SKS at the range

OkayShooter said:
The video proves nothing. Since it has NOTHING to do with a SKS. So easy to say when it is a hunting rifle with a smooth barrel, about barrel harmonics. When there is NO gas block, no gas tube, no front sight base, no bayonet lug, no cleaning rod, oh the piece that the stock slips into. Nothing on or touching the barrel. Everything you add, effects harmonics. And nothing about receiver mounts.

So you are grasping straws, and hate to say your wrong. Because you really think your barrel clamp is the best.

When I had SKS, I even played with this method, made a straight pull SKS.. I started to remove everything off the barrel, and seen changes in the accuracy.
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The video has much to do with an SKS, it demonstrates how barrel harmonics work and shows why an SKS barrel can not be harmonised…

The barrel mounted optic is better than anything else on a barrel that can not be floated because it make no difference at what position the barrel comes to rest. The optic is always on target, not so when it's mounted anywhere else.
 
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The fellow with that vid (wavelength1970) also has one from in front of the rifle. http s://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bf9m0r-z5Vo Shows a little 'whip' and that the bayo also dances a bit. However, if Vicar and Insane Accuracy (YT-vid) say it works-YMMV. I've got a barrel mount ordered to see for myself -just hope my $30 dot survives ^O^
 
Vicar said:
The video has much to do with an SKS, it demonstrates how barrel harmonics work and shows why an SKS barrel can not be harmonised…

The barrel mounted optic is better than anything else on a barrel that can not be floated because it make no difference at what position the barrel comes to rest. The optic is always on target, not so when it's mounted anywhere else.
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I'm with Lord here. The video is opposite of what you are saying. It explains WHY, my groups improved, when I removed stuff off the barrel on my test SKS ( with a receiver mount ) Or why a barrel mounted bipod, effects the POI. But keep believing yourself.

http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=29037.0

Much accuracy can be gained from cleaning up the fore end. And this, quite frankly, is the Achilles Heel of the SKS from an accuracy standpoint. It's a semi-auto rifle. It relies on moving parts that are attached to the barrel. Without the gas system, it wouldn't be an SKS. But with them, it's just not as accurate as, say, a bolt action rifle. But more importantly, the doo-dads hanging off the front end of the SKS are bad for accuracy. Like the bayonet, any added things like bipods, muzzle brakes, etc. To make it as accurate as it can be, these should be removed. And the barrel unconstricted.


But this leads to the worst part of all. The stock attachment point. There is a ferrule pinned under the barrel that holds the stock's forearm. With the stock properly fitted to the ferrule so it's not loose, it puts bind on the barrel. Keep in mind that the barrel expands and gets longer as it heats up. So any binding points will affect the true straightness of the barrel. The POI will change as the binding pressure changes when it heats up. This is why, of course, the most accurate rifles have free-floated barrels. Or a lot of mass like a bull barrel. A free-floating barrel has nothing to bind on it, thus it can expand purely on its own. And a bull barrel has more mass to absorb more heat (and thus more firing) before it starts to expand.
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OkayShooter said:
I'm with Lord here. The video is opposite of what you are saying. It explains WHY, my groups improved, when I removed stuff off the barrel on my test SKS ( with a receiver mount ) Or why a barrel mounted bipod, effects the POI. But keep believing yourself.

http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=29037.0
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Post a live hit video to back up your claim, otherwise it will remain nothing more.
 
The tilt lock bolt doesnt aid in achieving accuracy either.

Other big factors regarding sks accuracy are:

Receiver play in the stock.
Headspace
Crown condition
Over gasing
Overall barrel wear.

People may say BLAH who cares its just a minute of badguy range pig. BUT the exceptional accuracy demonstrated by VZ 58s shows that 7.62x39 semi autos CAN be made / tuned to a better level. Depending on if the accuracy influencers can be corrected.
 
What mechanically keeps guns like the SKS, Type 81 and M10x from achieving better accuracy ?

People ask the same thing about their pie plate MOA M305s AND thru extensive studying and improving have tweaked the gun to shoot closer to 1 MOA.
 
Murray 3-D said:
People may say BLAH who cares its just a minute of badguy range pig. BUT the exceptional accuracy demonstrated by VZ 58s shows that 7.62x39 semi autos CAN be made / tuned to a better level. Depending on if the accuracy influencers can be corrected.
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Well Czechs sure know how to build guns. And normally most CZ guns are very accurate.

Murray 3-D said:
What mechanically keeps guns like the SKS, Type 81 and M10x from achieving better accuracy ?

People ask the same thing about their pie plate MOA M305s AND thru extensive studying and improving have tweaked the gun to shoot closer to 1 MOA.
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Running better ammo.
 
OkayShooter said:
But this leads to the worst part of all. The stock attachment point. There is a ferrule pinned under the barrel that holds the stock's forearm. With the stock properly fitted to the ferrule so it's not loose, it puts bind on the barrel. Keep in mind that the barrel expands and gets longer as it heats up. So any binding points will affect the true straightness of the barrel.
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When stock properly fitted to the ferrule it is loose. That is how it was designed.

There must be gaps between stock's forearm and that ferrule. See picture 71 in the manual below where it says no less than 0.4 and 0.5 mm

The only front point of contact of the receiver is the crossbolt. Barrel must not touch the stock forearm, so it is kind of free floated.

In the back the spring under the trigger group is what holds receiver to the stock vertically when trigger group is connected to receiver. There must be 0.3-1 mm gap between back of the receiver and the stock as in the pic 73 (before receiver is connected to trigger group). Receiver moves up\down because of the spring and that gap during recoil. Here is the video - watch at 16:50

https://youtu.be/xCRHiCFXhmQ?t=1008


Therefore there are 2 ways to improve accuracy:

1. Shim the crossbolt (proper way is to replace it) if the horizontal gap in the back of the receiver is too big because stock wood is too old. So that receiver does not move back and forth more than 2 mm.

2. Replace that spring with a new one if the old spring is too weak.





15384325.jpg
 
Murray 3-D said:
What mechanically keeps guns like the SKS, Type 81 and M10x from achieving better accuracy ?

People ask the same thing about their pie plate MOA M305s AND thru extensive studying and improving have tweaked the gun to shoot closer to 1 MOA.
Click to expand...

Don't believe everything you are told.
 
gshamray said:
When stock properly fitted to the ferrule it is loose. That is how it was designed.

There must be gaps between stock's forearm and that ferrule. See picture 71 in the manual below where it says no less than 0.4 and 0.5 mm

The only front point of contact of the receiver is the crossbolt. Barrel must not touch the stock forearm, so it is kind of free floated.

In the back the spring under the trigger group is what holds receiver to the stock vertically when trigger group is connected to receiver. There must be 0.3-1 mm gap between back of the receiver and the stock as in the pic 73 (before receiver is connected to trigger group). Receiver moves up\down because of the spring and that gap during recoil. Here is the video - watch at 16:50

https://youtu.be/xCRHiCFXhmQ?t=1008


Therefore there are 2 ways to improve accuracy:

1. Shim the crossbolt (proper way is to replace it) if the horizontal gap in the back of the receiver is too big because stock wood is too old. So that receiver does not move back and forth more than 2 mm.

2. Replace that spring with a new one if the old spring is too weak.





15384325.jpg
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Judging by the pic it looks like it makes contact with the ferrule at the front. They just want a bit of gap between the ferrule and the front faces of the stock. Pretty similar to the accurizing methods of M14's. Neither of which call for a complete free float. Hence why when I made my SVD SKS stock and was faced with this dilemma, I opted to keep only downward pressure at the ferrule location. And eliminated all other contact forward of the receiver.
 
Murray 3-D said:
Yes ive seen that many times, but it will be interesting to find the limits of the platform WITH the gas system. Trying to accurize a semi auto by removing the semi auto is completely contradicting haha
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I think it would involve making a stock, that mounts differently than a stock SKS, and reloading. With using some inspiration of the SVD.

I almost want to buy a SKS to try this, but doubt you can buy them for 75$ anymore? I'm not paying 400$.
 
I know a guy in edmonton did that to an SKS... they got it sub moa... but yeah a bolt action SKS is no longer an SKS lol.

So either Vicar is a biggest troll in the red rifle forum history... or he subscribes to the
"my windshield wipers aren't arrow dynamic; so good fuel economy is impossible on my car...
there for adding banner flags, square sign boards, a snow plow and scoops without outlets will there for have no more adverse effects on my fuel economy from air resistance. You know, since since my fuel economy is already bad from the un-arrow dynamic windshield wipers."
philosophy

I kinda want to run into him at the range so I can make fun of his minute of barn SKS's that are somehow immune to the laws of physics and outshooting other members accurized SKS's
 
LordEvilPepper said:
I know a guy in edmonton did that to an SKS... they got it sub moa... but yeah a bolt action SKS is no longer an SKS lol.

So either Vicar is a biggest troll in the red rifle forum history... or he subscribes to the
"my windshield wipers aren't arrow dynamic; so good fuel economy is impossible on my car...
there for adding banner flags, square sign boards, a snow plow and scoops without outlets will there for have no more adverse effects on my fuel economy from air resistance. You know, since since my fuel economy is already bad from the un-arrow dynamic windshield wipers."
philosophy

I kinda want to run into him at the range so I can make fun of his minute of barn SKS's that are somehow immune to the laws of physics and outshooting other members accurized SKS's
Click to expand...

If a MOA rifle is what you want then buy one, there is no need to destroy a perfectly good SKS.
 
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