You and a Man Eating Tiger - What Rifle?

[Gibbs505]

Definately a double rifle. You can shoot the second shot before you can cycle a bolt. Corbett did well with the 450/400, though anything from 375 Flanged/369 Purdey and up would be fine IMO. I have the Omnibus and it is a must read. I had no desire to go to India before I read it, but now I want to climb the mountains, walk the trails, and fish the rivers in Northern India where Corbett had his adventures. Seems I was born 80 years too late. Imagine hunting India and Africa in the '20's.

I too have dreamed that same dream. Sucks dosen't it being born a 100 years late!!

 

[Noel]

I too have dreamed that same dream. Sucks dosen't it being born a 100 years late!!

Funny, my wife says that about me almost daily!

As Gene Autry used to sing, "Take me back to my boots, and saddle...."

My little girl asks to hear that tune each night at bedtime, bless her heart.

There was good reason for those boys packing the doubles and it wasn't because they were ###y, the fastest follow up possible.

I handled a guy's hand-built 4 bore double a couple years ago. I imagine a slug that fat might slow it down to where it just turns into a frieght train and runs you over instead of tearing you to bits after.

 

[K98]

I too have dreamed that same dream. Sucks dosen't it being born a 100 years late!!

Back in those days the maneater's could freely pick off any local inhabitant they felt like. Now half the people in those same countries are walking around with army uniform's and assault rifles.

 

[slicknick]

A double in something very heavy. Heavy enough to flatten a kitty in about .02 of a second

 

[Gibbs505]

A double in something very heavy. Heavy enough to flatten a kitty in about .02 of a second

Corbet shot the Chowgarh Tiger, which had a record of 64 kills, at a measured distance of 8 feet!! He had to hold his 275 Rigby in one had as he was holding birds eggs in the other!!Then he had to swing the rifle in an arc, one handed, so that the barrel was pointing at the tiger then, still one handed, pull the trigger!!

You gotta read his stories!!

 

[p-17]

Here's an interesting personal tidbit that is relevant to this thread.

I grew up reading the books of Jim Corbett. To this day, I think he is the greatest outdoor writer and adventurer I've ever read. In my personal opinion, guys like Elmer Keith are just macho posers compared to Corbett, who was the real deal as a hunter, shooter, humanitarian and conservationist, not to mention a truly masterful writer.

Here was a fellow who was such a calm, accurate and confident shooter that he only carried three cartridges. And he was in some dangerous country, man, surrounded by King Cobras, and man-eating beasts of different varieties.

For me, the greatest single adrenaline-filled moment in all of the outdoor writing I've ever read is the final showdown with the Mama tiger in the tale of the Chowgarh maneaters. At the end of an incredible stalk and counter-stalk, Corbett's sixth sense tells him that the maneating tiger he's been stalking has out-stalked him and is crouching behind him. He knows intuitively that if he turns to look, the movement will spook the animal and it will jump him. What does he do?

This is one of those rare cases where having a big gun would have gotten him killed because of its cumbersome length and weight. Fortunately, he was carrying a super lightweight Rigby Mauser in .275 (aka 7x57). The rifle was sort of comparable to our modern mountain rifle concept. What Corbett did was literally raise the rifle out in front of him with one hand then slowly twisted it up and backward like a wand so that it ended up pointing behind him. Can you imagine the kind of strength and calm it would have taken to do this, knowing that the wrong muscle twitch would be the end? Even more surprsingly, he managed to fire the rifle... and he HIT THE TIGER IN THE HEART JUST AS IT WAS ABOUT TO SPRING!!!

Eventually, I had to get myself a lightweight 7x57 in tribute to this incredible man. When I was offered an FN-made Brazillian '98 military carbine in 7x57, I didn't even take a moment to decide. It's no Rigby Mauser, but it is similar in spirit and mechanics to Corbett's rifle. And the cartridge is certainly the same.

Personally, if I had to hunt big tigers in the jungle, I'd want at least a .375 Holland & Holland or anything that would be appropriate for a big grizzly. However, the idealistic part of my thinks that the job could be done in style with a 175-grain bullet pushed by 49 grains of WC 852 from my Mauser

 

[Luger9]

The best rifle would be the one in my hand, at the ready....before the tiger attacks.

Other than that, as I always say, it's not the rifle it's the shooter. Can't hit too much if you're concentrating on the warm stuff running down your leg.


Edit: It will take a tiger approx. 2.05 seconds to cover 50 yds....it takes the average person 1.5-2 seconds to break the first shot off a pistol....imagine aiming a rifle. That is a situation I do not want to be in.

 

[josquin]

This doesn't answer your question - I think Sunray did that - but it is an interesting read.

There is an article by Garry James in the 2000 G&A Annual on the double-barrelled "Howdah" pistol, chambered for the .577 Snider cartridge, intended for this very purpose when hunting from atop an elephant. Although the pistol doesn't figure in the following account, James quotes the experience of the contemporary writer George Trevelyan ("The Competition Wallah", 1864). It really gives the flavour of the era, just as Jim Corbett's writings do of 50-70 years later. (Square bracketed comments mine):

"The howdah consists of a box of wood and wickerwork, open at top, with sides [seats?] in front for the Sahib and a remarkably uncomfortable one behind for the attendant. On either side of the sportsman rests his firearms; a double-barrelled rifle and two smooth-bores loaded with ball, and one gun with a couple of charges of 'Nº4' or 'B.B.' shot for partidge or jungle fowl. As most of the firing consists of snapshots within 50 yards, a good smoothbore is every whit as effective as a grooved barrel. In a little partition in front of the howdah the ammunition lies ready to hand. Your dress is simple: a flannel shirt; the trousers of your college boat club, the wash-leather lining of which is very grateful towards the close of a long day, a pair of canvas shoes, and an enormous pith-hat with a thick pad hanging down your back which gives you the appearance of a sporting mushroom growing in a flower-pot." [Hadn't this fella heard of Cabela's? ]

Trevelyan then goes on to describe his encounter with a "royal Nepaul tiger" which had been located in the brush not 10 yards away. "Quick as thought came the report of all our rifles, and more than one red spot appeared on his tawny flank. With a roar, a flash of his tail, and one tremendous bound, he was among us. I have a very dim recollection of what followed. Bullets were whizzing all around, Tom firing over my shoulder and Benson into my howdah; the tiger at one time on the head of Mildred's elephant [ who the heck is Mildred??], at another between the legs of mine; our beasts trumpeting and plunging and rolling; the rank and file scampering away in ungovernable terror. At the end of what seemed 10 minutes, and was perhaps 90 seconds, the tiger lay dead amongst the trampled grass."

Ahhh.. hunting in the good old days.

Stuart

 

[Ahsan Ahmed]

It was all iron sights kills too wasn't it!? Or was the scope starting to be common in the 1920's?

Only irons and no optics......jungle lore and nerves of steel were the driving factors.

To learn more about Jim Corbett, one should start with his book "My India" and "Jungle Lore"

 

[stewarch]

Wow - a tiger defence thread. That's a whole lot better than all that old bear defence crap!

Anyway, good read. Loved all the Jim Corbett stories. When I was a kid there was a hunting magazine that dad got that had a story about him or by him every month. Can't remember the name tho. Must go try and dig out my copy of "My India" and give it a re-read!

 

[Ahsan Ahmed]

Ahsan: Read the Corbett Omnibus ....

Believe the Omnibus is comprised of the three diferent books that I mentioned earlier? In fact I have had the pleasure of reading all his books and had those in my collection during the 70's.

As stated by others.....one can't help dream being in that kind of environment in the early 20th century......I know as I come from that part of the world In a way, I was somewhat fortunate enough to catch the almost fading edge of that "golden age of Shikar" (read big game hunting during late 60s) when my father and uncles were going out with double rifles after rouge elephants, nuisance leopards and at times crocodiles that were posing a threat to villagers.

 

[Gibbs505]

Believe the Omnibus is comprised of the three diferent books that I mentioned earlier? In fact I have had the pleasure of reading all his books and had those in my collection during the 70's.

As stated by others.....one can't help dream being in that kind of environment in the early 20th century......I know as I come from that part of the world In a way, I was somewhat fortunate enough to catch the almost fading edge of that "golden age of Shikar" (read big game hunting during late 60s) when my father and uncles were going out with double rifles after rouge elephants, nuisance leopards and at times crocodiles that were posing a threat to villagers.

Sir, you where truly blessed!

 

[PeakXV]

I guess I'd have to use my marlin 336 in .35 rem with 200 grain. I'm not 100% sure if it would stop him but am very accurate with it - so a chest cavity or shoulder shot would be possible. Although I am not sure how the big Cat's head swings and/or protects it's vitals when it is running. The gun has almost zero kick and I'm quite sure I could get 2 shots off.

Looking back on the Corbett era, I wonder if the advancement in shooting technology is slowly making us less hunters and more complacent shooters
as the years go on?

 

[PeakXV]

Definately a double rifle. You can shoot the second shot before you can cycle a bolt. Corbett did well with the 450/400, though anything from 375 Flanged/369 Purdey and up would be fine IMO. I have the Omnibus and it is a must read. I had no desire to go to India before I read it, but now I want to climb the mountains, walk the trails, and fish the rivers in Northern India where Corbett had his adventures. Seems I was born 80 years too late. Imagine hunting India and Africa in the '20's.

A walk in Corbett's footsteps would indeed be a trip of a lifetime. The Valley of Flowers region which is the heart of many of Corbett's Tiger
hunts is a nice little trek and a good lure .... for the wife's consent!

http://www.garhwaltourism.com/valley/

 

[Ahsan Ahmed]

Looking back on the Corbett era, I wonder if the advancement in shooting technology is slowly making us less hunters and more complacent shooters as the years go on?

A solid point......one specific ocurrance comes to mind (Temple Tiger book?), where Col. Corbett takes a couple of mountain goats using a new rifle (a .270?) at 200 yrds using iron sights. Believe he failed in his attempt earlier to shoot the temple tiger (with the same rifle) despite drawing a bead on the animal as he did not realize at that point that it's trigger had a double pull

For those of us who have watched the "Ghost and the Darkness"......offers an idea how much skill, courage and understanding the mindset of the animal was required....when it came to stalking a man-eater in it's own backyard.....there weren't any "Surefire lights attached to fancy shotguns" around

Sir, you where truly blessed!

Guess that would apply more to my Father and Uncles

Now I would be blessed if I could get a couple remaining double rifles (a .470 Westley and a .375 H&H) and some 12ga shotguns out to Canada via overcoming the excruciating bureaucratic gauntlet prevailing over there. One of my uncle also has a .500 Jeffrey double rifle that he no longer has a need for - those are all hammerless double express rifles in excellent condition

From a practical view point - don't see much use at all for those in the NA continent as the Grizzly or Polar may be the only worthy adversary for such rifles.

 

[josquin]

... Looking back on the Corbett era, I wonder if the advancement in shooting technology is slowly making us less hunters and more complacent shooters as the years go on?

I don't know, but remember that from a very young age Corbett "lived and breathed" the forests where he hunted and knew the animals' ways like the back of his hand. I recall reading that as a very young man he was given the use of a Martini rifle and ammunition ("on the condition he keep the gun clean"), so he had the opportunity for daily practice. He also didn't have a Mon.- Fri office job from which he could occasionally escape for a weekend in the woods- working amongst the animals and hunting them WAS his day job, so he had a leg up on most of us right from the start.

Despite that, I remember a couple of passages in the book I have (The Man-Eaters of Kumaon) where he admits to missing his target at surprisingly close range.

Stuart

 

[josquin]

...Now I would be blessed if I could get a couple remaining double rifles (a .470 Westley and a .375 H&H) and some 12ga shotguns out to Canada via overcoming the excruciating bureaucratic gauntlet prevailing over there. One of my uncle also has a .500 Jeffrey double rifle that he no longer has a need for - those are all hammerless double express rifles in excellent condition

I think several CGN'ers, including 505 Gibbs, just had a stroke.

From a practical view point - don't see much use at all for those in the NA continent as the Grizzly or Polar may be the only worthy adversary for such rifles.

True, but as many of us realized years ago, practicality is not often a major impetus in acquiring firearms! I remember handling a .470 Nitro double rifle at the big gun show in Coquitlam two years ago. I didn't buy it, of course, but I could feel my eyes glazing over.

Stuart

 

[Vic777]

50yds. away at full throttle .... you're DEAD!
But ...
I'd try to get my S&W 500 into the fight.
(might be able to get one into his chest as he bowls me over)
Same thing as a Grizzly from 50 yrds away at full throttle with no warning, you're dead.
I'd want a handgun for these scenarios, rifle too unweildy.
(need double action or semi-auto, no time for multiple shots with bolt action)

 

[Grouse Man]

Bren.

 

[Barracuda]

pretty much all my spot and stalk hunting has been with my 375H&H CRF mod 70. If i were in that situation that is exactly what i would use as i am most familier with it. I am fast ,accurate and automatic with it .