ATRS modern hunter?
- Thread starter chunkydrunky
- Start date
Your KAC is still designed first and foremost to be reliable for military use but they use a high quality barrel so you still retain excellent accuracy. That's also why your rifle is so expensive for a restricted AR-10, it was built with the best parts typically exceeding mil-spec in every way. That's also why if I went to the range more often I'd probably own one, I just can't justify that much money on a rifle I would only use 3 times a year.
If the NEA goes into production as non restricted and comes out around the prices I've heard it may be coming for I'll be buying one.
Not just the KAC, add in LMT, Armalite AR10t Canadian military version, Armalite SASS, HK G28 and probably some others I haven't thought about.
With regards to the previous reliability/accuracy of the MH. I've seen a fair amount of 6.5 cm MH hit the EE pretty quick as well. Those are predominantly reloader guns with decent factory ammo also being an option. No surplus or garbage ammo.
driller212 makes an interesting point about the barrel change. Maybe they just don't know how to do a barrel chamber etc for a reliable precision semi auto 308? It's clearly not giving these rifles greater accuracy potential. Plus they are using the 1:10 twist rate. One other side note is that I greatly prefer a 1:11.25 twist rate for 308 over the 1:10. I find it's a lot easier to find ammo in the 155-175 range that shoots well.
Me too with the 102. Plus I'll be keeping an eye on the MDR for the future.
I just had something interesting happen.... With the old barrel the rifle would not feed properly/jam with gen 3 pmags, but with this new barrel (snap caps only so far) it seems to work just fine. Next time I hit the range I will try them out and let you guys know what happens.
I shot mine yesterday, I put about 50 rounds assorted ammo through it. It liked my 168AMax handload the best (41.5g IMR 4895 S&B primer, mag length), but I shot hirtenberger, and some Norma match too. Funny thing though, when I gave it to my Bro in law he couldn't get more than a couple shots without a a jam. I had no failures of any kind, after he finished I shot 5 more rounds rapidly and still no failures, not sure what he was doing differently but it's interesting.
Agree 100%. You pretty much summed up the modern hunter.
I agree with Epoxy7's assessment of the Modern Hunter. My friend loaned me his Modern Hunter after he couldn't get it to group and cycle reliably with factory ammunition. We initially tried all the match grade factory loads we could find locally (Federal GMM, Nosler, Hornady, and Remington), but would fail to have any shoot sub-moa and most would fail-to-feed every 3-4 rounds with the shoulders of the round being completely crushed. 3-shot groups would be around 1.75"-2" at 100m opening up to 2.25-3.0" for 5-shot groups. We tried pmags, xcr mags, and gen 3 pmags, but would still have the same fail-to-feed issues every 3-4 rounds. Nosler Match ammunition also suffered from pierced primers despite shooting probably the most consistently of the factory loads.
Decided to try handloading some rounds to see if it would help. We tried match grade projectiles from Hornady, Sierra, and Berger from 155-180 grains. Ammunition was ladder tested and loaded to 0.02 grains (accurate to the kernel of powder) on an AnD FX120i with a max runout of 0.0025" (most were closer to 0.001" runout) in Lapua brass. Ammunition still had failure to feed with crushed shoulders (double ouch that it's Lapua brass) despite being sized in a small base die. Best group 3-shot group was consistently just over 1.00" at 100m and opened up to 1.3-1.5" with a 5-shot group. I talked to a few other friends that are experienced shooters and reloaders and all have had similar issues with their MH, so I'm not sure if my friend just got a bad gun or if there's design issues with the gun.
While I can appreciate ATRS's efforts to produce a non-restricted semi-automatic, I feel that it is the most unreliable and inaccurate rifles in its price range.
Decided to try handloading some rounds to see if it would help. We tried match grade projectiles from Hornady, Sierra, and Berger from 155-180 grains. Ammunition was ladder tested and loaded to 0.02 grains (accurate to the kernel of powder) on an AnD FX120i with a max runout of 0.0025" (most were closer to 0.001" runout) in Lapua brass. Ammunition still had failure to feed with crushed shoulders (double ouch that it's Lapua brass) despite being sized in a small base die. Best group 3-shot group was consistently just over 1.00" at 100m and opened up to 1.3-1.5" with a 5-shot group. I talked to a few other friends that are experienced shooters and reloaders and all have had similar issues with their MH, so I'm not sure if my friend just got a bad gun or if there's design issues with the gun.
While I can appreciate ATRS's efforts to produce a non-restricted semi-automatic, I feel that it is the most unreliable and inaccurate rifles in its price range.
Unfortunately I have heard of many issues like this with the modern hunters, and the way the warranty work was handled had left a sour taste in some peoples mouths.
I honestly suspect these are all related to barrel problems. Match barrels tend to be finicky, and if the gas port is too small or there are headspacing issues, then you have failures like what you described. I never had issues with my 7mm-08 barrel but I shot factory ammo out of it. I replaced my barrel because I wanted .308 and the ability to shoot surplus (the cost of the new barrel was also a factor).
I think there have definitely been a few lemon rifles, and I think atrs has the design more fine tuned at this point. I think we hear more about the lemons from atrs because of its popularity, and the price point. I am certain NEA will have some lemons too, but it is all about how the warranty is handled when it happens.
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We tried everything we could to try to find something the MH would feed reliably and shoot reasonably well. On paper, with the high grade components used, we figured that the gun would have to be a shooter. All said and done, my friend spent hundreds of dollars experimenting with different match grade ammunition and hundreds more in reloading components trying to eliminate every possible variable; we really wanted the gun to live up to the hype, but unfortunately we exhausted all reasonable options before we found a solution. We tried every mag possible and even swapped out between 3 Nightforce scopes and a Swarovski Z5 to make sure it wasn't a problem with optics.
In the end, we fired both match grade factory ammo and handloads through my friend's XCR and Christensen Arms AR-10. Both guns shot 100% reliably with no malfunctions. The XCR didn't show a huge difference in accuracy between factory loads and handloads, but groups were only slightly worse than the MH and had 100% reliability. The Christensen Arms was a real shooter with good ammo and would consistently shoot sub moa with select factory match loads and pretty much any handloads (even bulk components were right around moa) and was 100% reliable as well.
In the end, we fired both match grade factory ammo and handloads through my friend's XCR and Christensen Arms AR-10. Both guns shot 100% reliably with no malfunctions. The XCR didn't show a huge difference in accuracy between factory loads and handloads, but groups were only slightly worse than the MH and had 100% reliability. The Christensen Arms was a real shooter with good ammo and would consistently shoot sub moa with select factory match loads and pretty much any handloads (even bulk components were right around moa) and was 100% reliable as well.
I am fortunate to own a Christensen Arms CA10 as my lightweight .308 semi-auto rifle. My experience has been similar to that of Moash - flawless reliability and outstanding accuracy. My CA10 consistently shoots sub-moa with Fed GMM 168gr SMK ammo. They are a beautiful take on the .308 AR, with the carbon-fibre barrel and hanguard, billet receiver set, etc. Truly first class all the way. If only they were NR....
If it's a first batch or early second batch rifle contact Rick and arrange to send it in for updates, apparently there was a bit of a QC issue with some of them and he got rid of the employee responsible and are repairing any affected rifles.
Not sure what it will do for the accuracy but it's supposed to improve reliability.
There is also something to do with the cam pin. I'm not 100% sure, best thing would be to contact ATRS and talk to them directly.
They have been contacting people but it's not easy to do once they've gone second and third hand.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
I'll post a photo and the brief explination Rick gave me on the cam pin issue when he worked on my rifle a week or so ago.
- Location
- calgary alberta
- Location
- calgary alberta
We can't seem to win regardless. IF we retain a clients info some come un-spooled on us, when we respect privacy it looks like we don't care.
If in doubt or having questions a call is always welcomed.
SOME cam pins are slightly oversized, so we can do a modification to the upper giving more clearance. Looking inside the upper where the cam pit relief is cut is simple. If you see silver where the cam pin has contacted the upper, we need to get the upper back to correct this. So far about 10% of the uppers seem to be effected.
The charge handle is something we are still working on as some guys have complained that their handle does not stay locked in place. About 15% of the 308 guns seem to be effected so we are completely redesigning the charge handle. we hope to have these done by spring and they will be available for clients to change out.
