It all started with a Police Ordnance LEO sales only Glock 22. I purchased it thinking that would be it, I would use it for practice, take it to the range privately with some buddies and I'd never buy another firearm. A year later I own seven semi-auto pistols and have one transferring on the way. Early on in my trips to the range trying other pistols and dry-firing lots of other pistols in shops I decided I liked the small fit, quick draw possibilities and ease of pointing a compact firearm.
My experience with owning a compact firearm started with a Glock 23.
The model 23 seemed like a logical step. I enjoyed the model 22 (big brother to the 23 - service model/longer slide and larger grip) and thought without a doubt this would be the model for me especially after all the ranting and raving I saw about the model 19.
As it turned out, shooting .40S&W through a compact design was uncomfortable for me and my accuracy dropped substantially. At ten meters, slow fire I was getting 1.5" groups with my model 22. The same distance, the same stance and the same rate of fire my groupings were around 3" with the model 23. I gave myself some time to adjust and in the meantime borrowed a conversion barrel to run 9mm through the Model 23.
I enjoyed the 9mm round through the 23 much more (effectively a G19) and quickly started searching for my own conversion barrel. In the meantime I borrowed a Sig 229 in 9mm and spent a substantial amount of time falling in love with it. I put a thousand rounds through it and felt guilty when my friend returned from holiday where I previously had mentioned "Ah, I might put a couple mags down the pipe."
Which, brought me to:
The Norinco copy of the Sig 228 with a Sig 228 slide installed. At the time I couldn't afford a Sig 229 as they were going for ridiculous prices at the time. I purchased the Norinco copy because the price was irresistable and Marstar had them in stock. Their lack of stock in other Norincos heightened my sense of "Crap, I better order one now before they run out of these buggers too!"
When it came in the mail, I wasn't too disappointed. Frankly, for the little amount of money I paid, just over $400 taxes in what was I expecting? The frame was not rough as you saw on many other Norincos but the trigger was not great and the slide was quite rough. The barrel was pristine and I couldn't believe it's quality alone. I fired 300 rounds without a single issue down the pipe with the Norinco slide using Norinco mags and it functioned flawlessly. After every mag I turned the pistol and looked at it with surprise. As soon as I introduced Mec-Gar mags they failed to feed properly and would jam up in all sorts of nasty ways. This was not remedied when I replaced the slide with a genuine Sig 228 slide. I returned the Mec-Gar mags and received some that worked properly. I was not impressed at the poor quality of magazine I received from Mec-Gar but chalked it up to them being duds or part of a "bad run". Other modifications to the 228 copy included getting Hogue rubber grips. The plastic grips from Norinco that came stock were ridiculous, not comfortable on the hand, slipped easily and looked like crap. Rubber Hogues fixed that instantly.
Although I really enjoyed the Sig 228 copy it had to go, I had some big ticket expenses coming up and needed to free up the cash. I sold it to a good home and was confident that sooner than later I would return to Sig but get the real thing.
At this point it was a while before I started buying again. I purchased a Walther P22 which I loved and a gently used Sig Mosquito which I hated. The Sig Mosquito sights just weren't right, I couldn't get a consistent tight grouping no matter how much I adjusted my grip/technique even if I pulled the target up real close (5 metres). I began to get really frustrated by the Mosquito and all of its feeding/failure to fire problems combined with the sighting issues and sold it for next to nothing/traded it in on a HK p2000.
I tried the USP and did not like the plastic bending trigger, the HK p2000 as I was told was "where it's at". I did a lot of research and dropped just over a thousand bucks as that was the difference with the trade in and upon receiving it from Epps, I was not impressed. All the hype just seemed like bulls**t to me. The trigger pull was long, the pistol was easy to control but not better than the Glock 23 with the 9mm conversion. I was having a few magazine problems with mag springs that seemed to be over stretched and the accuracy over the Glock was negligble. For the money I paid I expect a better pistol than the Glock, not the same pistol with a contoured slide and different grip for substantially more money.
I took it to a few different shooting matches and had similar reactions from friends and other shooters. My life basically changed later that day when I fired a commander length Kimber Pro in .45 I actually saw a young girl shooting it at a match and was amazed at her control. I put a mag down range and instantly fell in love with the .45 ACP round. I purchased a Glock 21 forgetting about my quest for a compact firearm and for a while enjoyed the smooth pleasure of .45 ACP.
At the same time I purchased a 1911 format pistol now being turned onto the 1911 bug.
The Para Ordnance LTC 1911 9mm. I piad just over a grand with taxes in. Very accurate: 1" groups rapid fire at 10 metres. Easy to control and excellent top notch mags. The pistol felt sturdy and with the addition of rubber grooves installed under the wood grips (as pictured) the pistol was more ergonomical than I could have dreamed. I've fired a lot of 1911s and for the money I paid, I expected the trigger to be better. It was light but had a rough break-up. I decided to suck it up and that this trigger would not get a trigger job but instead I would wear it in with dry-firing and lots of ammo. Only other issue, the fit was rough. Randomly after a round would be fired it would eject and the next round would not chamber and seat correctly. Despite the efforts of a armourer/hobbyist gunsmith who'm I was shooting with that day and a whole lot of lube the problem was not remedied. After having the eye of an expert gunsmith it was decided to fire it a little more to see if I could wear in the "rough" rails as this was a common problem with the newer LTC. As I started to wear in the pistol I found the finish was really not excellent and thus begins my (hopefully not lengthy) transaction with Para Ordnance warranty department.
This also began my second run in with Mec-Gar mag issues. I purchased 9 round single stack 9mm 1911 mags from MecGar and one out of four was warped and wouldn't load properly. I'm now very hesitant to buy MecGar mags unless they're new and I know the retailer doesn't have too much trouble accepting exchanges or returns. (Marstar has been fine for this).
I knew my search wasn't over with the LTC as it was a .45 compact 1911 that really wet my appetite. While searching for a resitrcted commander length .45 I had sold and traded more pistols. I shot the Sig 239 quite extensively in the U.S. and although I liked it, I felt paying over $1000 for one here in Canada was ridiculous. A trade came my way that I was hesitant to accept but the trader was a good friend and I thought the pistol might be fun as it was a ergonomical little compact 9mm.
When I opened up the pistol case, there it was. My friends rusty, freckled up purple HKP7PSP. I was not a fan of it when he bought it new for $1200 and I dry fired it at the shop, shaking my head that it was "not for me". I took it to the range and fed it cheap CCI Blazer Brass 115 grain ammo and had the target up real close, about 5 metres and was shooting rapid fire. I did two mags and brought the target back and didn't realize how beautifully tight my groupings were until I pulled the target off the mover. I reloaded my two mags and sent the target back to the 10 meter line and fired a tight little grouping again in rapid fire. My faith in HK had returned after my disappointing shoot the p2000.
The HKP7PSP is compact, and thin. So much so that it is approaching sub-compact but has a substantial amount of weight to it being all steel. The trigger is the lightest and smoothest trigger I've fired on a semi-auto pistol, I liken it to a target revolver. No creep, no mush, no weight just a gentle tap and off it goes.
The HKP7 series has surprised me in the important categories like fit, finish, feel, ease of pointing, trigger, reliability but disappointed me in other categories where pistols like Glock excel in parts, accessories, after market goodies. Magazines are rare finds at a price less than $90, they sell for $90 new from an HK retailer direct from the distributor. The magazine capacity is low, 8 rounds. The pistol can not be fired for more than ten mags. I am quite tolerable to heat/burning with my joy of cooking and I find that after ten mags this pistol is too hot to grip comfortably and shoot accurately.
Accuracy is extraordinary. I feel the accuracy is only matched (in the same pistol class) by finely tuned 1911 pistols chambered in 9mm. There is no other stock duty firearm that competes with the HKP7. Accuracy difference between Glock 17/19, HK USP/p2000, S&W M&P and Beretta 92 are negligble. The HKP7 outperforms by a long-shot however, offers the reliability not present in a tuned 1911.
I've since given up my search for a restricted 1911 Commander chambered in .45ACP as financial times are now tight. However, when I finally get one I'll be sure to throw my review of it and it's trials/tribulations up. Until then, my HKP7 is my pick of compact pistols.
Thanks for reading my somewhat long-winded post. Questions and comments are welcome.
Tim.
My experience with owning a compact firearm started with a Glock 23.
The model 23 seemed like a logical step. I enjoyed the model 22 (big brother to the 23 - service model/longer slide and larger grip) and thought without a doubt this would be the model for me especially after all the ranting and raving I saw about the model 19.
As it turned out, shooting .40S&W through a compact design was uncomfortable for me and my accuracy dropped substantially. At ten meters, slow fire I was getting 1.5" groups with my model 22. The same distance, the same stance and the same rate of fire my groupings were around 3" with the model 23. I gave myself some time to adjust and in the meantime borrowed a conversion barrel to run 9mm through the Model 23.
I enjoyed the 9mm round through the 23 much more (effectively a G19) and quickly started searching for my own conversion barrel. In the meantime I borrowed a Sig 229 in 9mm and spent a substantial amount of time falling in love with it. I put a thousand rounds through it and felt guilty when my friend returned from holiday where I previously had mentioned "Ah, I might put a couple mags down the pipe."
Which, brought me to:
The Norinco copy of the Sig 228 with a Sig 228 slide installed. At the time I couldn't afford a Sig 229 as they were going for ridiculous prices at the time. I purchased the Norinco copy because the price was irresistable and Marstar had them in stock. Their lack of stock in other Norincos heightened my sense of "Crap, I better order one now before they run out of these buggers too!"
When it came in the mail, I wasn't too disappointed. Frankly, for the little amount of money I paid, just over $400 taxes in what was I expecting? The frame was not rough as you saw on many other Norincos but the trigger was not great and the slide was quite rough. The barrel was pristine and I couldn't believe it's quality alone. I fired 300 rounds without a single issue down the pipe with the Norinco slide using Norinco mags and it functioned flawlessly. After every mag I turned the pistol and looked at it with surprise. As soon as I introduced Mec-Gar mags they failed to feed properly and would jam up in all sorts of nasty ways. This was not remedied when I replaced the slide with a genuine Sig 228 slide. I returned the Mec-Gar mags and received some that worked properly. I was not impressed at the poor quality of magazine I received from Mec-Gar but chalked it up to them being duds or part of a "bad run". Other modifications to the 228 copy included getting Hogue rubber grips. The plastic grips from Norinco that came stock were ridiculous, not comfortable on the hand, slipped easily and looked like crap. Rubber Hogues fixed that instantly.
Although I really enjoyed the Sig 228 copy it had to go, I had some big ticket expenses coming up and needed to free up the cash. I sold it to a good home and was confident that sooner than later I would return to Sig but get the real thing.
At this point it was a while before I started buying again. I purchased a Walther P22 which I loved and a gently used Sig Mosquito which I hated. The Sig Mosquito sights just weren't right, I couldn't get a consistent tight grouping no matter how much I adjusted my grip/technique even if I pulled the target up real close (5 metres). I began to get really frustrated by the Mosquito and all of its feeding/failure to fire problems combined with the sighting issues and sold it for next to nothing/traded it in on a HK p2000.
I tried the USP and did not like the plastic bending trigger, the HK p2000 as I was told was "where it's at". I did a lot of research and dropped just over a thousand bucks as that was the difference with the trade in and upon receiving it from Epps, I was not impressed. All the hype just seemed like bulls**t to me. The trigger pull was long, the pistol was easy to control but not better than the Glock 23 with the 9mm conversion. I was having a few magazine problems with mag springs that seemed to be over stretched and the accuracy over the Glock was negligble. For the money I paid I expect a better pistol than the Glock, not the same pistol with a contoured slide and different grip for substantially more money.
I took it to a few different shooting matches and had similar reactions from friends and other shooters. My life basically changed later that day when I fired a commander length Kimber Pro in .45 I actually saw a young girl shooting it at a match and was amazed at her control. I put a mag down range and instantly fell in love with the .45 ACP round. I purchased a Glock 21 forgetting about my quest for a compact firearm and for a while enjoyed the smooth pleasure of .45 ACP.
At the same time I purchased a 1911 format pistol now being turned onto the 1911 bug.
The Para Ordnance LTC 1911 9mm. I piad just over a grand with taxes in. Very accurate: 1" groups rapid fire at 10 metres. Easy to control and excellent top notch mags. The pistol felt sturdy and with the addition of rubber grooves installed under the wood grips (as pictured) the pistol was more ergonomical than I could have dreamed. I've fired a lot of 1911s and for the money I paid, I expected the trigger to be better. It was light but had a rough break-up. I decided to suck it up and that this trigger would not get a trigger job but instead I would wear it in with dry-firing and lots of ammo. Only other issue, the fit was rough. Randomly after a round would be fired it would eject and the next round would not chamber and seat correctly. Despite the efforts of a armourer/hobbyist gunsmith who'm I was shooting with that day and a whole lot of lube the problem was not remedied. After having the eye of an expert gunsmith it was decided to fire it a little more to see if I could wear in the "rough" rails as this was a common problem with the newer LTC. As I started to wear in the pistol I found the finish was really not excellent and thus begins my (hopefully not lengthy) transaction with Para Ordnance warranty department.
This also began my second run in with Mec-Gar mag issues. I purchased 9 round single stack 9mm 1911 mags from MecGar and one out of four was warped and wouldn't load properly. I'm now very hesitant to buy MecGar mags unless they're new and I know the retailer doesn't have too much trouble accepting exchanges or returns. (Marstar has been fine for this).
I knew my search wasn't over with the LTC as it was a .45 compact 1911 that really wet my appetite. While searching for a resitrcted commander length .45 I had sold and traded more pistols. I shot the Sig 239 quite extensively in the U.S. and although I liked it, I felt paying over $1000 for one here in Canada was ridiculous. A trade came my way that I was hesitant to accept but the trader was a good friend and I thought the pistol might be fun as it was a ergonomical little compact 9mm.
When I opened up the pistol case, there it was. My friends rusty, freckled up purple HKP7PSP. I was not a fan of it when he bought it new for $1200 and I dry fired it at the shop, shaking my head that it was "not for me". I took it to the range and fed it cheap CCI Blazer Brass 115 grain ammo and had the target up real close, about 5 metres and was shooting rapid fire. I did two mags and brought the target back and didn't realize how beautifully tight my groupings were until I pulled the target off the mover. I reloaded my two mags and sent the target back to the 10 meter line and fired a tight little grouping again in rapid fire. My faith in HK had returned after my disappointing shoot the p2000.
The HKP7PSP is compact, and thin. So much so that it is approaching sub-compact but has a substantial amount of weight to it being all steel. The trigger is the lightest and smoothest trigger I've fired on a semi-auto pistol, I liken it to a target revolver. No creep, no mush, no weight just a gentle tap and off it goes.
The HKP7 series has surprised me in the important categories like fit, finish, feel, ease of pointing, trigger, reliability but disappointed me in other categories where pistols like Glock excel in parts, accessories, after market goodies. Magazines are rare finds at a price less than $90, they sell for $90 new from an HK retailer direct from the distributor. The magazine capacity is low, 8 rounds. The pistol can not be fired for more than ten mags. I am quite tolerable to heat/burning with my joy of cooking and I find that after ten mags this pistol is too hot to grip comfortably and shoot accurately.
Accuracy is extraordinary. I feel the accuracy is only matched (in the same pistol class) by finely tuned 1911 pistols chambered in 9mm. There is no other stock duty firearm that competes with the HKP7. Accuracy difference between Glock 17/19, HK USP/p2000, S&W M&P and Beretta 92 are negligble. The HKP7 outperforms by a long-shot however, offers the reliability not present in a tuned 1911.
I've since given up my search for a restricted 1911 Commander chambered in .45ACP as financial times are now tight. However, when I finally get one I'll be sure to throw my review of it and it's trials/tribulations up. Until then, my HKP7 is my pick of compact pistols.
Thanks for reading my somewhat long-winded post. Questions and comments are welcome.
Tim.
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