Client loaner rifles
- Thread starter Ardent
- Start date
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I love the .270, but it sure does on these things with the 7mm at 175grs. They stop .300 Win 200gr premiums and 300gr .375 Rugers, even the small ones. Built like beer kegs, it's asking a mite too much of a .270 when I'm the guy who has to follow the blood spatter into the rainforest. I really like to see them anchored, too thick here, and with recoil in mind that means a 7mm Mag minimum or a .300 for the conditions here.
You sure are wound a little tight.
Maybe you didn't actually read what I said.
"Bears are HUNTED in the valley bottom"
Ever noticed the terrain in the background of angus's big bear pics? look like alpine meadows to you? a couple hundred thousand salmon make a pretty appetizing treat for big coastal brown bears. The goats don't really care much for fish though, picky buggers.
You think there is time in one day to spot, stalk, shoot, skin and pack out a grizzly, then hike 8 hours into the alpine and spot and shoot a goat? good luck with that.
You are missing the point of the thread. Its not a private hunt with two tags in your pocket, where you (or I for that matter) would pick a bullet suitable for both species and go hunting. Angus is looking for a single rifle to lend out on separate goat and bear hunts. Let me break it down...
"Here you go Mr. Smith, this is your rifle for your goat hunt...a 7mm magnum loaded with 130 grain TTSX bullets."
Then a week down the road, it goes like this
"Here you go Mr. Johnson, this is your rifle for your grizzly bear hunt. Its a 7mm Magnum Loaded with 175 grain Nosler partitions"
Do you think he could find the time in between hunts to fire 3 shots at a piece of paper to confirm a zero in between two totally different hunts, maybe while the hunter is firing a few practice rounds in the rifle they have never laid eyes upon before, so they feel confident on their multi thousand dollar hunt?
By using the optimum bullets for each species he is stacking the odds in the clients favour, making it easier for them to accomplish their one task....making one shot count. Would you take a dual purpose bike to a motocross race? or the daytona 200? no. You would use highly tuned racing machines in the appropriate flavour.
As for the goats in Royston, there aren't very many thats for sure. I did see a few on the roof at the coombs country market, but they would make a piss poor trophy and the locals might get riled up if I shot one. I do spend about 300 days a year working and playing in lots of the country between Bella Bella and Atlin so i've seen enough goats and bears to pick them out of a lineup, thats for sure.
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Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
J_06 in the next post conceded the point actually, we're all good here. 
Tis true nobody I know sees more of that stretch of BC from an altitude to see the creatures than Slimbo. You need to work less, we both need to!
Tis true nobody I know sees more of that stretch of BC from an altitude to see the creatures than Slimbo. You need to work less, we both need to!
Give them a pointy stick and tell them that's how we roll on the West Coast haahaa
Link to A good Haida story of the bear mother
http://www.firstpeople.us/FP-Html-Legends/HaidaMotherBearStory-Haida.html
Link to A good Haida story of the bear mother
http://www.firstpeople.us/FP-Html-Legends/HaidaMotherBearStory-Haida.html
Stainless/synthetic is a given. The 300 mag is by far the most often carried by clients.
The difference between 7mm vs 300 felt recoil is negligible, and likely buffered by variables like stock fit, shooting position, clothing worn, adrenaline, etc
If recoil is the main issue, maybe have a rifle with an effective removable break, bang of a few test rounds for the clients comfort, then take the brake off for the hunt, for the guides comfort if nothing else.
A good recoil pad and use of an additional slip-on pad to adjust LOP might be a consideration too. not all clients come from the same mold.
Rifle availability might be the deciding factor on which to choose, if wait time is an issue. Are looking at buying 2 or 3? 6?
New Hawkeyes are harder to find
Kimber was mentioned, another to maybe look at would be the Montana Rifle
The difference between 7mm vs 300 felt recoil is negligible, and likely buffered by variables like stock fit, shooting position, clothing worn, adrenaline, etc
If recoil is the main issue, maybe have a rifle with an effective removable break, bang of a few test rounds for the clients comfort, then take the brake off for the hunt, for the guides comfort if nothing else.
A good recoil pad and use of an additional slip-on pad to adjust LOP might be a consideration too. not all clients come from the same mold.
Rifle availability might be the deciding factor on which to choose, if wait time is an issue. Are looking at buying 2 or 3? 6?
New Hawkeyes are harder to find
Kimber was mentioned, another to maybe look at would be the Montana Rifle
Personally, I would go with the M77 MKII stainless as a loaner (big surprise)... and would have the barrel bobbed to 22" from the standard 24"... giving up 100 fps is inconsequential when compared to not constantly getting hung up in the brush by the barrel protruding from your pack.... lowering the rifle butt in the pack is not a good option when straddling blowdowns. The M77 is a tough, simple, reliable, if somewhat heavier platform (good client criteria)... change out the stock to lighten it up. 7mm Rem Mag is a good choice with a VX-3 2.5-8... 2.5X & 170's for bears and 8X & 140's for goats... done and done.
you just described the 375 alaskan ....
With 175 Partitions my friend's 24" barrel gives up about 30fps to my 25 3/4" barrel. Same load, shot one right after the other.
I also have a .30-06, two actually, that I would probably take over my two 7mm RM's is I ever went to hunt with Ardent. I really like the 200gr Partitions at 2700 fps. I may even load up with 220 Partitions. Of course that would not be ideal for goats. The problem with the .30-06 is that you need to use handloads to get the best out of it, and as already pointed out, you can already hear the complaints in the even something went haywire.
If the rifle is to be carried on an empty chamber (a really good idea) then the safety does not matter much.
The Zastava M-70 has a military style extractor. It is controlled feed. If it is not modified to snap over the rim of a chambered round, it is a potential disaster. Someone unfamiliar with controlled feed might drop a round into the chamber and try to close the bolt.
I have had this problem with military Mausers, and for that reason won't lend military Mauser sporters.
That said, I assume the Zastava M-70 has a modified fool-proof extractor.
The Zastava M-70 has a military style extractor. It is controlled feed. If it is not modified to snap over the rim of a chambered round, it is a potential disaster. Someone unfamiliar with controlled feed might drop a round into the chamber and try to close the bolt.
I have had this problem with military Mausers, and for that reason won't lend military Mauser sporters.
That said, I assume the Zastava M-70 has a modified fool-proof extractor.
Good note Ganderite.
When hackles are rising and goose bumps git goose bumps, heck, that ain't the time
to remember on how to load yer shooter.
Modifying the extractor of a control feed is a great idea.
Given the climate and the fact you actually intend to let others carry and use your rifles..........my choice would be 1/2 doz Lee Enfields cerracoated with a good epoxy painted stock. Man I hate letting others, I don't know, use my good rifles, they invariably get damaged one way or the other.
Boomer and a few others I know are the exceptions of course but generally it is not a good idea.
As far as bobbing a 7 RM it does make a significant difference going down from 24". If one wanted something shorter than 24" then the 280 starts to shine but factory ammo becomes a serious issue. Ardent, if it was my choice it would be a 300 WM. Factory loads in 165 and 200s. As far as a rifle goes, maybe a T3? I hear they are quite accurate and weather impervious. You need to lighten up on the CRF thing, at least for clients, cause if the sh!t hits the fan you know damn well you are going to have to rely on your own shooting 95% of the time anyway. As far as personal safety goes make them carry with an empty chamber and full magazine, I would, and you will also find that you won't lose a single opportunity because of it. However it will assure that if a bear pops up with a bad attitude and too close, that you won't get shot in the back. I find it much easier to deal with potential problem animals without my guts hanging down between my knees...........
Boomer and a few others I know are the exceptions of course but generally it is not a good idea.
As far as bobbing a 7 RM it does make a significant difference going down from 24". If one wanted something shorter than 24" then the 280 starts to shine but factory ammo becomes a serious issue. Ardent, if it was my choice it would be a 300 WM. Factory loads in 165 and 200s. As far as a rifle goes, maybe a T3? I hear they are quite accurate and weather impervious. You need to lighten up on the CRF thing, at least for clients, cause if the sh!t hits the fan you know damn well you are going to have to rely on your own shooting 95% of the time anyway. As far as personal safety goes make them carry with an empty chamber and full magazine, I would, and you will also find that you won't lose a single opportunity because of it. However it will assure that if a bear pops up with a bad attitude and too close, that you won't get shot in the back. I find it much easier to deal with potential problem animals without my guts hanging down between my knees...........
Is the zastava the only one to use a military extractor? I assume most other commercial control round feed actions (ex. winchester m70, kimbers etc) use a modified extractor.
Thanks!
Thanks!
I find that T3 SS rust quite readily. The moist, salty air would not be ideal. I guess you could cerakote it, but then you may as well get a Winchester EW. That and some T3 barrels seem slow are my only two complaints about the T3.
my m70 alaskan wont close over a round in the chamber but my
cz 550 will. i have been unable to chamber a round a couple times from my alaskan when it popped out of the mag in front of the extractor. my push feed m70 stainless i think would be better for this task although its only a 270.my vote though would be t3
Rust inside and out,
I know obviously a lack of maintenance shown here, but I also know a lot guys that don't (much less know how to) pull the firing pin. I've never seen this on other rifles, seen it on 2 T3's now.
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