Africa/Alaska Dangerous Game Cartridge - Make Your Case!

Pick your favorite "Dangerous Game" Chambering!

  • 375 H&H

    Votes: 99 43.4%

  • .416 Rigby

    Votes: 50 21.9%

  • .458 Win Mag

    Votes: 39 17.1%

  • .458 Lott

    Votes: 16 7.0%

  • .404 Jeffery

    Votes: 6 2.6%

  • .450 Rigby

    Votes: 2 0.9%

  • .500 Jeffery

    Votes: 4 1.8%

  • .505 Gibbs

    Votes: 12 5.3%
  • Total voters
    228
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I've always wanted a genuine "dangerous game" rifle ever since reading the works of Robert Ruark, Gene Hill, Ernest Hemingway, et al...

Since a double rifle is basically out of reach financially unless I win the 6/49 lottery or sell off a crap load of guns, a bolt rifle is probably going to be my first choice. I have a friend who owns a Ruger #1 in .458 Win Mag, and while a beautiful rifle, I'm not a fan of single rifles.

Looking right now at the CZ 550, probably as an Xmas present or having a custom rifle built on a 700 action. In either case, I love the look and stability of laminate stocks over synthetic/traditional walnut stocks.

I haven't really wedded myself to any particular caliber as yet. I'll probably use the rifle on big moose, bears moreso than African game for the immediate future, but an African Safari is on the want to do list.

Here are your choices: 375 H&H, .416 Rigby, .458 Win Mag, .458 Lott, .404 Jeffery, .450 Rigby, .500 Jeffery and the .505 Gibbs.

I'm sticking with these traditional calibers. Not interested in any obscure, obsolete, wildcat chambering, so please keep the discussion on these!:)
 
Today, when a client ventures to Africa, the weight restrictions on aircraft and the cost per firearm to enter the country, will probably cause him to take but a single rifle. The most versatile rifle that is legal for dangerous game is a .375 of some flavor. Versatility matters because while on safari you will have the opportunity to shoot game as small as a dik-dik or as large as an elephant, and in some areas plains game is taken out to 300 yards, though 150 is more common. Few rifles are effective on very big game, accurate enough for small game, and flat shooting enough to have a 300 yard reach. To complicate matters further the rifle must be able to do all with a single load or with a soft point load and a solid load that will hit the same point of aim. The .375's will do it. A 9.3X62 will a do it with a bit less power, and a .416 will also do it with a bit more. The .375 is a nice compromise.

In Africa the PH is responsible for his client's safety, so the client should not need to carry a stopping rifle, if his PH is any good. Not all are. A .375 is capable of conclusively stopping a lion charge, and it is the PH's job to stop a charge from the other stuff. Lions have a habit of allowing one to get close then they explode from cover at close range. Stalking a wounded lion in the long grass would stimulate the most nerve deadened hunter, although a wounded buffalo in heavy cover is right up there. Buffalo and elephant seldom charge without warning, and are seldom difficult to see, allowing the PH armed with his heavy stopping rifle to position himself to confront them.

Hippo can charge from close range, and the stopping shot is only the size of your hand, but made properly a light rifle seems to do as well as a heavy, but done poorly the heavy does little better.

Following up a leopard is the job of the PH and his tracker. They won't let the client attend, nor should he want to. More often than not this is best solved with a shotgun, but not for the reasons one might think. The PH doesn't want to blow a football sized hole in his client's trophy, so the 12 bore loaded with shot is preferred, and even then a head shot will be a gory mess.

Now that I've talked about dangerous game charges, perhaps I should define what a charge is. An animal running towards you 50 yards out is not a charge. A charge is when the animal breaks the 30' mark. Up until then, anything can happen. He can turn off, or simply stop and wander away, but once he breaks the 30' mark he is committed and unless stopped you will die. That's a charge!

Big bore stopping rifles are heavy and difficult to master. Recoil will cause the barrels to raise to 60 degrees, so given the time it takes to reacquire the target, they are no faster for a follow up than a bolt gun, provided the bolt gun is cycled properly. Doubles are depressingly expensive, even for a well healed hunter, and the cost of the ammunition or components will leave you short of breath. But for the man who needs a heavy they work. Bullet placement is key regardless of the game or the location, but given equal bullet placement, a game animal's response to a hit from a .500, .577, or a .600 is pretty impressive; it's just not needed by a client.
 
All of the above and 470NE added to it. Realistically most people can't handle the 505 Gibb, 458 Lott or the 500 Jefferry. The 404 or any of the 375's will do the job. I personally have a 458 Lott, 505 Gibbs, 416 Rigby, 375 H&H, 404 Jeffery, 375 RUM. 375 Ruger 458 WM and a 470NE.
 
Well I would go 375, got 30-06 ballistics on bullet path, can scope it without scope eye , only need moderate eye relief.
excellent choices in reloading components. Use it on blacktail, and bears.
The other choices are great , but Alaska does not have hard shell critters.
But if a trip to Africa is in order down the road, may want the rigby.:D I would stay with the 375 h&h
 
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.600 Nitro Express as one African Guide opined when asked, "why such a large double rifle for lions"? he replied, "because they don't make a .700" ;-)

I have seen it mentioned somewhere, that a .700 has been considered; i'm sure with todays love of gadgets and gizmo's someone will be looking at creating a revolver for it too.
 
I personally would pick a .375 H&H. My reasons are multiple:

1) Ammo and components are available everywhere and is inexpensive compared to most dangerous game rounds.
2) It's about the most I can tolerate while still remaining consistently accurate, I'd be afraid of developing a flinch with anything heavier without significant practice (see #1).
3) It's legal for dangerous game anywhere in the world.
4) IMO there is a difference between "dangerous game" rifles and "stopping" rifles, one is for the client to hunt with and the other is for the PH in case the client FUBARs his shot(s).
5) Remington Core-Lokt 270-grain is cheap enough and will work on moose/elk/bear in a pinch out to fairly reasonable ranges - practice makes perfect if you're planning for an Africa hunt.
6) As above, in Africa it can be used very effectively on everything you come across even out at 300 yards provided you can pull off the shot, and with enough practice on regular big game animals and range time, you can!
7) It's got a rich history and looks dead ###y compared to the straight-walled behemoths, and that does count just a little bit for me.

I'd recommend heavily that you consider the Mauser-based CZ over a Remington-based custom rifle though, for tradition as well as practicality purposes. CRF just makes sense on rifles intended for dangerous game. Not says the 700 won't be accurate and reliable, but when the chips are down and the mercury is sky-high, I just wouldn't bet my life on a spring-loaded plunger.
 
mikeyb said:
I personally would pick a .375 H&H. My reasons are multiple:

1) Ammo and components are available everywhere and is inexpensive compared to most dangerous game rounds.
2) It's about the most I can tolerate while still remaining consistently accurate, I'd be afraid of developing a flinch with anything heavier without significant practice (see #1).
3) It's legal for dangerous game anywhere in the world.
4) IMO there is a difference between "dangerous game" rifles and "stopping" rifles, one is for the client to hunt with and the other is for the PH in case the client FUBARs his shot(s).
5) Remington Core-Lokt 270-grain is cheap enough and will work on moose/elk/bear in a pinch out to fairly reasonable ranges - practice makes perfect if you're planning for an Africa hunt.
6) As above, in Africa it can be used very effectively on everything you come across even out at 300 yards provided you can pull off the shot, and with enough practice on regular big game animals and range time, you can!
7) It's got a rich history and looks dead ###y compared to the straight-walled behemoths, and that does count just a little bit for me.

I'd recommend heavily that you consider the Mauser-based CZ over a Remington-based custom rifle though, for tradition as well as practicality purposes. CRF just makes sense on rifles intended for dangerous game. Not says the 700 won't be accurate and reliable, but when the chips are down and the mercury is sky-high, I just wouldn't bet my life on a spring-loaded plunger.
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Thats what I got , the 550, sweet action, rugged, and accurate. Liked it so much , its got the highest claro walnut available, and a 2x7 Kahles.
 
Boomer, Your case is well stated and informative. It would seem you have some experience in this matter.
I almost got a hunting apprenticeship in Rhodesia/Zim. I was offered the position by the safari company and would be a ph today had the zim governmant allowed me the resident permit. Too British and too white.
 
I'd think that either the 375H&H, 458Win or 416Rem would be the most practical.

If cool has anything to do with it, anything from the rest of the list would do.

What do most PHs use?


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How about 450/400 NE?
My vote, aside of that, would probably go with 416 Rigby.
If you're taking a flexible round however then I'd go with 375H&H.
I personally pack a 9.3x62 hunting here in Oz and admittedly it is overkill on most game here.
That would probably be enough for most situations, especially in North America, although I'd prefer the extra oomph against Cape Buffalo and elephant.
 
Well, as too sticking to your rules and only picking one of the following cartridges you mentioned I guess I'll go with the 416Rigby, with the right bullet you could do in any animal you want.

That said, if I was going today to Alaska or Africa I'd want to try our my 1895G Marlin, with either my 350gr, 420gr or 550gr hanloads. Now that would be fun.

Cheers

Seabass
 
SuperCub said:
I'd think that either the 375H&H, 458Win or 416Rem would be the most practical.

If cool has anything to do with it, anything from the rest of the list would do.

What do most PHs use?


.
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Over half of the professional hunters I've met carried a .375. The .458 Lott came in second and the .416 Rigby came close. CZs and Brnos were the most common, with a bunch of Mausers and Mauser clones, old model 70s and the odd Ruger.
Terms that don't seem to get said without a sneer are .458 Winchester, any .416 without Rigby attached to it and anything Weatherby. That may have as much to do with the very limited powders they have to work with as anything else.
 
From a practicality standpoint, the .375 is the best choice. It's more than adequate for anything in North America and the PH would be providing backup for African hunting, so a larger rifle is not absolutely necessary.

The .375 also has the advantages of lower component cost and recoil compared to the larger calibres. These two advantages will encourage you to shoot the rifle more and build proficiency. This counts for much more than choice of rifle.

I would choose the CZ 550 over the Remington 700, as I think controlled feed is a better choice for dangerous game.
 
Dogleg said:
Terms that don't seem to get said without a sneer are .458 Winchester, any .416 without Rigby attached to it and anything Weatherby. That may have as much to do with the very limited powders they have to work with as anything else.
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I could see the Weatherbys getting the snub, mostly from the rifles they come in, but am surprised at the sneer at the 458 and 416Rem. I wouldn't think they would be more difficult to load or needing special powders than any other case.


.
 
Boomer said:
Now that I've talked about dangerous game charges, perhaps I should define what a charge is. An animal running towards you 50 yards out is not a charge. A charge is when the animal breaks the 30' mark. Up until then, anything can happen. He can turn off, or simply stop and wander away, but once he breaks the 30' mark he is committed and unless stopped you will die. That's a charge!
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Very good description Boomer. Anyone in grizzly country should repeat this as a mantra 50 times a day until it sinks in. 10 steps or closer = fire! Farther then that and you are just going to make the situation worse.

I voted 375 for two reasons:

1. A rifle without ammo is useless - good luck finding 505 Gibbs in Bella Coola!

2. Recoil is manageable for most shooters if the SHTF - anything 416 or more powerful is almost impossible for most shooters to master.

Cheers.
 
The 458 Win surprises me.
I'm betting Weatherybys get the sneer as much for those who use them as the rifles they are chambered in and the non-Rigby 416s just aren't the traditional round.
Plus the 416 Rem out performs the Rigby by using higher chamber pressures.
In an African climate that can be a real issue.
The Rigby isn't loaded above 45,000cup.
It's not that it isn't strong enough, either the rifle or the case, it's just that 100+ degree F day time temps are not a climate you want to drag high pressure cartridges into, especially using Cordite like they used to.
These days modern powders are much safer but it's still just common sense really.
 
A .375 H&H has all the criteria - its nostalgic, classic, absolutely effective, a great allrounder that can be used at home too, easier to handle and more affordable to shoot and practice with.

Of course a .404, .416. or .505 are loaded with nostalgia too and are absolutely effective (!) classics. The .458win/lott are also not that expensive to shoot.....

If you want to hunt a few head of dangerous game in Africa (or alaska) on guided hunts, a .375 with a QD scope is a primo choice. If you are planning on taking many elephant in the future, then perhaps step up to a .416/.458, otherwise a .375 will be a useful and absolutely classic choice, as it has been since 1912.

Despite what we read about buffalo taking a million shots with a .577 before they die, probably half of them taken each year are killed with a .375 without fanfare. There is a major difference between the sport hunter who plans to hunt a few DG animals in his life and a DG PH or trails guide who shoots when the chips are down and needs as much horsepower as he can put into an animals vitals.
 
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