A thought for the off season - A Marlin 444 converted to fully rifled 410

Fox

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Think about it, you take a 444 Marlin, run a 410 reamer down it to lengthen the forcing cone, then make 2.5in long brass and load the ammo flush like a negant pistol.

You could then run essentially 444 marlin loads from 410 brass shotgun shells at a much higher pressure but still chamber and fire factory 410 slugs in the event that you are required to prove that you actually have a shotgun and not a rifle.

This of course would only be in a shotgun only area.

Guys are running smokeless muzzleloaders up to well over 2000fps and they are still muzzleloaders. People are running bolt action fully rifled shotguns at 2000fps, so why not a 410 rifled shotgun at 2200fps with a 240gr jacketed bullet in a lever action with a plug for 2rds in the magazine.
 
As long as the ammo meets the rules. I would assume it would work. They are just going to look at the head stamp, in BC you need at least a 20 gauge to hunt big game

Yu would have to blow the case out bigger then a 410 though. It needs a .429" bullet opposed to .410"
 
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Evanguy said:
As long as the ammo meets the rules. I would assume it would work. They are just going to look at the head stamp, in BC you need at least a 20 gauge to hunt big game

Yu would have to blow the case out bigger then a 410 though. It needs a .429" bullet opposed to .410"
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Ya, shotguns with shot have to be 20ga or larger but a 410 slug is legal in Ontario.

The OD of a 410 hull is 0.470, a 444 marlin is 0.4706, a 9.3x74R is 0.469.

You could use 444 Marlin brass but then it does not look like a shotgun shell, just looks like you are shooting a 444 Marlin during a shotgun hunt, but the 444 marlin case length is 2.225in and the 9.3x74R is 2.941. So you can essentially make a 3in or slightly shorter to work in the 444 marlin action (444 Marlin COAL is 2.55in) and then load the bullets inside the case to sit flush.

Standard 410 foster slugs measure out around 0.400-0.406, with the hollow base the foster slug would just barely grab the rifling.

It would be similar to shooting a 12ga foster in a rifled barrel, the fosters are generally undersized for reloading, even if factory is larger.
 
Problem I see is an under sized 0.410 slug being fire in a barrel meant for 0.429-0.430 bullets. Accuracy and leading issues would likely be a couple more problems. I like the ideal of a 410 lever with a rifles barrel but to do it right you would be better off rebarreling with a 41 mag barrel and rechambering to 410. Or find a 41 Rem mag lever and rechamber. Your barrel dimensions would be a lot better suited to 410 slugs.
A 41 lever wouldn’t be able to feed the 3” shell. 41 mag barrel would be your best option
 
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nowarningshot said:
I believe Winchester or Marlin put out a 410 lever gun. Sure they're pricey, but would be cheaper than paying to convert a 444. Bonus, you would still have the 444.
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Yet you would then have a smoothbore 410 with a standard 12,000psi 410 proofed receiver, in this case my bolt action mossberg would work just fine.
 
Snider shooter said:
Problem I see is an under sized 0.410 slug being fire in a barrel meant for 0.429-0.430 bullets. Accuracy and leading issues would likely be a couple more problems. I like the ideal of a 410 lever with a rifles barrel but to do it right you would be better off rebarreling with a 41 mag barrel and rechambering to 410. Or find a 41 Rem mag lever and rechamber. Your barrel dimensions would be a lot better suited to 410 slugs.
A 41 lever wouldn’t be able to feed the 3” shell. 41 mag barrel would be your best option
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Not the case, the 410 shotgun shells are thick, if using brass 410 shotgun shells the ID would accept 0.429 bullets, so yes if you want to run plastic hulls then the 41 mag idea is the way to go, I actually thought of this too.
 
9.3 Hunter said:
410 is 36 gauge FYI
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Well European companies call it that but with the actual measurement it would be something like 67 gauge but now I read this and there are 2 completely viable answers depending on the type of gun and how the bore is run.

"The .410 bore is a 67 ga by today's standards. The 36 ga comes about because the original guns were straight walled chambers. That is to say the chamber diameter was the bore diameter. This due to the use of brass shells and solid round balls for large game usually antelope on the African plains. The 36ga, therefore refers to the diameter of the chamber rather than the diameter of the modern bore proper.

Hope this didn't cause further confusion. Very few things in the naming of cartridges is cut and dried."

So a 0.410" bore is 67 gauge but the OD of the shell being 0.470" would lead to a 36 gauge.
 
Fox said:
Well European companies call it that but with the actual measurement it would be something like 67 gauge but now I read this and there are 2 completely viable answers depending on the type of gun and how the bore is run.

"The .410 bore is a 67 ga by today's standards. The 36 ga comes about because the original guns were straight walled chambers. That is to say the chamber diameter was the bore diameter. This due to the use of brass shells and solid round balls for large game usually antelope on the African plains. The 36ga, therefore refers to the diameter of the chamber rather than the diameter of the modern bore proper.

Hope this didn't cause further confusion. Very few things in the naming of cartridges is cut and dried."

So a 0.410" bore is 67 gauge but the OD of the shell being 0.470" would lead to a 36 gauge.
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Cool. learned something new today.


Are 410 rifled barrels and sabot slugs a thing? I don't really pay attention to the 410...
 
Fox said:
Think about it, you take a 444 Marlin, run a 410 reamer down it to lengthen the forcing cone, then make 2.5in long brass and load the ammo flush like a negant pistol.

You could then run essentially 444 marlin loads from 410 brass shotgun shells at a much higher pressure but still chamber and fire factory 410 slugs in the event that you are required to prove that you actually have a shotgun and not a rifle.

This of course would only be in a shotgun only area.

Guys are running smokeless muzzleloaders up to well over 2000fps and they are still muzzleloaders. People are running bolt action fully rifled shotguns at 2000fps, so why not a 410 rifled shotgun at 2200fps with a 240gr jacketed bullet in a lever action with a plug for 2rds in the magazine.
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I think you will find out that US Army did that in 1800's - they issued "foraging loads" to their cavalry with 45-70 carbines - discovered that the rifling caused the shot to rotate - resulted in a "torrid" shape of pattern - like a donut shape - there were few pellets where you aimed - most pellets in a torrid around where you aimed.
 
Potashminer said:
I think you will find out that US Army did that in 1800's - they issued "foraging loads" to their cavalry with 45-70 carbines - discovered that the rifling caused the shot to rotate - resulted in a "torrid" shape of pattern - like a donut shape - there were few pellets where you aimed - most pellets in a torrid around where you aimed.
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You are missing the point, this is a shotgun only area where you can use 410 slugs, this would be a slug gun only.
 
Fox said:
Think about it, you take a 444 Marlin, run a 410 reamer down it to lengthen the forcing cone, then make 2.5in long brass and load the ammo flush like a negant pistol.
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So you start with a 444 marlin rifle... You gonna get the caliber engraving on the barrel redone while you're at it? I suspect that is the first thing a CO is gonna look at?
 
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