Apprentice Hunters - Should They Share In The Spoils?

Glock4ever said:
I think you are not understanding why this thread is problematical...
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1) The OP's question is valid. He's not saying he will go to his hunting buddies and proclaim the CGN advice he received is gospel. He's just looking for some help and that, imho, is the main purpose of this forum. The problem is, most of the answers he's been given have nothing to do with the question that he asked (partially due to poor wording of his question in the first place).

2) Did you just use the word "problematical"? I'm thinking you should seriously consider changing your username to Scrabble4ever! ;)
 
I don't think that the discussion that's been generated is surprising or particularly negative.

If the question is how should our group wack up the spoils this season, with a couple of additions to the group. I dunno , ask the group now before the season starts and see what they think ... If the group decides on an answer that doesn't please you -- I expect if you reported this back here looking for justification to your displeasure or alternately reported back your satisfaction as to what the group decided ..... I mean I expect you would find that the answers you'd find here as to if your group made the correct choice would be at least as varried and emotionally charged as you'd expect your actual group to come up with. If it was obvious and a slam dunk I would expect you'd have never posted in the first place.

I believe this thread simply did what threads do -- generate discussion and many people who participated are unfamiliar with how things work where you hunt .... Come from places where running deer with dogs for example is not only unfamiliar and considered un- sporting but illegal. Group hunting where one member could legally fill all the tags - again would be illegal and contrary to sportsman like behaviour etc --- anyway the result is simply folks read the information presented and in a "whatcha talking 'bout Willis?" Go on to question and comment on things that are unfamiliar to them.

How do we divvy up the spoils ... Generates why is everyone guaranteed a percentage at all? Ironically regardless of how anyone including the OP feels about these questions and comments -- fundamentally the answer is likely in there. That is simply why does your group do it that way ? How have you traditionally rationed the meat ? Who would object to a new percentage being calculated and why? Can a new agreement be negotiated ? What's fair to ask for? -- I dunno but what was considered fair last season and the season before that? If what is being asked for in the new dynamic is consistent with the traditions and values of your camp I'd say the new hunters would get a share. If your hunting partners don't see the value of treating new hunters as equal members of the group, I guess that's how it goes. If 5 tags means it's 20% for each tag holder -- that's how it goes. If your group decides that you all love hunting and "Dave" needs the meat this winter -- so the spoils are traditionally divided by need I guess that's how it goes.

The fact that some posters would choose not to hunt within groups where the meat is objectified in such a way where a hunting partner would feel cheated if he / she didn't leave with an equal share of the game harvested at the camp -- I mean it isn't that hard to understand that train of thought being discussed as well. Practically Everyone that hunts says that the best part is the time away out in nature and the camaraderie of the people you share this experience with. Harvesting game , however exhilarating and regardless of the fact that everyone wants to be successful is a bonus. I'd assume that Passing on smaller deer in hopes of harvesting a large buck isn't short changing the guy back at camp that needs the meat -- but I suppose that would depend on the make up of one's group.

I personally didn't feel that any of the discussions in this thread went particularly off topic (especially by CGN standards) -- the guys with large post counts may want to go back and delete lots of what they have contributed to this forum on a variety of other topics if they sincerely feel that this thread went so far off the rails.
 
Interesting ideas on here. Being new to hunting I'm lucky a few guys I know are happy to invite me out. First deer was shot with a friends bow with his tag. Unplanned hunt and I was 800km from my tag and equipment. He showed me how to gut it, clean it, we ground a bunch up and when we split the meat he gave me 50%. I told him he didn't owe me anything. Ya I shot it but IMO it was his. He told me he was just as excited to be there when I got my first deer as I was to shoot It. I found out this week that I now have a place to hunt black bears. The guy who offered the Land doesn't hunt them as he gets enough deer to fill his freezer,so he gets to shoot the deer and told me I can go shoot a bear. Too late in the season for me to head out but I told him I would gladly take him up on his offer next fall, Not only that. He said if I go out and shoot one to give him a call and he will come get it with his tractor and help me clean it since it would be my first one. You know what he asked for in return for the offer? Nothing, I will be dropping a bottle of crown royal off before I head out. People like that seem to be far and few between most days. Almost everyone I've met since I got to this county have been awesome. They seem excited when they find out your new and always offer advice and a couple have even given me their numbers and said to call if I run into any problem (like dragging out or need help cleaning etc).. I will guarantee that a helpful attitude will be instilled in my children when they start hunting with me.

To the OPs problem. This is what was offered to me. I got an offer to go for a week hunt for deer at am established camp. I would be required to help with the cooking, cleaning and general chores as well as work the bush. I wasn't allowed to set up a stand and shoot but I would get an equal share of the meat. It's basically what my buddy called the "####### test". You come out, show you can put in the effort and you will get invited back. If you don't fit in with the guys or youre and #######. You won't be invited back. If you get invited for the second time, you get to bring your gun. Third time you could be offered a buy in.
 
If the hunting party I joined up with was more worried about ''diving up the spoils'' so to speak I would be looking for a new group of buddies.
What is it you are hoping to teach the young apprentices?
Donald Trump would just fire them if they didnt hold up their end of the bargain.
Hunting is more than the killing of the Game Animal and dividing it up among the group.
I wont go into what Hunting means to me or the people I hunt with.
Rob
 
I whole heartittly agree with yer thawts there Flewtchie.
Getting out in the freshest of air, poking the fire, sharing bs stories
of high school.
Then getting down and dirty when the work comes.
Heck, nuff folk around the camp fire, maybe the vittles should git vittled up
rite there...............huh?
 
ronecol said:
I totally agree with your sentiments. But I think you're assuming there would only two or three involved. (In fact if that were the case I'd be happy if they took it all as I still have some venison & moose in the freezer from last fall). But what to do when there are also a half dozen non-family members in the group?
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Have you considered starting your own family group? You'd build better memories like that, and fair would be whatever you think it is. As it is, fair is whatever the group thinks is fair and there really isn't a clear-cut right or wrong.

I've found that with the people I've hunted with over the years, some tried to work the boys into an existing program and some have drifted away to do their own thing.
 
Runningfool said:
1) The OP's question is valid. He's not saying he will go to his hunting buddies and proclaim the CGN advice he received is gospel. He's just looking for some help and that, imho, is the main purpose of this forum. The problem is, most of the answers he's been given have nothing to do with the question that he asked (partially due to poor wording of his question in the first place).

2) Did you just use the word "problematical"? I'm thinking you should seriously consider changing your username to Scrabble4ever! ;)
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Hey are you attacking me? :) Scrabble4ever indeed. I will quote the OP's original post and highlight the parts that make this "problematical". I think you are a good dude trying to see the positive side on this post but there really is no question to be answered here.

"So my two teenage grandsons (14 & 15), both in the apprentice program, will be hunting with us for 2 or 3 days of the 2nd week of the deer season again this fall. Should they share in any deer taken the days they hunt or maybe a percentage of the deer taken during the entire week or maybe not at all, or maybe only if one or the other or both actually kill a deer? Keep in mind that as apprentice hunters they must share a firearm with their mentors (me & their dad) which means while they are hunting there is no possibility of me or their dad killing a deer. At 14 & 15 these boys already have as much “bush” savvy as some adult hunters. They live with shooting capability in their back yard. They have had supervised shooting since age 10 with gun safety drilled into them. They have been spending a few days in the deer camp with us since about age 10 and have been in the apprentice program since age 12. Apart from the deer camp they also participate in bear and predator hunts. They both have their trappers license, spend countless hours involved and regularly send firs to the North Bay auction and have demo’d skinning techniques at the convention. The oldest also recently took first place in a local bass fishing tournament.

Unlike in a recent thread where a participant didn’t get his hunting act together in time for the hunt but it was still felt by many he should share equally in the spoils, these lads did and do have their act together and have been learning and participating for the past 2 & 3 years respectively but they have never been part of the equation when divvying up the venison. Should they be?"

The OP spends the first paragraph describing his grandkids (which is cool, he should be proud of them) which justifies that they are more than equal contributors to the party. He than asks a totally rhetorical question. What is the point of this question as he already answered it through his justification of his lads being excellent party members? He already knows the answer that this forum is going to provide so why even ask it?
 
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