Best HD option in .223?

[PinaKaleada]

Range =/= force on force / reality

I am sure you can point shoot supper great on the range, in reality not so much. I cant think of a single reputable trainer that recommends "point" shooting for anything other than shoot from retention unless you think Voda is reputable.

Sorry you can claim its not far on the range at a perfect 90% to the target all you want, it does not change the fact that it is simple is not a good choice tactically or morally in reality

Shawn

I forgot to add.
Did you know 3ft is almost arm reach?
Did you know with a bat you almost have 2 meter range?

5 meter is actually really close. If you can repeatedly raise your handgun and your sights are naturally aligned, you can point-and-shoot.

Point and shoot =/= gangster-style one-hand sideways.

 

[Grizzlypeg]

No love for a pistol calibre carbine in these situation?

 

[shawn]

Did you know 3ft is almost arm reach?

And?

Did you know with a bat you almost have 2 meter range?

Did you know with an extension ladder you almost have 12m range?

5 meter is actually really close. If you can repeatedly raise your handgun and your sights are naturally aligned, you can point-and-shoot

I think I will stick with all the actual instructors and force on force/ reality tested techniques. Sorry no matter how much you want it to be the range does not equal reality or training

Point and shoot =/= gangster-style one-hand sideways.

Never said it did, you did because you cant actually provide anything to support your position other than I can do on the range while plinking

Shawn

 

[shawn]

No love for a pistol calibre carbine in these situation?

Same issues as rifle or shotgun takes two hands to use effectively

Shawn

 

[PinaKaleada]

And?



Did you know with an extension ladder you almost have 12m range?



I think I will stick with all the actual instructors and force on force/ reality tested techniques. Sorry no matter how much you want it to be the range does not equal reality or training



Never said it did, you did because you cant actually provide anything to support your position other than I can do on the range while plinking

Shawn

I realize there's no conflict. It's the difference in ability between two people.

For me, god forbid, if put in this situation:
Above 5 meters I would aim,
3-5 meter I would point,
Inside 3 meters I might shoot from hip

But for you:
-Home intruder just few steps away
-You take your pistol up to eye level
-Put the front dot between the two rear dot
-Hold this cluster on target before pulling the trigger.

LOL. If target is worth shooting, there wont be enough time for you to do all this. And also, I'm curious but where exactly are you doing your training at?

 

[shawn]

LOL

Now we go from 5m to a few steps away when you try an BS your way through an exageration to try and justify your postion.

We know by your posts you don't train at all. So sorry but going to the range and plinking is not training, no matter how much CGN wants it to be.

Shawn

 

[shawn]

LOL. If guy is worth shooting, there wont be enough time for you to do all this.

LOL is right you are so wrong and you don't even know it

I have literally done it and so does everyone that has actually trains and done force on force.

You also completely fail to grasp that simply being on a range does not make it training

Shawn

 

[wicked_police]

Again, cgn does not fail to deliver. lol

Especially pina-whatever his (or her) name is.

 

[android-android]

My thoughts on this thread:

1. Canadians do have a right to self defence, and to use firearms against criminal attackers; however
2. Section 88 of the criminal code makes it a crime to possess a weapon for a purpose dangerous to the public peace. Judges have interpreted this to include possession of any object for 'protection.'
3. If I was ever going to buy a gun in Canada for the expressed purpose of "home defense", I would never brag about it on the internet, as if it ever came about that I actually used it for that purpose, these posts would inevitably surface during the subsequent RCMP investigation. Finally;
4. The good news is, that day will never come, seeing as we live in Canada, and the only statistically significant population actually at risk of home invasions are career criminals. HD is a fun topic to read and chat about, but I consider it to be almost a "fantasy" subject, thankfully, here in Canada.

 

[PinaKaleada]

LOL

Now we go from 5m to a few steps away when you try an BS your way through an exageration to try and justify your postion.

We know by your posts you don't train at all. So sorry but going to the range and plinking is not training, no matter how much CGN wants it to be.

Shawn

Hey my question for you, "the guy who trains force on force", can you or can you not, point-and-shoot a 10x12 sized target 5 meters away? You keep dodging the question somehow.

 

[shawn]

My thoughts on this thread:

1. Canadians do have a right to self defence, and to use firearms against criminal attackers; however
2. Section 88 of the criminal code makes it a crime to possess a weapon for a purpose dangerous to the public peace. Judges have interpreted this to include possession of any object for 'protection.'
3. If I was ever going to buy a gun in Canada for the expressed purpose of "home defense", I would never brag about it on the internet, as if it ever came about that I actually used it for that purpose, these posts would inevitably surface during the subsequent RCMP investigation. Finally;
4. The good news is, that day will never come, seeing as we live in Canada, and the only statistically significant population actually at risk of home invasions are career criminals. HD is a fun topic to read and chat about, but I consider it to be almost a "fantasy" subject, thankfully, here in Canada.

The firearms act allows you to acquire firearms specifically for defense. It is the first reason listed

Shawn

 

[mclmm]

The firearms act allows you to acquire firearms specifically for defense. It is the first reason listed

Shawn

Please link to the specific section:

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-11.6/

 

[shawn]

Hey my question for you, "the guy who trains force on force", can you or can you not, point-and-shoot a 10x12 sized target 5 meters away? You keep dodging the question somehow.

Yeah I probably could.

I could also probably ricochet a round off a cast iron pan hanging on the wall and hit a target on the range as well. Doesn't mean that it is a tactically or morally correct way to operate in a gun fight.

Your turn, this should be good :rollseyes:

can you guarantee that all your rounds will land within a 10 inch circle under stress in the dark when you were not planning on a gun fight at 5m. All the while your target is moving, unlit, the target is at an oblique angle, and you cant see the 10 inch circle because it is under one or more baggy layers of clothes

We all know you either wont answer and make up some BS as to you do it every day on the range LOL

Shawn

 

[shawn]

Please link to the specific section:

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-11.6/

You already did read it. Try section 28

Shawn

 

[mclmm]

You already did read it

Shawn

Yup. So, again, please link to the specific section where, as you claim:

The firearms act allows you to acquire firearms specifically for defense. It is the first reason listed.

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-11.6/

I'll wait.

 

[PinaKaleada]

Yeah I probably could.

I could also probably ricochet a round off a cast iron pan hanging on the wall and hit a target on the range as well. Doesn't mean that it is a tactically or morally correct way to operate in a gun fight.

Your turn, this should be good :rollseyes:



We all know you either wont answer and make up some BS as to you do it every day on the range LOL

Shawn

Can I? I can, and you admit you can as well.

So morals what? We both established we can both point-and-shoot a target 5 meters away so morals what?

 

[Clemenchick]

Yup. So, again, please link to the specific section where, as you claim:



https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/f-11.6/

I'll wait.

 

[shawn]

LOL

That didnt age well did it

Shawn

 

[shawn]

Can I? I can, and you admit you can as well.

So morals what? We both established we can both point-and-shoot a target 5 meters away so morals what?

We established you think plinking targets on a static range is the equivalent of training and gun fighting in non permissive environments

So you advocate for the ricochet iron pan method as an effective tactic in a gun fight? Because if you can do it on the range that makes it valid in a gun fight right?

You going to answer or dodge?

can you guarantee that all your rounds will land within a 10 inch circle under stress in the dark when you were not planning on a gun fight at 5m. All the while your target is moving, unlit, the target is at an oblique angle, and you cant see the 10 inch circle because it is under one or more baggy layers of clothes

This has to be some kind of record for CGN having to actually argue that the proper thing to do is use your sights in a gun fight inside your house. If this wasn't so sad it would be hilarious

Shawn

 

[mclmm]

LOL

That didnt age well did it

Shawn

It aged really well because, barring a small population 28(a)(i)(ii), the approvals, are not for the purpose of defense. Claiming otherwise is obtuse.