Wow do i ever hate my XCR....

VanIsler said:
A crap you're right I have heard those arguments as well.
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The weight or proprietary (5-round) magazines aren't necessarily deal killers, either; after all, you are getting a high-quality steel rifle. Fit and finish is excellent on the SA, as well. And if it wasn't for our stupid magazine-neutering firearm laws, the magazine thing would be moot. You can get a NEA lower that accepts AR magazines - but by this point you'll easily be into it for $4k.

And honestly, at that point I'd be seriously considering alternatives like an ACR, Tavor or FS2000.
 
Hmm im kind of curious about this so called play now, hes talking about the connection between the upper and lower being super wobbly I am assuming? I have a newer one myself, and i can wiggle it and it seems to shift ever so slightly, but otherwise feels pretty solid, Im guessing I got lucky in terms of the play?
 
Zargon said:
I'm surprised the fan boys haven't found this thread yet ;)
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Lol just wait.For what its worth im not asking for anyone to do anything.I was simply just posting in a rant over why i hate my XCR lol.As i said before the play is significant.Ive owned a Norc M4 and a Oly arms lower with misc upper so i completely and utterly understand that there is going to be play between uppers and lowers.This is worse then the sloppiest AR ive ever handled.You can literally shake it and hear the rattle and no its not the gas tube.I guess it just is what it is.Gonna put it hard through its paces tomorrow(with the foam plug idea) and decide from there what to do with it.
 
Steve Janes said:
Some would consider this to be an advantage.

The frequency, and commonality of AR mags is UN-questionable. They are EVERYWHERE, and most black rifles/military rifles use AR mags. However, even with the MAJOR improvements that have been achieved over the years, the AR magazine in all of it's forms is still inherently flawed. That is why they've been trying to fix them for such a long time.

Swiss mags on the other hand, have been flawless since they were designed, in function, but they have there disadvantages as well, like being Bulky, from what I have heard, the biggest complaint among unit's these rifles are issued to around the world, is the magazines, and trying to fit them in pouches.
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blaxsun said:
On what planet?
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beltfed said:
Are you serious? The AR-15 magazine is the platforms' biggest disadvantage and literally it's achilles heal.
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On this planet;) You know, the one where people know how to read.
Thank you Beltfed!

K1ng C said:
I guess it just is what it is.
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I ask again, did you buy it new??? Where did you buy it from??? Was it Wolverine? If so, phone them and deal with them directly, they WILL fix everything for you, and do so until you are satisfied, they do excellent business.
 
Buy a dd. I get a kick out of my buddies. They invariably say "that's a nice looking rifle " then grab it and try and wiggle the stock. It doesn't move so they try and wiggle the the upper and lower and it doesn't move. Lol.

Then they shoot it and then they ask where they can get one. Unfortunately I tell them right now I don't think they can.
 
I know in the past there have been terrible AR/STANAG mags but as long as you buy quality now there shouldn't be any problems.
 
swbw2000 said:
This is news to me as well. I'd like to hear some explanation.
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Seriously guys, just try looking it up, the internet is covered with legit articles about the inherent flaws of AR mags. I'm not going to do all your research and reading for you, but for starters you could try an encyclopedia!

"The STANAG-compatible box magazine, while relatively compact compared to other types of 5.56x45mm NATO box magazines, has often been criticized for a perceived lack of durability and a tendency to malfunction unless treated with a level of care that often cannot be afforded under combat conditions. Because STANAG 4179 is only a dimensional standard, production quality from manufacturer to manufacturer is not uniform. Magazines have been manufactured with lightweight aluminum or plastic bodies and other inexpensive materials in order to keep costs down, or to meet requirements that treat the magazine more as a disposable piece of equipment than one that is supposed to stand up to repeated combat use.

These problems have been addressed by several manufacturers, most notably Heckler & Koch, who designed a new 30-round STANAG-compatible box magazine during their contract to rebuild and improve the SA80 rifle for the United Kingdom. As a result, several manufacturers now offer improved STANAG-compatible magazines as well as high-grade stainless steel bodies, rust- and set-resistant chrome-silicon springs, and anti-tilt followers as upgrade components for existing STANAG magazines."

And yes there's PMAGS too.

To each there own I guess, I never even claimed I preferred one or the other, I just simply stated that SOME may consider NONE AR mags to be an advantage! This is just a very very small tidbit of information as to why some people may feel that way
 
Even with pmags, there is the issue with bolt override on an unseated mag.
There is a reason it is called tap-rack ;)
Sure you are very unlikely to have that with a 5 round, neutered mag on a nice clean firing point. However, run full 30 rounders in in any type of adversary conditions and you will have mag issues.

Cammed locking mags are a better design.
 
My SA has as much play as my XCR L, the M is slightly tighter than either. It is very minimal with all of them, they just wiggle, but don't rattle at all. Get Wolverine to check it out.
 
blaxsun said:
Put it up for sale on the EE. Sure there will be someone more than happy to take it off your hands - and for a small hit you can then get the Swiss Arms you originally wanted.
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K1ng C said:
Thats exactly what i will be doing.Thanks!
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If its a XCR-M you might even make some cash. Wolverine isn't expecting their next shipment till April and I'll bet they're spoken for.
 
Steve Janes said:
Seriously guys, just try looking it up, the internet is covered with legit articles about the inherent flaws of AR mags. I'm not going to do all your research and reading for you, but for starters you could try an encyclopedia!
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Honestly, I couldn't find any - other than references to "crappy" STANAG magazines. If you have a link that includes comparisons with modern (and apparently great) magazines such as the PMAG, EMAG or Lancer - please feel free to share. I like my steel HK magazines, but I've heard from a few reputable sources on CGN that they're not at all reliable in the field. And then we have all the cheap aluminium stuff (including LAR-15's) on the other end of the spectrum. So really, what's a person to believe?
 
Perhaps posting a video would enlighten us on the "give" that the unit has?

I am thinking about getting a unit and have some misgivings about the number of issues that people are having.
 
blaxsun said:
Honestly, I couldn't find any - other than references to "crappy" STANAG magazines. If you have a link that includes comparisons with modern (and apparently great) magazines such as the PMAG, EMAG or Lancer - please feel free to share. I like my steel HK magazines, but I've heard from a few reputable sources on CGN that they're not at all reliable in the field. And then we have all the cheap aluminium stuff (including LAR-15's) on the other end of the spectrum. So really, what's a person to believe?
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"As late as 2005, American Rifleman Magazine reported: The M-16 and variants are too plagued by jamming due to the magazine design."

http://www.dlsports.com/ar15_extreme_duty_magazines.html
 
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