Officer shot in leg after his GLOCK 35 went off spontaneously, not even dropped :)
- Thread starter mtstef
- Start date
When Vancouver Police selected the Sig P226...part of the rational was: A sig can break and not work. A Glock can break and not work. Any handgun can break and not work.
Sometimes when the Glock breaks it can still fire. This was assessed as a risk to officers and Sig P226 was selected as a result. When most other handguns break they don't still fire.
That said, love the Glock great simple, durable and inexpensive gun. But all mechanical things wear out eventually. Once the service life is up, replace and continue on with the job.
Rich
Sometimes when the Glock breaks it can still fire. This was assessed as a risk to officers and Sig P226 was selected as a result. When most other handguns break they don't still fire.
That said, love the Glock great simple, durable and inexpensive gun. But all mechanical things wear out eventually. Once the service life is up, replace and continue on with the job.
Rich
Any firearm can malfunction, some easier than others. Hammer fired guns I believe are more secure when hammer is down, even with a round in the chamber.
But the biggest issue I see is why go to the extreme policy to have a chambered round at all times ?
I bet a research on that will show almost zero cases where the life of the officer was at stake for 1 second delay after picking up the gun from the holster (the time it takes to chamber a round).
At the other end, the cases of injury because of a chambered round are so many
crazyjackrabbit
CGN Regular
Seconds count.. And you may not have time to ability to camber a round in time depending on scenario. Id rather take the slim chance of it maybe malfunctioning than not being set and prepared
Any firearm can malfunction, some easier than others. Hammer fired guns I believe are more secure when hammer is down, even with a round in the chamber.
But the biggest issue I see is why go to the extreme policy to have a chambered round at all times ?
I bet a research on that will show almost zero cases where the life of the officer was at stake for 1 second delay after picking up the gun from the holster (the time it takes to chamber a round).
At the other end, the cases of injury because of a chambered round are so many
The average gunfight involving police lasts something like 2.6seconds. There are numerous times where drawing and firing are needed... Just look at the tapes on YouTube. Plenty of them talking to someone close and they pull a gun/knife. There is no point in carrying if it isn't readied.
Real life doesn't always offer the opportunity to use two hands to get the gun running.
See Rich LPS post above - the Glock he refers to was not "knocked about" in anyway. It was in a thigh drop holster - as the officer got out of the veh, the holster twisted the pistol just enough that the firing pin was released due to the broken rails.
Any firearm can malfunction, some easier than others. Hammer fired guns I believe are more secure when hammer is down, even with a round in the chamber.
But the biggest issue I see is why go to the extreme policy to have a chambered round at all times ?
I bet a research on that will show almost zero cases where the life of the officer was at stake for 1 second delay after picking up the gun from the holster (the time it takes to chamber a round).
At the other end, the cases of injury because of a chambered round are so many
You do realize that the Glock doesn't #### the striker until you start to pull the trigger. That take up is cocking the striker. Once you complete the trigger pull the striker is let go from the trigger bar/sear. Glocks are never cocked until you pull the trigger hence being basically a dao gun.
Any firearm can malfunction, some easier than others. Hammer fired guns I believe are more secure when hammer is down, even with a round in the chamber.
But the biggest issue I see is why go to the extreme policy to have a chambered round at all times ?
I bet a research on that will show almost zero cases where the life of the officer was at stake for 1 second delay after picking up the gun from the holster (the time it takes to chamber a round).
At the other end, the cases of injury because of a chambered round are so many
Wow! Pretty bold statement. I would like to see you comfortable putting your life on the line this way - when seconds count in your reaction time (and yes, you will always be REacting, not acting), you better hope that your motor skills function properly with an adrenaline dump to get your gun out, hope the mag is seated properly, rack the slide, get back on target and engage the threat (oh and no phase 1 stoppage either). If you can do all of that in 1 second, under pressure, whilst your every move is being filmed by the public, and you are constantly having to assess whether you need to disengage from this level of force, you are a better man than me.
In fact, in September 2016, we would have had a dead police officer in Calgary, if Calgary Police were stupid enough to follow your ridiculous suggestion of not having a round chambered. The officer in question was attacked by a machete wielding mad man, who hacked one shoulder joint and his other forearm, before the officer managed to somehow draw his pistol, fire 3 rounds and stop the threat. I suppose you would have been happy to explain to this officers widow that carrying an unloaded handgun was safer??? Since there was no way he would have been physically capable of racking the slide with the injuries he sustained, but was able to pull the trigger?? Try living in the real world before you so blithely give your opinion of what police should and should not do as a matter of "policy".
Oh sorry - I just realised this officers life (and the lives of officers being dragged by vehicles, and who have 1 free hand to draw and fire to save their lives) fall under your "almost zero" cases.
I expect it would have to be broken or badly worn rails, a broken or dysfunctional firing pin block safety, and then the physical separation of the frame from the slide - which couldn't happen easily - all in combination. That's still not a "spontaneous" firing. That's neglect by the armourer and/or operator.
This story came out one or two weeks ago I believe ..... surprised it took so long to make it to CGN.
No LEO deserves such a life altering event .... speedy recovery to him.
These types of events are why many people are suspicious of handguns without an external safety, but I would suspect a mechanical issue here; Police used revolvers for decades without any safety.
On a side note, I see a lot of LEO from a couple agencies shopping at a large, local grocery retailer with their pistol on their hip and nobody in the store even blinks, yet for some people, a rifle at home in a safe is seen as a big public safety risk? User error is the bigger public safety risk ..... unless it was a mechanical defect of some kind.
No LEO deserves such a life altering event .... speedy recovery to him.
These types of events are why many people are suspicious of handguns without an external safety, but I would suspect a mechanical issue here; Police used revolvers for decades without any safety.
On a side note, I see a lot of LEO from a couple agencies shopping at a large, local grocery retailer with their pistol on their hip and nobody in the store even blinks, yet for some people, a rifle at home in a safe is seen as a big public safety risk? User error is the bigger public safety risk ..... unless it was a mechanical defect of some kind.
While I hate to seem like I'm rushing to glocks defense, mechanical things do break, doesn't matter if they're Glock, Ford, or snap-on. I'd personally be having a chat with whomever is responsible for ensuring all duty weapons are in serviceable and working condition before it being used.
Make sure your tools are in working condition, problem avoided.
Never the less, speedy recovery to the officer.
As for "why do they carry with one in the chamber", I'm reminded of a quote.
"Carry with an empty chamber, and you'll spend the rest of your life racking the slide"
Let that sink in.
Thank you for this, it explains so many of the people on my ignore list.
I'm posting these charts up in the office asap
You describe Canadian Police life like they are dealing with instantly appearing danger all day long. How frequently they deal with an armed suspect all of a sudden without being dispatched to deal with it first ? Close to zero times in their career ?
I bet many reasonable officers go without round chambered. But the cowboys that are affraid that their adrenaline will go in a way when needed, need a round in the chamber at all times, a ?
If they are dispatched at some risky task or area, round is to be chambered for sure before arriving. And if a police officer is affraid of his adrenaline getting in the way, he better resign right away for the public good
