What makes a semi reliable?

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huntingfish

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Hey fellow gun nuts,
I have eyes on a semi in 20ga (Armsan semi). No particular need for it, just think it would be interesting to use for small game, although I did get an O/U as well in 12 ga. Anyways, I was wondering, what makes a semi-auto shotgun reliable? The quality of the gas system, good ammo, bigger ammo (3" vs 2 3/4") or all of the above? Are gas-system prone to breaking and if so, I guess it's important to be able to get replacement pieces?

Thanks!

David
 
Ammo shouldn't be a factor in reliability, if you have to go to more powerful ammo to make the gun work then either the gun wasn't designed for light loads or something else is holding up the cycling such as dirt and crud. A well designed gas system that doesn't lend itself to fouling quickly with parts that don't break plays a big part in reliability. Inertia actions should be more reliable than gas actions simply due to being less complex but having said that, the newer gas systems are very good.
 
Falconflyer: I usually am pretty good with cleaning. Right after I come back home (at worst, the next day), I clean my rifles/shotguns: Bore, receiver, etc. I do not do a complete strip every time though. Would that be acceptable with a semi or would I need to do a complete strip every time I use it in order to ensure there's no fouling anywhere?

David
 
Falconflyer said:
Ammo shouldn't be a factor in reliability, if you have to go to more powerful ammo to make the gun work then either the gun wasn't designed for light loads or something else is holding up the cycling such as dirt and crud. A well designed gas system that doesn't lend itself to fouling quickly with parts that don't break plays a big part in reliability. Inertia actions should be more reliable than gas actions simply due to being less complex but having said that, the newer gas systems are very good.
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Depends on the gun, my buddy has a semi auto Stevens inertia cycling shotgun that will not cycle black cloud or blindside. Runs fast steel like a champ though.
 
huntingfish said:
Are Armsan semis known to be of decent quality? I realize it's not a 2000$ gun, but I'm not willing to pay for a 2000$ gun either

David
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A member brought a new one out for skeet, and it jammed solid after two shots. The guy removed the fore end, slid the barrel back into place, installed the fore end and the same results. We looked at the fore end, and it wasn't made properly, so it was sliding over the retainer when fired. The guy did some work on his own, and managed to get the barrel to stay in place so it would function, but then he stuck the barrel in the mud on a goose hunt and the barrel ruptured when fired, and the gun was disposed of in the junk pile, where it belonged.
 
huntingfish said:
Falconflyer: I usually am pretty good with cleaning. Right after I come back home (at worst, the next day), I clean my rifles/shotguns: Bore, receiver, etc. I do not do a complete strip every time though. Would that be acceptable with a semi or would I need to do a complete strip every time I use it in order to ensure there's no fouling anywhere?

David
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I mostly depends on what your doing with the gun. I used to shoot sporting clays occasionally with a guy who would go the entire summer without cleaning his 391 Beretta and he could get away with that unless he was in dusty conditions, as soon as it got dusty then his gun would quit him. I don't think cleaning after every outing is necessary with most of the newer semi's if you using them regularly, just wipe em down and relube but if the gun is going to sit more than a few days before being used again then you should clean it. A lot of the older semi's just wouldn't stand for that sort of treatment and is one of the reason's I switched to over and under guns for the majority of my shooting, I had a Browning 2000 many years ago that would function for a 200 round event just fine but it wouldn't last for a second round of 200 without tearing it down first for a detailed cleaning of the gas system.
If you like cleaning your guns like many of us do then you'll have no issues shooting a few birds each year and you'll soon figure out just how clean the Armsan likes to be for reliability.
 
Slipnslide said:
Depends on the gun, my buddy has a semi auto Stevens inertia cycling shotgun that will not cycle black cloud or blindside. Runs fast steel like a champ though.
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The question was about bigger or quality ammo and I stand by what I said in that regard. Bigger shouldn't matter if the gun was designed for it and cheap loads should work as well as expensive loads.
Many guns have a brand of ammo that they don't like. I had a Benelli Vinci a few years ago that would cycle everything I put through it with the exception of Remington Gun Clubs which it would fail to feed every time.
 
When I was in Argentina on a dove hunt the ranch owner told me of a benelli 20 g that they experimented on. They did not clean it to see how many rounds they could run through it. Dove hunting you shoot a pile of shells I shot 7000 in 3 days. They figured they put 50,000 rounds through it before it ceased to function, the result of the stoppage so much unburnt powder it seized the firing pin .That was their story and they don't sell guns .
 
My Armsan 12ga has not skipped a beat from 1 Oz target loads to 1 1/4 oz 3" steel loads. Granted, I only have about 200 rounds through it. So far I am impressed with it for a $500 gun. Finish wise its a much nicer gun than an 870 express. The cast/pitch shims were a nice touch. Their choke contrictions are ambitious (i.e. tighter than listed).

There are a lot of very postive reviews of Armsan semis online. They arent a premium gun, but appear to be very good value for money.

Lots of UK reviews out there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7nZ_I829Pc&list=UUcQZw5EXW6ixRWEaNnB9E9A&index=104
 
kayaker1 said:
My Armsan 12ga has not skipped a beat from 1 Oz target loads to 1 1/4 oz 3" steel loads. Granted, I only have about 200 rounds through it. So far I am impressed with it for a $500 gun. Finish wise its a much nicer gun than an 870 express. The cast/pitch shims were a nice touch. Their choke contrictions are ambitious (i.e. tighter than listed).

There are a lot of very postive reviews of Armsan semis online. They arent a premium gun, but appear to be very good value for money.

Lots of UK reviews out there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7nZ_I829Pc&list=UUcQZw5EXW6ixRWEaNnB9E9A&index=104
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That was a good watch. Thanks!
 
You have to take a video like that with a grain of salt though. It is only speaking of guns that I assume are basically new and only tested in that moment. Yes, they compared function and handling. Even then though one preferred the Beretta. However, that video does nothing as far as speaking to long term reliability .
 
gunsaholic said:
You have to take a video like that with a grain of salt though. It is only speaking of guns that I assume are basically new and only tested in that moment. Yes, they compared function and handling. Even then though one preferred the Beretta. However, that video does nothing as far as speaking to long term reliability .
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Absolutely. It's a snapshot in time. We have to keep that in mind.

David
 
reddog said:
When I was in Argentina on a dove hunt the ranch owner told me of a benelli 20 g that they experimented on. They did not clean it to see how many rounds they could run through it. Dove hunting you shoot a pile of shells I shot 7000 in 3 days. They figured they put 50,000 rounds through it before it ceased to function, the result of the stoppage so much unburnt powder it seized the firing pin .That was their story and they don't sell guns .
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You fired 7000 rounds in 3 days?? Geez, that's just over seven cases (or flats, if you insist) per day! 1750 rounds?!?
 
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