British Bulldog slugs to .404" - what calibre is that?
- Thread starter svt-40
- Start date
.404 sounds pretty tight but im no expert.
Looking at my cartridge data it looks like the 44webley and bulldog are too big for your chamber dia.
It sounds like its most likely a 442 revolver or 442 webley but those cartridges had a .436-.440 dia bullet.
Your bore dia seems to better match the 440 revolver cartridge. The 440 brass might be a bit loose though as its only .440 dia at the base of the case.
It might be the 430 revolver cartridge. It had a .428 bullet with a case that was about .450 at the base.
All were made back in the 1870's
Has the gun been re-barrelled?
Looking at my cartridge data it looks like the 44webley and bulldog are too big for your chamber dia.
It sounds like its most likely a 442 revolver or 442 webley but those cartridges had a .436-.440 dia bullet.
Your bore dia seems to better match the 440 revolver cartridge. The 440 brass might be a bit loose though as its only .440 dia at the base of the case.
It might be the 430 revolver cartridge. It had a .428 bullet with a case that was about .450 at the base.
All were made back in the 1870's
Has the gun been re-barrelled?
To me this bore diameter sounds like 41 calibre, but the cylinder, which is matching to the gun, sounds too large for that. I can't guarantee that the chambers are original, but it definitely has not been re-barreled.
Alot of these guns used ammo that used heeled bullets and that Screws up your trying to figger out Whats up.
Also ive come accross quite a few Belgian and some british guns that Had way bigger chamber throats than the Bores.
Them guns didnt Shoot that great for me.
But this also creates a whole new opportunity.
I can order a $25 2-cavity 41 calibre mold from Lee and use 44 rem mag case sized down. The bullet will go all the way in, like in a Russian 1895 Nagant. That way the bullet is matching the bore and the case is matching the chamber, plus I don't have to crimp.
Does that make sense?
Guess, the guns with such a difference in bore vs chamber were specifically designed for hollow based bullets to ensure sealing the bore...
I can order a $25 2-cavity 41 calibre mold from Lee and use 44 rem mag case sized down. The bullet will go all the way in, like in a Russian 1895 Nagant. That way the bullet is matching the bore and the case is matching the chamber, plus I don't have to crimp.
Does that make sense?
Guess, the guns with such a difference in bore vs chamber were specifically designed for hollow based bullets to ensure sealing the bore...
I hear you! Im trying to Build a Decent 41 Colt DA Navy model 1892
There 41 LC But they have no Chamber throats and use either a heeled bullet .401 dia or a .386 HB slug that seats normally. there Bores are to big at .408 or so.
The guns were good to 15 to 25 Yds max.
BUT i bought a 38 Cal colt cylinder for it.
Im reaming that Cylinder for 41 LC cases BUT im leaveing a Chamber throat in the front and screwing a 38 Barrel into the solid frame.
So im makeing a Wild cat cartridge cause running the 41 LC cases into a 38 LC die about 3/8s will neck size the Cases so 38 Ammo loads and seats good.
This will be simlar to a 38 44 only its a 38 41 thats not on any lists anywhere LOL
Them Colt DA frames are very strong.
Im gona end up with a tack driver out to 45 Yds i figger er Hope
It will be one cool Antique. Them 1892 DA colts are so nice and Light but still strong.
There were a smokeless designed frame.
I can just put the orignal Cylinder and Barrel back in if its a Cluster Fuk.
Anyway its intresting the differnt things you can do knowing certin guns didnt shoot that great back then and why.
Dingus, I thought of doing the same thing with a thunderer i had. My only problem with that is the fact that the 38 cal barrels are quite a bit smaller than the .386. More like .356. The inside lubed 41 colt slug would have been awfully tight going through that bore.
But maybe you have a line on a .380 barrel or something. I couldnt find one.
I suspect what Dingus is describing is using a .357 barrel in his Colt navy. In your case the question is; do you have a thick enough cylinder to open it out by .032 inches and reduce the wall thickness by .016". That is allowing a clearance of .001" either side of the shell. Then like Dingus you form a necked down .41 colt shell that accepts a .357 slug.
It is not terribly different from making 9.3 mm Dutch shells out of shortened .41 mag shells.
cheers mooncoon
It is not terribly different from making 9.3 mm Dutch shells out of shortened .41 mag shells.
cheers mooncoon
Yes Dougs 100% right the Thunders a very thin walled Cylinder BUT *IF* the 38 cal one is the Same Dia as the 41 Cal one you should be able to do it and leave the chamber Throats by not Reaming all the way thru.
Yes im useing a 357 Mag Barrel (Mooncoons got that right to! LOL)
My only Problem is the 38 LC cylinder has NO chamber throats either tho there will be Chamber Throats once its reamed to 41 cal
but there .380
But its gona be alot better than the Bored thru 41 Cal Cylinder shooting .386 bullets down going down a .408 bore
I will use the 38 cal bullets in necked down 41 cases as my Gun Locks up like a new gun rock solid!
Lucky i came to my Sences and Pulled it off the EE I almost sold the best 1892 ive ever had for being tight!
Also the Barrel 357 im useing has that Shroud to Hold the Ejector rod end tight shut.
Getting this to all work will be fun and im gona post picks.
Yes im useing a 357 Mag Barrel (Mooncoons got that right to! LOL)
My only Problem is the 38 LC cylinder has NO chamber throats either tho there will be Chamber Throats once its reamed to 41 cal
but there .380
But its gona be alot better than the Bored thru 41 Cal Cylinder shooting .386 bullets down going down a .408 bore
I will use the 38 cal bullets in necked down 41 cases as my Gun Locks up like a new gun rock solid!
Lucky i came to my Sences and Pulled it off the EE I almost sold the best 1892 ive ever had for being tight!
Also the Barrel 357 im useing has that Shroud to Hold the Ejector rod end tight shut.
Getting this to all work will be fun and im gona post picks.
This works!
Well, said and done. The dies and mold are here and I cast the first batch of about 80 bullets. Now all I need is load development.
The first 10 were loaded traditional way and that proved unworkable, as they were sliding out of the cases when I ran them thru the sizing die. Air pressure inside was pushing the bullets out so that I had to press them back in with my fingers afterwards. Still all of them hit the paper at 10 yards which encouraged me for further experiments. A small amount of unburnt Unique powder indicated that the crimp was absolutely required.
The rest of the bullets were loaded upside down with about 0.1" sticking outside and crimped. They slightly keyholed at 15 yards using 3.2 grains of Unique so I am going to go up to 3.4 but no further. Still they printed about 4-5" groups. Not bad for a 2.5" barrel?
Just as I was setting up the Chrony the battery decided to give in so no velocities yet. But no leading too!
Here's a sample of the loaded ammo, it sits flush with the cylinder:
The bullets inside the cases are these Lee #90330 41mag:
The case is stock 44 rem mag. To fit in the chamber freely the loaded case has to go thru the sizing die with the decapper removed. They fall right in and right out after being fired.
UPDATE: This load is a complete success. No keyholing whatsoever and negligible recoil. The bullets print nice circles on paper at 10 yards, however due to low velocity they tear up holes instead of puncturing. Maybe I need to load a bit hotter.
Well, said and done. The dies and mold are here and I cast the first batch of about 80 bullets. Now all I need is load development.
The first 10 were loaded traditional way and that proved unworkable, as they were sliding out of the cases when I ran them thru the sizing die. Air pressure inside was pushing the bullets out so that I had to press them back in with my fingers afterwards. Still all of them hit the paper at 10 yards which encouraged me for further experiments. A small amount of unburnt Unique powder indicated that the crimp was absolutely required.
The rest of the bullets were loaded upside down with about 0.1" sticking outside and crimped. They slightly keyholed at 15 yards using 3.2 grains of Unique so I am going to go up to 3.4 but no further. Still they printed about 4-5" groups. Not bad for a 2.5" barrel?
Just as I was setting up the Chrony the battery decided to give in so no velocities yet. But no leading too!
Here's a sample of the loaded ammo, it sits flush with the cylinder:
The bullets inside the cases are these Lee #90330 41mag:
The case is stock 44 rem mag. To fit in the chamber freely the loaded case has to go thru the sizing die with the decapper removed. They fall right in and right out after being fired.
UPDATE: This load is a complete success. No keyholing whatsoever and negligible recoil. The bullets print nice circles on paper at 10 yards, however due to low velocity they tear up holes instead of puncturing. Maybe I need to load a bit hotter.
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