Is It Too Hard To Mount PU Scope On Mosin?

ridgearms

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Since the search function is not working properly I figured I should post this to find info.

Is it very difficult to mount a late model PU Scope Mount on a Mosin?
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Or should I use one that replaces the sight leaf?

Which Mosin would best suit this, M44 or 91/30?
 
Yah - the search function doesn't make any sense any more.

First off - I would say mount the PU scope on the gun it was designed for; the 91/30. Not only is it historically correct, but you can get good use out of the scope on a full length barrel, rather than a carbine.

These sites should answer just about all of your questions, start to finish.

I'd say if you're competant in metal working, go for it. However, there are a lot of places you can go wrong, and if you do, you're screwed. Since you're in vancouver, might be worth sourcing what it would cost to have Shane at reliable mount it up.

I did myself, but it took some work and I was sweating bullets. I did all my major work with hand tools, a dremel, a drill press, and a hand tap set.

http://7.62x54r.net/

http://mosinnagant.net/sniper section/snipertext1.asp

http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting2005/mosinsniper/index.asp

http://www.mosinnagant.net/sniper section/mosin-nagant-sighting.asp

http://www.russian-mosin-nagant.com/9130sniper.htm

http://www.hk94.com/hk/index.php?showtopic=15780
 
I mounted a PU scope on a Polish M-44 carbine, it was not hard to do. This along with some load experimentation transformed my M-44 into a minute of angle rifle. I'm very pleased with it.

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i had a gunsmith set up my pu sniper, and also he set up a top mount pe sniper a year later.
to be done right the pu mount should be done on a NAGANT WITH A HIGH ALL RECIEVER.

the pe mount can be found for either a hex or round reciever so your call.
also you would need a proper made or make up a bent bolt with a longer handle and knob.
thats my experiance .
good luck
 
I mounted a PU scope on a Polish M-44 carbine, it was not hard to do. This along with some load experimentation transformed my M-44 into a minute of angle rifle. I'm very pleased with it.

Good job on your mount, it looks professional. I know you said it's not hard but can you give me a step by step break down of what you did?

I can't afford a gunsmith, but I will resort to one, if I can't get it done.

From feedback and thinking about it, I will go with a 91/30, with that optic and mount. Is it true that the holes that need to be used for the mount have been welded shut? I heard people have broken drill bits trying to undo the welds. Any advice on the process?

I hear you guys about the bolt handle as well. I will try to do that myself, if you have advice please share.
 
Is it true that the holes that need to be used for the mount have been welded shut? I heard people have broken drill bits trying to undo the welds. Any advice on the process?

That depends on the rifle. What people are talking about with the holes being filled and welded are ex-snipers i.e. m91/30s that used to have scopes on them but were de-commissioned for one reason or another. A lot of people are restoring them because its an alternative way to get your hands on a real sniper.

The majority of m91/30s never had a scope mounted so don't have the filled in old mount holes. These are easier to mount a scope on as you'll be drilling into a clean receiver.

Since you're not looking at restoring an ex-sniper, using a normal m91/30 would be a better option for you.
 
Military style or not - it's still a bubba job.

Zefarm has some already done:

h ttp://www.zefarm.net/productView.php?id=2288&cat_id=2
 
Good job on your mount, it looks professional. I know you said it's not hard but can you give me a step by step break down of what you did?

I can't afford a gunsmith, but I will resort to one, if I can't get it done.

From feedback and thinking about it, I will go with a 91/30, with that optic and mount. Is it true that the holes that need to be used for the mount have been welded shut? I heard people have broken drill bits trying to undo the welds. Any advice on the process?

I hear you guys about the bolt handle as well. I will try to do that myself, if you have advice please share.

What I did is different than how I would do it now. Having done it I can now say that it would be much simpler to drill from the inside of the action rather than from the outside. The holes in the action would be centered in the curved recess for the bolt, this dished curve would make it easy to get the holes in exactly the right spot as it would naturally center the drill. I did mine from the outside and it took a fair bit of checking to make sure everything would be ok before I started. The receiver is extreemly hard, make sure you use a cobalt drill bit or you will likely have problems.


As for the bolt, the way I did this was different than usual. Mine is screwed together. I cut the straight handle off, then cut the ball off the end of that. I then drilled and taped the bolt and the ball. I then bent a piece of round steel from a regular bolt to get the shape I wanted, put a thread on either end and screwed it all together and made it permanent with loctite. I did it this way as I did not have access to a welder at the time, and I would do it the same way again as it makes a nicer job than welding.
 
I am going to get a 91/30 and try your bolt configuration wallflower and drilling/tapping advice. Thanks for the help. I think I will buy from weimajack, a sponsor. Anyone bought a 91/30 from him?
 
I don't disagree with wallflower, as his advice has merits, but may as well add some other opinion to the pile.

First off, if you aren't 100% sure that you're 90 degrees to the center of the vertical axis of the reciever then having the drill bit naturally center won't help one bit. Also, it can still wander the length of the reciever and mar that surface up.

I don't mean to say this a better way, but hopefully you'll find some info that you can use.

What I did was:

1) Took barrelled and stripped reciever and fit into vice, clamped flat length and width wise, with two blocks of hard wood cut to fit the barrel.

2) Take both mount and scope assembly, and hold to side of reciever, got an idea as to where was right. Specifically was checking that the vertical arm of the scope assembly was 90 degrees to horizontal on the rifle (and also 90degrees to horizontal on the ground, but if the reciever shifts at all you'll have to either take that into account or reset it).

3) Eyeball and confirm the scope is sitting directly above the center of the reciever, and move if necessary.

4)mark the outline closely with a white paint, or in my case, white out (it's very easy to see, and comes off easily once you're done).

5) remove everything, coat the scope base in 24 hour epoxy, and clamp it back in place using the paint as a guide, and quick clips and clamps to hold it in place. I premade some fitted wood blocks for the other side of the reciever so the clamps wouldn't slip on the rounded edges and angles of the reciever.

6) recheck everything. Make sure the base plate is directly against the reciever and the glue isn't creating a gap anywhere.

7) leave for 24 hrs to dry in an above zero place. Warmer helps:p

8) Find out it slipped during the night because a quick clip was pulling it out of alignment, swear, repeat #5-7.

9) Keep as many clamps on it as possible while exposing the drill holes. I made a center punch that fitted both the pin and the screw holes, so that it would self center. Could have just as easily eyeballed it. I just wanted to give another try at tempering tool steel.

10) Drill a pilot hole for each of the holes. Keep in mind the thinner the bit, the more PITA it is if it snaps in place... because you can't drill it out. Keep it well oiled, use good drill bits, take it slow.

11) Redrill holes to diameter, taking into account the pin holes will need to be the exact diameter of outer hole, if not erring on sliiiightly bigger, and the screw holes need to be the correct size for the tap set that matches the screws. The pins may or may not be a good idea. I did mine, but I've seen lots without them. I also drilled mine all the way through, but many people suggest a blind hole.

12) If everything looks good, unclamp the base plate and gently pry the scope base off. You may be surprised how strongly it's on there, but some very gentle prying can probably remove it and not scratch the reciever. Use a hard piece of plastic to get all the epoxy and white out off.

13) Tap the two screw holes. Make sure the tape is 100% 90 degrees to the holes. A wandering tap pretty much starts from the first turn and will piss you off to no end. The gun I stripped my scope assembly off was drilled and tapped horribly... about 10-15 degrees difference... which when a screw is in, shows a lot!

14) Keep cutting and lubricating as you go. I have almost no experience with this, so my info isn't very good. Basically what I've figured out is that A) lube is good, B) chips are bad, C) the tap breaking off in the hole is horrible d) stopping turning while tapping creates a slight bur there??:confused: d) occasional backing out, cleaning, and relubing is adviseable.
You'll want to do your own research here. This worked for me, but I don't know what I'm doing...

15) Pins. Cut pins ever so slightly short... In this case we're talking about a pin that runs from the face of the scope base to almost the face of the inside of the reciever (remember, I drilled all the way through, and used pins.... someone else more knowledgeable will chime in on if they were used and what the best way is). You make the pins slightly shorter so they A) don't impede bolt travel and B) don't impede the scope assembly from mating tightly against the scope base. As you hammer them in place they may flare, so take that into account if they aren't cooperating, as that creats a PITA if they stick and are still very exposed.

As well, I only did the rear pin on mine, as the length of the scope base and location of the pin holes meant I was dicing with the possibility of either trying to drill a blind hole into the thin wall area where the lugs lock, and have a weakly anchored pin, or drilling all the way through and possibly messing up the locking action and weakening the reciever. I decided if the guns can function without them, it didn't need the front one.

I measured my pin out and made it about 2mm shorter than necessary. It was slightly overly large for the hole, so I also sanded it very lightly and lightly filed / rounded the ends to avoid flaring, and ensure a good fit. In my case, it tapped in nicely, and fitted very snugly. I left it silver, but will probably blue it at some point.

16) screw in scope base screws. Mine just about passed the inner reciever wall, so I didn't have to do anything. If yours are too long, it would look cool to have the ends have the same concave profile as the inside of the reciever wall.

17) Locking screws. Since my scope assembly was previously used the anchoring screws had already been inletted to allow for locking screws to hold them in place. One of mine worked, but the other needed a new cut made. I screwed it in place, then used a file corner to scratch the remainder of the locking screws circle profile into the anchoring screws head.

Removed it, used a dremel with a metal cutting head to remove metal as necessary. I would put it back in place and check it frequently.

It also isn't necessary to cut the entire profile of the screw head out in a dish, as the locking screw head isn't as deep as the anchor screw head is. Just be aware that if the locking screw is as all exposed on the surface of the base plate, it may interefere with how tightly the scope assembly mates to the scope base.

Annnnnnnnnnndddddd that's about it.... preliminary sighting in was very promising, however I ran out of ammo:redface::(

I may also try that No-bubba gunsmithing accurising solution I posted a link to on pg one as well.

Hope that helps!
 
I have two Polish M-44's, the one with the scope gets used a lot, I have shot many coyotes with it. The other one which is in standard configuration sits in the dark gathering dust.

My favourite recipe consists of Hornady 124 grn bullets or pulled czech 7.62 x 39 bullets on top of 56 grns of BL-C 2. I guarantee that this load will improve the accuracy of any half decent mosin, and especially the carbines with floating barrels. It's what my wife calls fireball ammo, you will see why if you try it.

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That's a BIG post H Wally !

Take a look inside your receiver, the screws should be dead center in the dished out portion. If I were to drill through the wall at this position the mount would be dead center over and in line with the bore. I know everyone does it from the other side, but this does nothing more than make an uncomplicated job complicated.
 
That's a BIG post H Wally !

Take a look inside your receiver, the screws should be dead center in the dished out portion. If I were to drill through the wall at this position the mount would be dead center over and in line with the bore. I know everyone does it from the other side, but this does nothing more than make an uncomplicated job complicated.

I've got nothing but time right now:p

What my issue was, was that I'd be unsure about how to line up directly centered in the dishing on the reciever. As it isn't a super sharp dish, it's possible a slightly off angle could be missed while drilling. Also, I guess you would have to index the second screw hole off of the first one to make sure you didn't accidentally drill it off by a few mm's?
 
It's not difficult to drill in the right place, it's easier to drill in the right spot from the inside than the out that's for sure, in any case it can easily be seen if it's out or not. A couple of mm's is not going to make any noticeable difference. As long as the mount is screwed tightly to the receiver it will be in line with the bore. The mount has lot's of adjustment that will more than take care of things if it is a few mm's out the other way.
 
I am going to get a 91/30 and try your bolt configuration wallflower and drilling/tapping advice. Thanks for the help. I think I will buy from weimajack, a sponsor. Anyone bought a 91/30 from him?

You are very welcome :) One little extra detail that might help you with the bolt. When I threaded the bolt handle I reduced the diameter a bit and used a smaller diameter die. This gives a shoulder which can be tightened up against the bolt body. If the bolt is in the wrong position when it is good and tight just unscrew it and take a tiny bit off the shoulder so that it is in exactly the right position when it's nice and tight. You will find that it will squeak as you tighten it if you know what I mean.
 
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