Gear check for possible 3 gun run

G

grimblyd

Regular
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
6   0   0
Location
Meridian Beach, Gull Lake Alberta
Alright. I think I've assembled the basics, now to fill the gaps.
I'm no intending to be super competitive, but do want to have the basic gear to have fun, and not be a nuisance or embarrassment to myself while running this.

Pistol set up.

CZ75 SP01 9mm, bladetech holster, 5 mags, 2 double mag holders.


Shotgun

Option 1:

Mossberg 500, either 18 inch slug barrel or 28 inch barrel. (can't run slugs through the 28 inch bbl)

Option 2:

ASENA ZR7-RC SEMI AUTOMATIC SHOTGUN, coming from Corwin Arms shortly. 4+1 capacity. Not sure if an extension is available.


Tactical rifle set up

Norinco CQA in 5.56. No mods. 2 5 rnd magazines.


Gaps?
Right away I see a gap in mags for the rifle. How many 10 rnd LARS would be required in a stage? I'm also guessing I'll need some mag holders for them?
Can I get away with no optics on this, or am I going to end up shooting 5 million rounds trying to hit a target outside of my iron sight range?

Any other glaring gaps for a basic fun run?
 
Your pistol is fine.

Rifle is fine, too. Be able to carry minimum 30 rounds for your rifle, or more, depending on the stage. Optics is entirely up to you and your skill/eyesight/comfort level.

Why can't you shoot slugs through your 28" Mossberg? I wouldn't touch one of the off-brand Turk semi shotguns given how I see them run at matches. What's your shotgun budget? With shotgun, capacity is king. A pump gun with a large extension (10+ rounds) or a 3.5" chambered semi with extension is the way to go.

Proper gear to hold your mags and shotshells makes for a much nicer match. Loading single shotshells out of a pocket or dump pouch is cheap, but painfully slow compared to loading twins or quads.
 
You can certainly shoot slugs out of a 28" Mossberg 500 barrel.
The only Mossberg barrels you can't shoot slugs out of are the over-bored barrels for the 835 or 935, which you don't have.

Do not use the rifled barrel for shooting birdshot. The rifling opens the shot pattern in a really bad way. You won't knock any plates down.

You'll want a shotshell belt from Canadian Tire. They're only $20 bucks. And it's a huge step up from a loose dump-pouch full of shells.

shotgun-shell-belt.jpg
 
Good advice has been given already. Aside from more rifle mags, I'd say something to hold your shotgun shells is your biggest gap currently. AR mags can be pulled from cargo pants pockets relatively easily but shot shells from a pocket or a dump pouch, not so much.

IMO I don't think you should waste $20 on that shotshell belt from CT; it's not going to be much faster than a dump pouch and is not practical for 3gun (I'm not sure where you would wear that, around your chest? Belly button level?). There are various shotshell holding systems out there so do a bit of research, maybe attend a match or two to see what other guys are running and maybe ask them if they have any old gear they want to sell.

There are always guys who are upgrading. When I switched from my APC holders to Invictus, the guy who got my apc holders knew they were not the fastest thing out there but they were a HUGE improvement over his CPLS (Coat Pocket Loading system ;) )and someday if he decides to upgrade to a newer system, those apc holders will find their way to another new 3gunner.

With respect to the iron sights and worrying about "shooting 5 million rounds" at a target, don't worry. It is unlikely that you will face a mandatory target like that (mandatory meaning you must hit the target before moving on to the next target). If you run into a target that you can't seem to get those irons on, just take a few shots and move on. Knowing when to move on and leave a target standing is a lesson many of us are still learning!
 
Last edited:
I use this, it's MOLLE and works really great for shotgun shells. There is a elastic band on top that your fingers can access inside without using the zipper for fast access to shells. I even use it for goose hunting in fall. I recommend, it's 5.11 so it's rugged.

1389178539_05.jpg
 
For my shotgun I have a 6 round side saddle on the receiver and I use a chest rig and have a HSGI Shotgun Shell Tray velcroed to one of my rifle pouches. I also throw a couple of lose shells in my dump pouch for bigger stages.

A variety of side saddles are available for the Mossberg 500. Side saddles are not as fast as loading duals or quads from carriers but for me my physical speed and flexibility has a greater impact on my time than my reloading times.

There are two hazards when using a dump pouch to reload, one it's possibly to jam a shell into the shotgun backwards since you can grab it in any orientation and if you are using a variety of ammo (slugs and shot shells) you can accidentally grab the wrong shell. A slug on a steel plate at 7m can have quite an impact.

Go to a couple of matches and start out with the Coat Pocket Loading System (lol) and talk to other shooters about their gear. Find out what they like and don't like about their system. The match I was at yesterday several shooters were complaining that their shotgun loaders were digging into their stomach since there was a lot of low ports in barricades and several lost a number of shells during the stag. Whatever you go with must be compatible with whatever you are already running.
 
Dexter Morgan said:
You can certainly shoot slugs out of a 28" Mossberg 500 barrel.
The only Mossberg barrels you can't shoot slugs out of are the over-bored barrels for the 835 or 935, which you don't have.

Do not use the rifled barrel for shooting birdshot. The rifling opens the shot pattern in a really bad way. You won't knock any plates down.

You'll want a shotshell belt from Canadian Tire. They're only $20 bucks. And it's a huge step up from a loose dump-pouch full of shells.

shotgun-shell-belt.jpg
Click to expand...

I'd recommend that as well... You can strap it around your waist. They are cheap, hold a lot of shells, it will be quick enough unless you're trying to be super competitive.
The all the purpose build 3gun shotshell holders are stupid expensive....
 
armycat said:
Go to a couple of matches and start out with the Coat Pocket Loading System (lol) and talk to other shooters about their gear. Find out what they like and don't like about their system.
Click to expand...

This is the best advice.

With respect to nylon and elastic shell holders, they can be very good at retaining shotshells, but they're not very good at going fast.

Pictured below is what I used yesterday: DTV-18 chest rig and 6 round belt holder from Invictus Practical, and two four round caddies from California Competition Works. The California Comp caddies were high speed 6 years ago, now they're just for backup ammo or slugs. They also hold AR mags with the spacer removed and that's how I usually use them. I rarely use my velcro side saddle any more unless the stage round count is really high.

Modern shotshell carriers work amazingly well if you can do twins or quad loads, but they are not cheap. Go to a match, do your research and see what guys are using, figure out your budget and how fast you want to go. And buy once, cry once.

 
warrenlikesboats said:
I'd recommend that as well... You can strap it around your waist. They are cheap, hold a lot of shells, it will be quick enough unless you're trying to be super competitive.
The all the purpose build 3gun shotshell holders are stupid expensive....
Click to expand...

Except that in 3gun you already have a belt on at that has your holstered hand gun and magazines on it. This would have to go above that and when moving around on a stage I don't think this sort of thing would stay in place. That is why I wouldn't recommend this particular type of belt.
Purpose-built shotshell holders are expensive but if you buy something good and then decide you don't like 3gun, you'd have zero trouble selling it for close to what you paid for it. But then again, I've never met anyone who tried 3gun and didn't like it so the point is moot :d

Btw, nice rig Stevo. Wish we were closer, I think I'd enjoy shooting with you.
 
Runningfool said:
Btw, nice rig Stevo. Wish we were closer, I think I'd enjoy shooting with you.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I've finally got it where I want it. I wish I could do quads, but between the arthritis and carpal tunnel all I can manage is twins. Actually, twins are a lot easier for me now than a weak hand reload with it's finer finger movements.

I agree, I think it would be a lot of fun. We do have our two day, two shooter team match here the first week of October. It's only about a 40 hour drive from where you're at. ;)
 
They work fine if u have a plate carrier.... Keep in mind the OP is only wishing to start out as a beginner. I'm pretty sure stevos setup is worth at least the price of the OP,s mossy 500.
 
warrenlikesboats said:
They work fine if u have a plate carrier.... Keep in mind the OP is only wishing to start out as a beginner. I'm pretty sure stevos setup is worth at least the price of the OP,s mossy 500.
Click to expand...

Not quite, if you only look at the shotgun stuff.

The OP being new to 3 gun isn't necessarily relevant. We have more and more new guys starting off with modern gear. They've decided to make a commitment to shoot and buy appropriate gear to start with. Their experience is greatly enhanced as their gear helps, rather than hinders.

Also, you don't have to spend a pile of money. We have a number of folks who have made their own twins shellholders out of Pex pipe and fittings and various backing materials like aluminum sheet or even an old CD case in one instance. One shooter on my squad yesterday had a 16 round belt rig for twins that he had invested $14 and some time into. It was every bit as functional as my IP rig.
 
Thanks guys.

The shotgun seems to be my weak point in all this.
I'll be restricted to 7 rnds max start with my Turk auto,(get an extender to 5 rnds, 1 up the pipe and a ghost round)
and about the same with my Mossy in its current set up unless I buy a 20" barrel and extender. It will cost money and a lot of effort to do either of those and they'd still be inadequate it seems. Ok. Looks like I need to pick up a used 870 and convert it then.
Also the shotgun shell holders/belt set up seem to be a big gap for me. Anyone have a link to some of the DIY stuff that Stevo mentioned? That might be a fun little project to put something together. I think double loading means holding the two shells as if they were one and pushing them in. I would imagine quad loading is similar and probably not something I should start learning at 57! lol!

The next biggest gap of concern is likely to be my optics on my tactical rifle, as it has iron sights. (I am buying either 3 Beowulf mags, or 10 shot LAR mags, that has already been budgeted for)

Unfortunately, I've geared up fast enough over the last couple months that the EYE OF SAURON is upon me. I've received a request for an complete inventory of capital cost expenditure on this venture.... Might have to slow my roll a bit.
 
If your shotgun is 3" make sure you set you mag extension so that it holds not quite 6 rounds of 3". That will give you 6 in the tube and it's perfectly legal.

Twins loading is holding two in your hand, end to end, and loading them in one motion. As you guessed, quads is the same but with two "stacks" of shells in your hand. If you have the ability to do it, spend the time to learn. It's very much worth it.
 
Skip the CT belt. Anything grabbing one shell at a time puts you at a speed slower than most who are competing. I started out with just a pouch and then quickly sprung for an AP Customs 4x4 and 3x3 holder (they are similar to Stevo's Cal comp ones but are double stacked).

But then I saw the light and learned the load-two method and got an Invictus system (there are many makers who do the same thing). Some can do a quad-load method but my hands are too small for that. Look up these methods on YouTube.

I still keep the 3x3 as a backup or top-up source or to hold slugs when needed. More compact on your belt than a pouch and you can grab more shells than from a pouch.
 
Silveragent said:
Skip the CT belt. Anything grabbing one shell at a time puts you at a speed slower than most who are competing. I started out with just a pouch and then quickly sprung for an AP Customs 4x4 and 3x3 holder (they are similar to Stevo's Cal comp ones but are double stacked).

But then I saw the light and learned the load-two method and got an Invictus system (there are many makers who do the same thing). Some can do a quad-load method but my hands are too small for that. Look up these methods on YouTube.

I still keep the 3x3 as a backup or top-up source or to hold slugs when needed. More compact on your belt than a pouch and you can grab more shells than from a pouch.
Click to expand...

+1 on the 3x3 or 4x4. For most of us, it is either slower or more difficult than loading twins but it's very useful as a SHTF for additional shotshells as it holds a lot of shotshells in a small space. Sometimes your twin caddies start dumping stuff when you drop prone or run.

I Havent figured out if quad loading is useful in Canada. With a 7 round tube loading 4 then 2 then 1 is too much thinking for me after the beep. Rather treat it as a 6 round tube and load 2,2,2.
 
Andrew, another thing to consider is that some of the specialty quad holders stack the shells tightly together making it difficult (read: slow and unreliable) to pull off just 2. Often the second pair falls off in the process.

I use a 3.5" gun so I try to run it until tube is empty then throw a quad and a quad in it, and I drop one shell on the ground. Ideally I get my loads right and it is the last shell, but sometimes I'll drop one earlier on and know it doesn't matter as long as I hit the rest.
 
To save dropping one on the ground, get a Matchsaverz for the "odd" number start (or use a sidesaddle - which is way slower). Slide one in as port load, then start loading your twins or quads. Having to drop one before or after can break your rhythm.
 
For anyone who's wondering how to load fast from a $20 shell belt from Crappy Tire.

I've used a similar technique to this one.
About a billion times faster than a bag of loose shells.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom