss the practicality of this design...can't talk about it in the context of Canadian laws cause for us it would only be a range gun...
So for ####$ and giggles:
I tend to think the sawed off double would make a great Defensive firearm. Loaded with 00buckshot it would be deadly at "bedroom to the kitchen" ranges". People poo poo the fact that it only has a two shell capacity but each shell contains 8 .33cal pellets. I tend to think if a laser were intalled it would be quite effective, and very menacing to any intruder...
People place too much emphasis on mag capacity anyway...shot placement is key..with this design the odds of a first shot hit are greatly increased. Also the range of shells available for shotguns makes it customizable for various situations...
You don't see much about this design on US gun boards because of the AOW (ban) thing...but if put to the test I believe the design would be quite effective in a defensive roll...easy to operate, ultra reliable, and compact enough to keep close.
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I don't know what books your reading but to think a Chinese made hammer gun is going to be ultra reliable or easy to operate in a tactical situation is a pipedream. That would be my last choice for a defensive firearm.
Yep, it's compact enough to keep close and with those hammers hanging off to get caught up in clothing or the like and no safety it's compact enough to blow your foot off.
Two triggers to contend with and if the average shooter did fire a shot throw in the bruised knuckles and then see how fast you can break the action and drop in a couple more rounds.
Shot placement with that design is a joke as it's more of a point and pray / spray.
Not a fan of the Norinco's but I'd take a tweaked HP9 with the 14" barrel any day of the week, given the price range. Nothing quite like the racking of a pump shotgun to gain some instant attention.
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WTF, may as well wade in...
I'm gonna have to back up Clobber on this one.
It's short so it'll handle well inside a house
Any monkey with a file can make a functional box-lock action, that's why they are made everywhere
Two mechanical triggers makes if there is a click, another round is just another pull on the trigger
The spread of the shot could work to your advantage in that if you are less than alert (Holy Crap it's 3am and someone's in my house) it may cover a little more of the target than a single bullet
Shot is less likely to penetrate excessively than slugs from a pistol or rifle
External hammers can act as another safety feature, don't pull them back until you're ready to shoot (a la single-action revolver)
IMHO, the Brown-Trouser Factor for any bad guy is off the charts when he sees TWO barrels pointed at him/her/it
Relatively easy to load, especially with ejectors. Two big shells go into two big holes. Stuffing a mag into a 1911 is a little tough under stress (hence bevelled mag wells, etc)
As far as 'Made in PRC' reliabilty? Everyone who shoots a Nork 1911, rasie your hand. Okay, how about a Nork 870? And a Nork SKS? Alright, now you in the back, can't you hear me? You're the only guy sitting on his hands
I'm gonna have to back up Clobber on this one.
It's short so it'll handle well inside a house
Any monkey with a file can make a functional box-lock action, that's why they are made everywhere
Two mechanical triggers makes if there is a click, another round is just another pull on the trigger
The spread of the shot could work to your advantage in that if you are less than alert (Holy Crap it's 3am and someone's in my house) it may cover a little more of the target than a single bullet
Shot is less likely to penetrate excessively than slugs from a pistol or rifle
External hammers can act as another safety feature, don't pull them back until you're ready to shoot (a la single-action revolver)
IMHO, the Brown-Trouser Factor for any bad guy is off the charts when he sees TWO barrels pointed at him/her/it
Relatively easy to load, especially with ejectors. Two big shells go into two big holes. Stuffing a mag into a 1911 is a little tough under stress (hence bevelled mag wells, etc)
As far as 'Made in PRC' reliabilty? Everyone who shoots a Nork 1911, rasie your hand. Okay, how about a Nork 870? And a Nork SKS? Alright, now you in the back, can't you hear me? You're the only guy sitting on his hands
Clobbersauras
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Waaay out west.
Let me see f I can convince you.... I'm talking about defense in the home (hense my "from the bedroom to the kitchen" reference). I would not recomend that one carry this on his person outside the house. Rarely does self defence with a firearm involve any mag changes or more than a few shots...in this situation hits and reliability count.
Here's some stats I found on the net:
First, 95% of all gunfights occur when the opponents are within 0–21 feet of each other. Of these, 20% find that the opponents are 10 to 21 feet apart, 20% when the opponents are 5 to 10 feet from each other, and 55% of the time gunfire occurs when the combatants are within 5 feet of each other.
Second, a man with a knife can cover the distance of 21 feet in 1.5 seconds or less while the average time it takes to draw a handgun from a concealed location by a trained person is closer to 2.0 seconds.
Third, most gunfights transpire in low light or minimal light conditions and last between 3 and 5 seconds.
Fourth, during those 3 to 5 seconds of the gunfight only 3 or 4 shots will be fired on average and of those shots fired only 1 in 4 will strike either one of the combatants.
So - In the dead of night, awaking from your sleep and in terror, the ability to draw, aim, and fire will be severly limited. The beauty of the sawed off is the spread of the shot and the number of pellets. If you are likely to only fire a few shots in self defence I'd rather fire two shots that held sixteen projectiles, than just three or four. Also according to the above stats, if you encounter a guy in your kitchen and he is intent on doing you harm you really have only a second before he's on top of you.
Have you ever short shucked a pump shotgun? I know I have, several times, this would be disasterous in this situation....it wouldn't happen with the sawed off...also if by chance you miss the punk with your pistol, shotgun, revolver or whatever, in the ensuing struggle he could conceivably wrestle the firearm away from you, which he could then proceed to pump all the remaining rounds into your sorry carcass..this would be much less likely with a sawed off as you'll likely get both rounds off before the dude gets to you, if you miss, well, you're on your own.
Jeff Cooper - the gun guru wrote this about the double:
A lady of our acquaintance, who lives alone, has asked us what sort of instrument is best for house defense in her case. To me the answer is easy: The "Lupara," a double-barreled 12-gauge shotgun with exposed hammers and short barrels. I understand the term Lupara is Sicilian and means approximately "wolf killer." Such a piece is enormously authoritative, it is easy to use, it requires minimal training in its management, and it may be left loaded and uncocked indefinitely on the closet shelf. The only precaution is to seal the muzzles with scotch tape or cotton wool to avoid the building of nests in the barrels by little varmints.
Such items are available from Rossi and Baikal, though you may have to hunt around for them at gun shows. Usually they are very reasonable in price.
Sorry - if you really look at the data the old double may not be as cool as the pump but it will get the job done, efficiently and effectively....
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Clobbersauras
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Waaay out west.
Detective Ricardo Tubbs approves this thread
Awesome..LOL
