Fort McMurray members: Who wants to shoot a new Garand today

To bad I only now seen this. Was out there today (this afternoon around 3 pm), not sure if you where there then or earlier. Would have stopped in to have a look (I was at the handgun range), as they (looked at another thread) very nice looking rifles.
 
Sadly I can't make it Saturday, I've let my range membership expire. Your own Garand arsenal sounds awesome!! racks upon racks of sweet sweet guns oh my god its heavenly! I might be insane too you should see my gunroom haha sometimes I fall asleep in there!
 
Squinty said:
Rampant ignorance is not my problem.
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Nor is rampant modesty it seems.

Gina Lollobrigida is now 87 years old, but she was great in her time. I liked her in "Trapeze" and "Come September", which I saw with one of my first dates. She was in her prime 60 years ago when Beretta and Breda were building their Garands, so maybe that's the connection. The Italian Garands have certainly held up better than her over time. I've owned quite a number of them and have never found an unserviceable receiver among them. They were built to a high quality line by established small arms makers without the pressure of wartime needs and the Danes maintained excellent technical control of them when they had them in service. They are always a good bet when building or buying a "shooter" Garand.

Garand aficionados can take a number of different paths depending on their interests. Collectors and shooters often follow different paths, but there are a lot of folks who like a foot in both areas. A good barrel is always the heart of a good shooting rifle and the Krieger commercial barrels are the best available, with the heavy barrel being the best bet for accuracy. After the barrel it's a matter of getting the best stock and handguard fit for top accuracy with special attention paid to the fit of the op rod, lower band and gas cylinder. Folks can even go a step further and try to emulate the US National Match rifles with additional work done per National match specs, incl glass bedding the stock and fitting NM sights. After that the best shooting will come with properly prepared handloads using match grade bullets.

Collector grade Garands are in a different realm with emphasis placed on originality and condition of parts with a premium paid for WW2 production Springfields and Winchesters, all other things being equal. In this case the top ranking is for original condition rifles as produced by the arsenal, rare pieces indeed as most Garands were rebuilt at least once in military use with parts replaced as necessary. Next come bona-fide military arsenal rebuilds with proper arsenal markings on the stocks. Restorations using correct USGI parts appropriate to the receiver date and maker are ranked third. The general order of values are the WW2 rifles followed by the post-war International Harvester and Harrington & Richardson rifles which were produced in smaller quantities than the post-war Springfields. After that it is the post-war Springfields followed by the Italian Beretta and Breda rifles. M1C (very small numbers produced relative to total Garands built), USMC 1952 and M1D sniper rifles have a higher collector valuation as do bona-fide National Match rifles. Shooter type Garands with commercial parts are valued as shooters, rather than as collector pieces, and are generally worth the sum of the parts.

Military condition Garands can be excellent shooters provided that the barrel is sound, stock/handguard fit is tight and loose in the right places, sights are tight and the op rod, lower band and gas cylinder are properly fitting. The military LMR barrels, as used on the International Harvester rifles, as well as the Danish VAR barrels have a good reputation for accuracy. All of the other barrels can be good too, provided that they aren't excessively worn, especially at the muzzle, and that the crown is good. Quality handloads help a lot. The military did not require tack driver accuracy from these rifles. They were designed and built as fighting rifles so functionality was equally important (and the military didn't screw around, at least not with their rifles). You can generally expect 2-2.5 MOA accuracy from a Garand in military condition with handloads provided that the rifle has an unworn barrel, is mechanically sound, and is properly set up. As an old soldier I like the challenge of wringing the best possible accuracy out of my MILSURPs in as issued condition. Shooting itty-bitty sub-MOA groups is always nice, but I reserve that for scoped, heavy barrel bolt guns which are built specifically for this.
 
purple said:
Nor is rampant modesty it seems.

Gina Lollobrigida is now 87 years old, but she was great in her time. I liked her in "Trapeze" and "Come September", which I saw with one of my first dates. She was in her prime 60 years ago when Beretta and Breda were building their Garands, so maybe that's the connection. The Italian Garands have certainly held up better than her over time. I've owned quite a number of them and have never found an unserviceable receiver among them. They were built to a high quality line by established small arms makers without the pressure of wartime needs and the Danes maintained excellent technical control of them when they had them in service. They are always a good bet when building or buying a "shooter" Garand.

Garand aficionados can take a number of different paths depending on their interests. Collectors and shooters often follow different paths, but there are a lot of folks who like a foot in both areas. A good barrel is always the heart of a good shooting rifle and the Krieger commercial barrels are the best available, with the heavy barrel being the best bet for accuracy. After the barrel it's a matter of getting the best stock and handguard fit for top accuracy with special attention paid to the fit of the op rod, lower band and gas cylinder. Folks can even go a step further and try to emulate the US National Match rifles with additional work done per National match specs, incl glass bedding the stock and fitting NM sights. After that the best shooting will come with properly prepared handloads using match grade bullets.

Collector grade Garands are in a different realm with emphasis placed on originality and condition of parts with a premium paid for WW2 production Springfields and Winchesters, all other things being equal. In this case the top ranking is for original condition rifles as produced by the arsenal, rare pieces indeed as most Garands were rebuilt at least once in military use with parts replaced as necessary. Next come bona-fide military arsenal rebuilds with proper arsenal markings on the stocks. Restorations using correct USGI parts appropriate to the receiver date and maker are ranked third. The general order of values are the WW2 rifles followed by the post-war International Harvester and Harrington & Richardson rifles which were produced in smaller quantities than the post-war Springfields. After that it is the post-war Springfields followed by the Italian Beretta and Breda rifles. M1C (very small numbers produced relative to total Garands built), USMC 1952 and M1D sniper rifles have a higher collector valuation as do bona-fide National Match rifles. Shooter type Garands with commercial parts are valued as shooters, rather than as collector pieces, and are generally worth the sum of the parts.

Military condition Garands can be excellent shooters provided that the barrel is sound, stock/handguard fit is tight and loose in the right places, sights are tight and the op rod, lower band and gas cylinder are properly fitting. The military LMR barrels, as used on the International Harvester rifles, as well as the Danish VAR barrels have a good reputation for accuracy. All of the other barrels can be good too, provided that they aren't excessively worn, especially at the muzzle, and that the crown is good. Quality handloads help a lot. The military did not require tack driver accuracy from these rifles. They were designed and built as fighting rifles so functionality was equally important (and the military didn't screw around, at least not with their rifles). You can generally expect 2-2.5 MOA accuracy from a Garand in military condition with handloads provided that the rifle has an unworn barrel, is mechanically sound, and is properly set up. As an old soldier I like the challenge of wringing the best possible accuracy out of my MILSURPs in as issued condition. Shooting itty-bitty sub-MOA groups is always nice, but I reserve that for scoped, heavy barrel bolt guns which are built specifically for this.
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Have you ever before been described as verbose? Or maybe you are just a jealous schmoe.
 
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Purple, thanks for writing all that, very informative. I just learned more about Garands in that post than I have in everything written, I have seen anyway, on this site yet.

Beautiful rifle Squinty!
 
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giwolf said:
Purple, thanks for writing all that, very informative. I just learned more about Garands in that post than I have in everything written, I have seen anyway, on this site yet.

Beautiful rifle Squinty!
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There are some very good references available on the Garand, both for technical and collector/historical aspects.

The best technical reference, bar none, is "The U.S. .30 Caliber Service Rifles", by Jerry Kuhnhausen. This book also contains a wealth of detail on the M14 rifle which is useful for Norinco M14 clone owners. It is available on line from Brownells for $44.99, and is money well spent. Another good one is a reprint of US Army TM9-1275 which covers military inspection and repair procedures on the Garand in detail. I lucked onto an original copy of this one when it was discarded from a CF technical library nearly 40 yrs ago.

For historical and collector/shooter information I'd recommend all of the following;

Hatcher's Book of the Garand - Brownell's -$19.99
Scott Duff's red book on the WW2 Garand- $35 (google Scott Duff)
Scott Duff's blue book on the post war Garands (a bit dated now, but useful)- $22
Scott Duff's M1 Garand Users Guide- $20

Bruce Canfield has also recently put out a very comprehensive book on the M1 Garand which sells for around $100. it is a real masterpiece and even covers the Italian Garands and the Argentine made prototype Garand which I got to examine in the National Arms Museum in Buenos Aires earlier this year. I found my copy under the Christmas tree last year.;)

I've seen all of these books for sale on ebay at one time or another. Just do an ebay search for "garand" and see what pops up.

You can also go on line to join the Garand Collectors Association. They issue members a copy of the Garand Collectors Journal every 3 months.
 
Squinty said:
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Well I happen to be one of those cost conscious underwearers that takes great offense to your stereotyping - and have logged complaints with the management! Hell's Bells...who can afford clean underwear after buying one of these ammo gobbling pigs?!?!

How about a range report with some pics Squinty? I for one love the old Garands and appreciate the efforts of enthusiansts that keep them alive.
 
Hey squinty lets trade lol
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Squinty said:
My last three rifles were built with Krieger barrels. I used Krieger barrels because they are the finest gun barrel made in the world today.

A Krieger Garand barrel is also the finest barrel that has ever graced a Garand. I used Krieger barrels. because I don't screw around.

Before installing a barrel, there 17 separate inspection and gauging operations before a receiver is deemed acceptable. I take a lot of trouble, because I don't screw around.
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I have been considering a new barrel for my Garand, maybe try and squeeze a lil more accuracy out of the old beast, what kind of accuracy can one expect out of the Krieger barrels as opposed to a USGI barrel?
 
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