Had a boner for Silver Pigeon V, but after discovering that case hardening is chemically applied and can be removed with some solvents-boner disappeared. Went with F16. Apparently, it is hard to shoot SXS so I decided to go O/U (or U/O). Had pumps and semiauto-two barrels add cool factor (and, perhaps street credit). Anyway, try to choose a several gans, read about them and if you still like them-at least go a touch them before you buy. Or better yet, shoot them if you have a chance.
Thoughts on over under Shotguns?
- Thread starter riverview
- Start date
Turkinator
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Onterrible
O/U Shotguns are pure class
Over/unders - I've had a few, still have three - Brownings and a Beretta.
Side by sides - I've had a flock of them in my 55 years of shooting sports. Injecting a little humour - "Your eyes are side by side, so should the barrels be."
A cheap over/under is most often a failure waiting to happen. I don't buy guns hoping that I luck out and get a good one, which seems to be the situation with bottom end over/unders.
Side by sides - I've had a flock of them in my 55 years of shooting sports. Injecting a little humour - "Your eyes are side by side, so should the barrels be."
A cheap over/under is most often a failure waiting to happen. I don't buy guns hoping that I luck out and get a good one, which seems to be the situation with bottom end over/unders.
Personally, I don't find it difficult to shoot a SxS, I use them exclusively for my upland hunting, and I have shot clean rounds of skeet with them. But the selection of good quality SxS shotguns is much more limited than O/U shotguns, and most are lighter weight field guns, not suitable for high volume clay shooting. Then again, many of the cheaper O/U shotguns won't stand up to high volume shooting either.
fishslinger
CGN Regular
- Location
- southern ontario
I think the previous post have covered why o/u are so popular. I will just add I have them in 410 thru 12ga and if all I could use is o/u’s for hunting and clays game’s. I wouldn’t feel bad about it.
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I collect, use on the range and hunt upland birds exclusively with my side by sides, I love them dearly and shoot them ( all of them) well. However, for high volume clay target shooting, especially for trap, I prefer and use over/unders and/or a trap single. These guns are designed and built to be optimum performers over many years and 100's of thousands of rounds with minimum breakage or repairs and are the choice of the best shots in the world. No autoloader or pump can stand up to this use and where every target lost can be the difference between first place and loser, the over/ under is King. However you get what you pay for, you can't expect a bargain basement gun to equal a purpose built gun by the proven champions, they earned their reputation in years of top competition. The cheap gun will shoot loose, parts will break and wear and within the breakin period of many of the better guns you can expect problems with the cheap gun. For hunting purposes where maybe a couple of hundred rounds fired would be a helluva season, these inexpensive guns can provide satisfaction for many years, if you like an over/ under one may be worth a shot ( pun intended).
Regarding pump guns standing up to competition - you really should look up the Trap and Skeet records of famous shooters with high quality Model 12 Winchesters or Remington 870s which have both shot many, many thousands of rounds.
Pump guns are not fashionable on the Trap and Skeet ranges now, but in their day, shooters using pump guns set some remarkable records.
Pump guns are not fashionable on the Trap and Skeet ranges now, but in their day, shooters using pump guns set some remarkable records.
Falconflyer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
That's absolutely true but they were not putting the kind of round count through the pump guns that O/U and single barrel trap guns are built for. I know of two Mx8's, one with over 1 million rounds through it and one with over 2 million rounds through it, no pump gun will last that that long no matter how many times it's get's rebuilt and I think that is what Ashcroft is getting at. Those pump guns that were the darling of yesteryear's trap shooters lasted pretty good but they were cheap to buy and when they were worn out they were just replaced.
Falconflyer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
The biggest advantage that the o/u has over the sxs as far as shoot ability goes is that the o/u does not cover the target with the muzzles on certain target angles.
As far as durability goes, the o/u gun generally lasts longer than sxs's just due to it's design. And good o/u guns can be rebuilt very cheaply as long as they haven't been left too long and the average tinkerer can tighten up his 686 or citori on his garage bench for a few hundred dollars.
As far as durability goes, the o/u gun generally lasts longer than sxs's just due to it's design. And good o/u guns can be rebuilt very cheaply as long as they haven't been left too long and the average tinkerer can tighten up his 686 or citori on his garage bench for a few hundred dollars.
Browning Citoris and Beretta 68x series guns rarely make 100k rounds without major work. No criticism there.
The ammunition cost dwarfs the gun cost.
Fred and Rudy Etchen and many others, shot hundreds of thousands from pump guns, with minor repairs until a receiver wore out.
Over unders are not bullet proof, requiring firing pins, springs and ejector work as regular maintenance, for high volume shooting.
I could explain in detail about 68x Beretta ejectors made up of little bits, but you get my point.
None of this applies to the average hobby shooter, who does not approach the volume of a serious competitor, in a lifetime.
The ammunition cost dwarfs the gun cost.
Fred and Rudy Etchen and many others, shot hundreds of thousands from pump guns, with minor repairs until a receiver wore out.
Over unders are not bullet proof, requiring firing pins, springs and ejector work as regular maintenance, for high volume shooting.
I could explain in detail about 68x Beretta ejectors made up of little bits, but you get my point.
None of this applies to the average hobby shooter, who does not approach the volume of a serious competitor, in a lifetime.
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How heavy the loads fired 1oz 1180 vs 1 1/8 1250 puts more stress on the gun and will make a difference over time for worn parts.
Have a field 20ga browning lighting o/u after 20 years of use the block needs to be replaced no hi volume shooting at all but heavy loads and opening closing hundreds of thousands of times its time for a rebuild. It out lasted 4 hunting dogs only problem it had was a broken ejector of course it did that 1100km away from home on a hunting trip.
IMO there is a lot more worn out quality SXS hunting guns then quality O/U.
Have a field 20ga browning lighting o/u after 20 years of use the block needs to be replaced no hi volume shooting at all but heavy loads and opening closing hundreds of thousands of times its time for a rebuild. It out lasted 4 hunting dogs only problem it had was a broken ejector of course it did that 1100km away from home on a hunting trip.
IMO there is a lot more worn out quality SXS hunting guns then quality O/U.
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Falconflyer
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Replacing springs, hammers, trunions and lock pins/tongues isn't what I consider major work and you can bet that those guys replaced lots of parts on their pump guns. I don't think that 686's and citori's were ever designed with hundreds of thousands of rounds in mind but they can get there with care and minor repairs. I know of several 682's that have around 150k rounds through them before getting tightened, up until then is just minor parts replacements. For the most part, over and under's have less parts to wear out than pumps.
Yes, American pumps such as M12 and 870, along with Browning A5's were common on North American trap and skeet fields fields in the 30's through the 1960's and many championships were won with them. They were common because they were affordable and they were competitive against others of this type. However, the Browning Superposed was the only decent over/under at this time, Perazzi, Beretta, Kreighoff, and most other top competition guns had not yet made their mark, and it was too expensive for many shooters however it paved the way for over/unders by showing advantages that took more than their share of top tier wins. Once the competitive advantage of the best over/unders was clearly demonstrated and understood they quickly took over as competition guns. It is a novelty today to see a pump or two or even more than a handfull of autos at a major competition like a provincial/ state Grand with hundreds of competitors. The reason being that these shooters all want to win and they use the tools that they believe gives them the best opportunity to do this. Yes, any gun can and eventually will break, but one that lets you down in a major tournament where every target is vital will be quickly replaced.
mosinmaster
CGN frequent flyer
Anybody ever try extended waterfowl choke tubes like a Patternmaster, Jebs, Kicks Highflyer or similar in an O/U and how did that work for them? I've had good luck with a Patternmaster in a pump, and wondering if it works well in a O/U, specifically a Silver Pigeon.
Don't agree .Most of us that wanted a over under went to remington 32's and then 3200 and still use them today. Dam good guns IMO
My first new 3200 was 400 bucks in 73?? real reasonable
However semi's like the 1100 were the go to gun in the mid 60's after we hung our pumps up
I kept my sets to this day in 870 and 1100
Cheers
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Trunnions, locking blocks, and hinge pins are not home hobbiest replacement items in over under shotguns, due to requirement for fitting. Building up and refitting the barrel lugs is often a solution for Brownings.
Firing pins and springs, release lever springs and ejector parts are within the skills of a capable hobbiest.
Some people should never have their fingers inside the mechanism of a shotgun.
Firing pins and springs, release lever springs and ejector parts are within the skills of a capable hobbiest.
Some people should never have their fingers inside the mechanism of a shotgun.
3macs1, I'm sure you love your 870 and 1100 and shoot them well. In their day they were competitive in North America, never became the go-to gun in the Olympics or internationally. They were superceded by the superior although more expensive over under at all levels of competition many years ago and are no longer competitive in top level competition. Even former wizards with these guns like the Etchens and others no longer use these guns in competition because they shoot the newer over/ unders better. The Remington 32's and later the Remington 3200's were very scarce anywhere I shot in this country, I probably saw my first about 1985 and never saw more than a few. Citoris, Win 101's, various Beretta over/unders and singles, Ljutics, then Perazzis, the K guns and others took over in the west, an occasional Mod 12 or 870 would show up and a few 1100's but these guns were never in the money or trophy circle. Not knocking the older guns, they were state of the art champions in their day but they have been superceded long ago in the winners circle, maybe not in their owner's heart. Field guns? Fun shooting? Shoot what pleases you of any type. if it's reasonably well made it will serve you well.
I just got my first o/u stoeger condor they are a good work horse gun at a very affordable price.i love it have only done a few rounds of clays with it but like it just wanted something different.they are very easy and slick to operate.very handy also if you are hunting upland birds you can open the action up so easy and unload if you want.stoeger has sxs models out now too and others brands there are affordable ones to be had new now which is nice if you cant find a used one.just pick some up in the store and get a feel for them and compare.
