Savage SMLE No. 4 two grove accuracy?

Mike Webb said:
When they selected rifles to be marked no.4 T was groove number a consideration? Just wondered if the T Lee Enfields were all 5 groove barrels?
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I’m not aware of any original no.4T rifles with 2 groove barrels, some have 6 groove barrels though instead of the more typical 5 groovers.
 
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I think any grouping under 3" is pretty good for a No4. I'm only referring to groups opening up with a 2 groove at 300m and out. I need to test this bullet drag theory.
 
I tried a friend's original matching T many years ago. I was impressed, around 1 3/4 inch three shot group at 100 yards with 1944 ball ammunition. I'm sure it would shoot moa with good ammo.
 
Dave Oakie, an ex-armourer and Service Rifle Queens Medal winner and trainer, won our annual Provincial Rifle Association .303 British shoot holding about MOA to 600m using an RCMP Long Branch 2-groove No. 4 Mk No 1 with TR sights. It is1 out of 1000 rifles that they had in service.

Regards,
Peter
 
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Mike Webb said:
I tried a friend's original matching T many years ago. I was impressed, around 1 3/4 inch three shot group at 100 yards with 1944 ball ammunition. I'm sure it would shoot moa with good ammo.
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That may actually have been "good ammo" for the era.

Most Lee Enfields of all marks can be hand loaded to shoot well as long as the bedding is excellent, the bore dimensions are on median spec and in excellent condition.

Back in the day the No4 T rifles were built and used, the sub moa groups, we love to chat about today, were mostly dreams and wishes.

Many of those lovely old rifles, when fed modern ammunition shoot much better than they did back in the day, mostly because tolerances are more consistent.

My No4 T shoots off the shelf ammo consistently into sub 2 moa groups, doesn't matter who made it.

It shoots Greek 74 date surplus the same and 71 date IVI a bit better.

These rifles are extremely ammo "fussy" for all sorts of reasons, but bedding is the major issue for them.
 
peterdobson said:
Dave Oakie, an ex-armourer and Service Rifle Queens Medal winner and trainer, won our annual Provincial Rifle Association .303 British shoot holding MOA to 600m using an RCMP Long Branch 2-groove No. 4 Mk No 1 with TR sights. It is1 out of 1000 rifles that they had in service.

Regards,
Peter
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I've seen WO Oakie's rifle and it is gorgeous. He had a PH5C on it at the time. I'm not saying that the 2 groove can't shoot at long distances. My opinion is that they are more susceptible to bullet drag due to a higher rate abd magnitude of copper fouling and residue. I think once fouledthey even start to recoil harder. There might be more drag imparted to the bullet compared to a five or six groove. It's only a theory but will be expensive to test. PS enfields can Excel at 500 and 600m. I used to regularly connect with my 1950 CNo4Mk1* at 500m at that old 12/59. I miss those days terribly.
 
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