What is..........
- Thread starter flyte1976
- Start date
you need to say whether non restricted or restricted
Well it does matter since there are about 8 times more pal holders than rpal holders and there are about only 7 black rifles firing a centerfire rifle cartridge in non restricted form. Canadian gun control took away 90% of black semi automatic rifles by declaring them prohibited by name just because they look like a bad guy was using it in a Hollywood movie
i think this is correct in my opinion:
most highly desirable under rare unicorn merlin camelot essence factor:
restricted: hk416
nonrestricted: valmet transformed into a galil clone
i think this is correct in my opinion:
most highly desirable under rare unicorn merlin camelot essence factor:
restricted: hk416
nonrestricted: valmet transformed into a galil clone
ATRS Modern Hunter.
These are my favorites out of what we have available to us.
Restricted- a high end AR-15 like my 12 inch PWS or an ACR if you want to spend an extra $1000.
Non-restricted- Non restricted converted ACR. My ACR is so smooth to shoot and is very accurate. Ergo's are fantastic as well. It's a little pricey but I feel it's worth it.
My take on what we can buy.
-Swiss Arms classic green or black special are very well built rifles but my classic green target model (flat top version) was not overly accurate with the ammo I tried and had a 5 moa POI shift when using the bipod compared to supporting it near the receiver. One of the few $3000 black rifles I've owned that I didn't feel was absurdly overpriced.
-Lot's of guys like the Tavor, I owned one for a while and it didn't make me smile when I shot it like some other rifles do but it was a nice rifle. I suggest anyone in the market for one finds a way to try one out before dropping $3000 on one. Also budget for a $400+ trigger if you don't like 12 pound trigger pulls or 9 pound if you remove the trigger return spring.
-The XCR-L has been getting better with every revision but I'm not a huge fan of those, mostly because of the mediocre accuracy but it really isn't any worse than a Tavor in that department. Ergo's are excellent and the new keymod with a light barrel is much better handling than the older ones.
-T-97 is a cheap rifle that some like and some hate. I feel it's overpriced for what you get. The rifle comes with no warranty and no parts support so to me $1000 plus another $400 for the flat top upper on a disposable rifle is too much. I have shot one and it was fairly accurate and had a very unique recoil impulse.
-Mini-14? reliable but not very accurate is the common report. Mine was about 6 moa with a scope off the bench which is terrible but it was very reliable with quality magazines. These are a little overpriced in my opinion as well, especially if you want it to look more tacticool and buy a new stock for it.
-HK SL8-4, I really liked both of my HK's, both were capable of shooting 1 moa or slightly less with the right ammo and my second one had the HERA Arms lower conversion and the ergonomics were greatly improved. The weight is a little much but that's to be expected with the heavy Lothar Walther barrel hanging out there.
-ATRS Modern Hunter, I haven't owned one but I have shot three of them. I wasn't overly impressed. It is a beautifully built rifle but all three of the ones I shot were not capable of consistently shooting 1 moa or less with any ammo we tried. None of them would feed soft point bullets (not a huge surprise on an auto loader) but did feed polymer tip rounds fine most of the time. I say most of the time because two of the rifles had the odd problem even with FMJ. Unfortunately the first batch (maybe also second batch) MH also suffers from being finicky with magazines and won't feed from gen 3 Pmags.
The MH is a really nice rifle but for $4000+ I think it should be more reliable and shoot tighter groups. My $1500 DPMS and my $3000 AR-10 build were more reliable and shot tighter groups. The MH is probably capable of shooting better with some proper load development but we tried nine different types of factory loads and none would shoot consistently enough to satisfy expectations.
-AR-180B-2, I love my AR180. It's as accurate as a Tavor or XCR-L and as reliable or more reliable than most rifles out there. It's light weight, fun to shoot, and costs less than most NR options. I've left mine completely original and it will stay that way. I don't see the need to try to tacticool it up or try to make it into a non restricted AR-15. It will never be anything by heavier if you add crap to it. My rifle has seen around 1000-1500 rounds and has been fed from every magazine I own, it has yet to have a failure of any kind and is well set up to simply use the iron sights, I only put on an optic when I want to do some load testing or longer range shooting at the range.
I'm probably forgetting a couple but that's all I can think of right now for rifles.
There are a few options in the pistol caliber carbine area but I've discovered that they are pretty much useless for anything other than shooting pop cans in a gravel pit. I really liked my Kriss Vector and my HK USC, both were sold when I got bored of them. Same with the Kel-Tec sub-2000 I used to have. It was reliable and fun but eventually I just got tired of it. All I have left is my 9mm AR as a PCC and I love it. Not sure why I like it better than the others but for whatever reason I don't have the urge to sell it.
Restricted- a high end AR-15 like my 12 inch PWS or an ACR if you want to spend an extra $1000.
Non-restricted- Non restricted converted ACR. My ACR is so smooth to shoot and is very accurate. Ergo's are fantastic as well. It's a little pricey but I feel it's worth it.
My take on what we can buy.
-Swiss Arms classic green or black special are very well built rifles but my classic green target model (flat top version) was not overly accurate with the ammo I tried and had a 5 moa POI shift when using the bipod compared to supporting it near the receiver. One of the few $3000 black rifles I've owned that I didn't feel was absurdly overpriced.
-Lot's of guys like the Tavor, I owned one for a while and it didn't make me smile when I shot it like some other rifles do but it was a nice rifle. I suggest anyone in the market for one finds a way to try one out before dropping $3000 on one. Also budget for a $400+ trigger if you don't like 12 pound trigger pulls or 9 pound if you remove the trigger return spring.
-The XCR-L has been getting better with every revision but I'm not a huge fan of those, mostly because of the mediocre accuracy but it really isn't any worse than a Tavor in that department. Ergo's are excellent and the new keymod with a light barrel is much better handling than the older ones.
-T-97 is a cheap rifle that some like and some hate. I feel it's overpriced for what you get. The rifle comes with no warranty and no parts support so to me $1000 plus another $400 for the flat top upper on a disposable rifle is too much. I have shot one and it was fairly accurate and had a very unique recoil impulse.
-Mini-14? reliable but not very accurate is the common report. Mine was about 6 moa with a scope off the bench which is terrible but it was very reliable with quality magazines. These are a little overpriced in my opinion as well, especially if you want it to look more tacticool and buy a new stock for it.
-HK SL8-4, I really liked both of my HK's, both were capable of shooting 1 moa or slightly less with the right ammo and my second one had the HERA Arms lower conversion and the ergonomics were greatly improved. The weight is a little much but that's to be expected with the heavy Lothar Walther barrel hanging out there.
-ATRS Modern Hunter, I haven't owned one but I have shot three of them. I wasn't overly impressed. It is a beautifully built rifle but all three of the ones I shot were not capable of consistently shooting 1 moa or less with any ammo we tried. None of them would feed soft point bullets (not a huge surprise on an auto loader) but did feed polymer tip rounds fine most of the time. I say most of the time because two of the rifles had the odd problem even with FMJ. Unfortunately the first batch (maybe also second batch) MH also suffers from being finicky with magazines and won't feed from gen 3 Pmags.
The MH is a really nice rifle but for $4000+ I think it should be more reliable and shoot tighter groups. My $1500 DPMS and my $3000 AR-10 build were more reliable and shot tighter groups. The MH is probably capable of shooting better with some proper load development but we tried nine different types of factory loads and none would shoot consistently enough to satisfy expectations.
-AR-180B-2, I love my AR180. It's as accurate as a Tavor or XCR-L and as reliable or more reliable than most rifles out there. It's light weight, fun to shoot, and costs less than most NR options. I've left mine completely original and it will stay that way. I don't see the need to try to tacticool it up or try to make it into a non restricted AR-15. It will never be anything by heavier if you add crap to it. My rifle has seen around 1000-1500 rounds and has been fed from every magazine I own, it has yet to have a failure of any kind and is well set up to simply use the iron sights, I only put on an optic when I want to do some load testing or longer range shooting at the range.
I'm probably forgetting a couple but that's all I can think of right now for rifles.
There are a few options in the pistol caliber carbine area but I've discovered that they are pretty much useless for anything other than shooting pop cans in a gravel pit. I really liked my Kriss Vector and my HK USC, both were sold when I got bored of them. Same with the Kel-Tec sub-2000 I used to have. It was reliable and fun but eventually I just got tired of it. All I have left is my 9mm AR as a PCC and I love it. Not sure why I like it better than the others but for whatever reason I don't have the urge to sell it.
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SquidMeister
CGN Regular
- Location
- New Soviet Albertistan
I love my type 97 to death, something about bullpups is just fantastic. Tavors also a great choice. We don't have much for non restricted black rifles, but what we do have is better than nothing. I'd kill to be able to own a Galil or an AK, but our handsomest politicians deemed them far too dangerous for us to be trusted with.
In my opinion, my top 5 picks for non restricted black rifles would be
Norinco Type 97
IWI Tavor
Anything CZ858 or VZ58
A Swiss arms if you can afford one
or if you can even find one, an AR180
Restricted you can go for
FN PS90 without the ### barrel length
Any AR15
A FAMAE SAF Mini (closest thing we can get to an MP5K)
Do some research and pick something that works or you. Some of the choices I like other will hate. And vice versa.
In my opinion, my top 5 picks for non restricted black rifles would be
Norinco Type 97
IWI Tavor
Anything CZ858 or VZ58
A Swiss arms if you can afford one
or if you can even find one, an AR180
Restricted you can go for
FN PS90 without the ### barrel length
Any AR15
A FAMAE SAF Mini (closest thing we can get to an MP5K)
Do some research and pick something that works or you. Some of the choices I like other will hate. And vice versa.
- Location
- Fort St John B.C.
there where some danish made ar10's that where classed as non restricted because of the wording of the law.
the rifles where made by Artillerie Inrichtingen. who also made select fire models for royal dutch airlines to be used as polar bear protection (how innovative)
canucklehead
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Calgary, AB
FS2000
Non Restricted Swiss Arms Carbine.
Non Restricted Swiss Arms Carbine.
- Location
- East of Home, West of the Rest
Semi auto m16a2 imported as an rcmp order over run and sold to the public in the 90s. Restricted and marked m16a2. Would love to find one. But I like colts.
I'd love to see a FN CAL as well with a non restricted length barrel. Not likely though.
I'd love to see a FN CAL as well with a non restricted length barrel. Not likely though.
- Location
- East of Home, West of the Rest
Yet none are listed on the frt. A judge did rule that one individual had a rifle that predated the existence of the M16 so it wasn't a variant, but that is case law and not an frt entry. At least the lab didn't make note of it. Surprising eh.
There are non of those in Canada, by all accounts they all sold to foreign collectors and exported out of Canada
