I was at the range a week ago and i saw a dood with a nice tavor with a sweet vortex ,bench rested shooting targets at 200 meters. He also had like a 3000 dollar spotting scope. After he sighted in he was shooting the gong , bench rested with a few hits. Next to him was this big guy with an ar 15 rapid firing beawulf mags like crazy. He then started smoking the gong, standing up, bing, bing,bing...... The guy with the tavor packed up and left really fast.
Tavor vs AR
- Thread starter LMWIS
- Start date
If non restricted is a concern then the Tavor is a good option. There are better options in my opinion but you asked about the Tavor and AR so other than bashing the T97 shortly in reply to the guys that brought it up as a option I'll leave the rest out.
To start I own 5 AR's and have owned many more previously and have only shot 4 Tavor's and one T-97. Take my opinion for what it's worth based on that.
From the experience I have with the Tavor I like the rifle but it doesn't do anything that makes it a must have for me. The biggest thing it has going for it is that it's non restricted.
For me the Tavor is not a $2700 rifle, if it was $1500-$2000 new I might take a look at it again.
If you don't care that it's restricted then the AR wins in almost every category you wish to compare the two. A Tavor will never be as accurate as an AR. Even a cheap $900 AR will out shoot a Tavor.
Ergonomics wise it's all a matter of what you are comfortable with and what you train with. Both rifles can be very effective with practice.
The comments earlier about them both being military grade battle rifles and if it can hit a man size target in the torso it's doing just what it was designed to do is 100% correct. The flaw in using this to justify the poor accuracy of the Tavor only shooting at best 1.5 moa once you try 10 different types of ammo and finally find the one it likes best is that an AR will shoot that well with almost any ammo and most of them will shoot 1 moa or better if you do the same trials and find the ammo it really likes.
Now on to why you shouldn't buy a Norinco T-97. The biggest reason to not even consider the T-97 is that in my opinion it is a disposable rifle. Try to find parts or try to get warranty service. That's right there is none. If your $900 rifle breaks you are SOL. Your only option is to buy another one and use the old one for parts.
If you want to add optics to the T-97 you need to spend another $400 for the flat top upper which turns your $900 disposable rifle into a $1300 disposable rifle.
As for the safety? I don't care, I don't use the safety often, with 5 or 10 round mags I shoot till the rifle is empty and then it's safe.
The mag release? Don't care. I don't compete and in my world there are no gold stars for who can change mags the fastest. I'm sure with practice one could become proficient with it.
They are fun and non restricted and at one time I was going to buy one but then I thought about it and realized that even at $850-$900 that is a lot of cash for a rifle with no support. With an M14 or a Norc M-forgery at least you can get parts for those. The T-97 I shot was actually not too bad for accuracy and I was able to hit the gongs at 100 yards standing freehand using the iron sights fairly regularly.
The best thing you can do is find some guys that will let you shoot their rifles before you purchase one and decide which one you want based on your own experience with them. Be practical and leave your inner mall ninja at home. If you won't be competing in 3-gun or CQB matches you really don't need the most compact and maneuverable rifle. If you are going to be shooting from the bench most of the time and like making small groups then you probably want an AR. If you want to take it out in the bush or to gravel pits then the Tavor is your choice. Also keep in mind that even a short barrel AR which balances out the maneuverability contest will still out shoot a Tavor. My 12 inch barreled AR will shoot sub moa with 75gr match factory loads and the loss in velocity means nothing at the range as the terminal ballistics mean nothing, I've killed every piece of paper I've shot at and that's good enough. Even my 6.5 inch AR was capable of 2 moa with good ammo (sold it).
Non of us can tell you which rifle is best for you. Only you can decide that.
Good luck
To start I own 5 AR's and have owned many more previously and have only shot 4 Tavor's and one T-97. Take my opinion for what it's worth based on that.
From the experience I have with the Tavor I like the rifle but it doesn't do anything that makes it a must have for me. The biggest thing it has going for it is that it's non restricted.
For me the Tavor is not a $2700 rifle, if it was $1500-$2000 new I might take a look at it again.
If you don't care that it's restricted then the AR wins in almost every category you wish to compare the two. A Tavor will never be as accurate as an AR. Even a cheap $900 AR will out shoot a Tavor.
Ergonomics wise it's all a matter of what you are comfortable with and what you train with. Both rifles can be very effective with practice.
The comments earlier about them both being military grade battle rifles and if it can hit a man size target in the torso it's doing just what it was designed to do is 100% correct. The flaw in using this to justify the poor accuracy of the Tavor only shooting at best 1.5 moa once you try 10 different types of ammo and finally find the one it likes best is that an AR will shoot that well with almost any ammo and most of them will shoot 1 moa or better if you do the same trials and find the ammo it really likes.
Now on to why you shouldn't buy a Norinco T-97. The biggest reason to not even consider the T-97 is that in my opinion it is a disposable rifle. Try to find parts or try to get warranty service. That's right there is none. If your $900 rifle breaks you are SOL. Your only option is to buy another one and use the old one for parts.
If you want to add optics to the T-97 you need to spend another $400 for the flat top upper which turns your $900 disposable rifle into a $1300 disposable rifle.
As for the safety? I don't care, I don't use the safety often, with 5 or 10 round mags I shoot till the rifle is empty and then it's safe.
The mag release? Don't care. I don't compete and in my world there are no gold stars for who can change mags the fastest. I'm sure with practice one could become proficient with it.
They are fun and non restricted and at one time I was going to buy one but then I thought about it and realized that even at $850-$900 that is a lot of cash for a rifle with no support. With an M14 or a Norc M-forgery at least you can get parts for those. The T-97 I shot was actually not too bad for accuracy and I was able to hit the gongs at 100 yards standing freehand using the iron sights fairly regularly.
The best thing you can do is find some guys that will let you shoot their rifles before you purchase one and decide which one you want based on your own experience with them. Be practical and leave your inner mall ninja at home. If you won't be competing in 3-gun or CQB matches you really don't need the most compact and maneuverable rifle. If you are going to be shooting from the bench most of the time and like making small groups then you probably want an AR. If you want to take it out in the bush or to gravel pits then the Tavor is your choice. Also keep in mind that even a short barrel AR which balances out the maneuverability contest will still out shoot a Tavor. My 12 inch barreled AR will shoot sub moa with 75gr match factory loads and the loss in velocity means nothing at the range as the terminal ballistics mean nothing, I've killed every piece of paper I've shot at and that's good enough. Even my 6.5 inch AR was capable of 2 moa with good ammo (sold it).
Non of us can tell you which rifle is best for you. Only you can decide that.
Good luck
Leviathan024
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- GP Alberta
You will end up with both so get the non restricted first and the ar when your rpal arrives. Every one always ends up with at least 1 ar
very true, i walked the same path.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
For what its worth, this. Someday soon I will have to buck up and pick up one of those Colt 6920 AR's. I want one so bad, but I just have a hard time justifying it because I live on a farm.
yah, they sure are good shooters though, been playing with mine for a month now!
G-Man_Quagmire
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- North Delta B.C.
That's pretty damn funny.
I can never justify the price of the Vortex Razor series, for that price I'll buy another Nightforce. I do like their Viper series though, seems like good glass and some nice features for the price.
Don't get me started on the mini-14. I've heard the new ones are better than the older ones and I certainly hope so, I couldn't get rid of mine fast enough (older stainless ranch 1:7 twist, I think it was a 1987 rifle).
Better than an SU-16 or a T-97 but not much.
I need to try one of the newer ones and see how they shoot. The one I had was minute of barn door. It was reliable though if you used quality magazines.
atomicslave
Regular
- Location
- Ottawa, Ontario
I own a Tavor and a AR, I would take the Tavor any day. As for accuracy its just as good as my US made AR. There is nothing wrong with the AR platform if your range shooting 100% of the time then its a better buy for sure (note that you can get a tavor off the EE for around 2100 or new for 2375 plus tax some places). For me I love the bull pup everything on it is right where it feels it should be and I can take it anywhere, shoot at my friends farm, camping on crown land, the cottage anywhere so thats a huge win.
Where are these places where I can get a new Tavor at such a small price?
2100$ used on the EE on occasion and 2375$ + tax new when they go on sale at some shops.
The Tavor is not a precision rifle by any means but a person would think the 18.5" barrel would give it a bit more accuracy then the 16" AR barrels. I know i'm not looking to head shot gophers at 500 yards with it but a centre mass at 200-300 yards is more then good for my shooting enjoyment. The reliability and easy of use is also superior to an AR from my looking at reviews on the interweb. Plus its a bullpup and unique rifle that everyone will be asking you to shoot it when they see you with it.
I used my Noveske AR at the June CQB couse put on by Barney AKA Tactical Teacher.
I put nearly 500 rounds through it in 2 days without cleaning it and I didn't have even one jam, misfeed, or any other failure of any kind.
I didn't do anything other than run it wet when we started on Saturday Morning.
I don't know how many rounds it would have taken to get it dirty enough to fail but for my needs it is flawless.
A quality rifle should run reliably with no excuses.
I put nearly 500 rounds through it in 2 days without cleaning it and I didn't have even one jam, misfeed, or any other failure of any kind.
I didn't do anything other than run it wet when we started on Saturday Morning.
I don't know how many rounds it would have taken to get it dirty enough to fail but for my needs it is flawless.
A quality rifle should run reliably with no excuses.
