CZ Shadow Jamming

All of the stovepipes/FTFs I had in my Shadow were due to the ammo used. I haven't had one malfunction with the 115g, and lots with the 147g. I'm still using the original springs.

I'm no expert, but honestly I think it is the bullet shape that really makes the difference: the Am.Eagles I'm using are round in 115g ammo, but in 147g they are 'cone-shaped' (don't know the technical term for this, sorry). I think the cone-shaped bullet hits the feed ramp at a 'funny' angle & causes the FTF. I'm almost sure I'd have the same problem if I switch from FMJ to JHP, but I've never tried a JHP in this gun.
 
Funny, I've run a few hundred 147gr SWC, and 115gr RN through mine and never once had a problem of any kind. Nor was I told it would jam until broken in. Is mine defective? :D
 
I load my 154 gr bullets short and don't have a problem with feeding or seating. The truncated design should run through a Shadow lke a hot knife through butter. The 154 gr lead bullets I cast come from a Lyman mold that was supposed to drop 147 grainers. The heavier bullet is just a sweetheart to shoot. Less torque running at lower velocities to achieve PF for IDPA/IPSC makes for very little perceived recoil.

I would check your mag springs, too heavy is just as bad as to light and the feed lips on the mags thmselves.

Take Care

Bob
 
Singleaction, I've put at least 2000 rounds through between cleanings with bullseye powder (not very clean) and never got a failure to feed. Was the bullet nose sitting up against the feed ramp? Maybe that ammo is to long OAL. I know the winchester stuff is long (1.115'' OAL) whereas I always load much shorter (1.111). Long ammo could lead to a failure to feed.
 
Contondant said:
Singleaction, I've put at least 2000 rounds through between cleanings with bullseye powder (not very clean) and never got a failure to feed. Was the bullet nose sitting up against the feed ramp? Maybe that ammo is to long OAL. I know the winchester stuff is long (1.115'' OAL) whereas I always load much shorter (1.111). Long ammo could lead to a failure to feed.
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Well, I actually just assumed it was the dirty feed ramp because it didn't have a problem going into battery totally after the little scrub with the cardboard. The slide was about 5mm away from its full forward position. I assisted it forwarded with a push on the back of the slide then continued. Maybe it was entirely the ammo's fault. I didn't examine the particular rounds let alone take any measurements. In total there might have been 4 failures in the bunch until the ramp clean.

I was almost thinking of doing a little polish of the ramp with some stuff from crappy tire (can't remember the name of it - something jewlers paste or something). I'm not sure if that would ever help anything, but thought it couldn't every hurt.
 
I found mine to be a little on the tight side for much of my first year with it. DUe to this I found it required a strip down and cleaning about every 500 to 600 rounds and a touch up of the oil once in between or it would get tight and start stovepipeing.

And at one point I had stripped, cleaned and oiled it in prep for a match and had about 9 or more jams that day. It was a two day match so that evening I cleaned it again and this time used some Breakfree CLP instead of the air tool oil I'd used the first time. Yeah, I was lazy, the air tool oil was there and the CLP was in the garage. I didn't think it would make such a difference but it sure did. I'm not saying that CLP is the ONLY oil you can use but just that if you're getting a lot of jams on a gun that isn't gritty enough to be considered as too dirty then trying a different oil may do the trick. It was a big eye opener for me. I used the same ammo the next day and it ran like a champ without a single issue.

I also found that even when new when cleaned and oiled it threw out brass a good 3 feet to the side. As it got dirty the brass would come out with less and less verve to it. And when it got downright lazy then the stovepiping started. I don't notice this any more so I guess my gun is broken in now.

Also the first mod I did to the gun at the second cleaning or so was to polish up the feed ramp with a small piece of 600 wetordry sandpaper and some oil as a lube. That DID seem to help it load with a little more snap.

I suspect that as the gun breaks in and the slide move easier you'll need to change back to the heavier recoil spring.
 
if it is stove piping (fired brass) save each pc of jamed brass and when you get 5-6 measurer the rim diameter compare it to new brass and brass that does not jam
found small/ undersize rim dia will also cause stove pipes as the extractor does not put enough pressure on it and it slips out
 
when I took my Black Badge course the guy with a shadow had a bunch of jams too.

I just got a CZ 75 and if it's anything like it I'll be putting it on the EE. nothing less than 100% is good enough. Service guns are supposed to be reliable.
 
funny, I had a Cz shadow and it ran great out of the box, 147gr 9mm cmj, 135pf. Only problems I had were with dirty (ie: sandy dirt) mags.
 
BCRider said:
Also the first mod I did to the gun at the second cleaning or so was to polish up the feed ramp with a small piece of 600 wetordry sandpaper and some oil as a lube. That DID seem to help it load with a little more snap.
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I did the same thing with 1000grit but it made it worse in terms of carbon buildup on the feed ramp. I probably ruined the polish that was there originally. No matter what I use on it - Ed's Red, Carb cleaner, Ballistol, Hoppes - there's still some residue left & I can never get rid of it completely.

In my case, the ammo is the only difference, I don't get the stovepipes with 115g, period. I've just replaced my springs to the lighter ones so now 147g will be out of the question anyway.

I guess everybody is trying to play nice, but lest we forget one of the main causes of stovepiping: the limp grip. That's what happens to my son when he goes back to experimenting with his grip. ;)

I almost forgot: I clean my gun after every shoot, so its like 250-300 rounds each.
 
cz shadow jamming

Welcome to the world of cz jamming. I have both a sp-01 and a shadow. I have tried all the above mentioned fixes, slide stop, mag lips, polished feed ramp, chamber check each round and all spring weights. I just ordered #10 recoil spring to give it a try. Last resort will be to reshape ejector. The one thing that is consistant is in an ipsc match it will probably jam. I figured I was limp wristing in some of these scenarios. Went and shot a ppc match with a good strong grip and no stovepipes. I did an experiment with a hundred rounds with barely holding onto the gun. No stovepipes! I think the only answer is to stop in the middle of a match and collect the stovepiped brass and keep track of the brand and size of the case as I shoot reloads of all brands. 130 power factor. I have been playing with this problem for two years and have not been able to figure it out. Sorry for not having an answer but keep on experimenting.
 
I solve much of them by setting the lips of the mag to the same width using my micrometer, I realized that there was a huge difference between the 5 I have

I set .355 at the back and .365 at front for the round to point up

Polishing the ramp using Flitz looks great but doesn't improve for the stovepipes

Snowboy
 
First of all; it is not a break in issue. If the gun is set up properly it should run as new, out of the box. If it is jamming now, it will always jam until you figure out why and correct it. Having said that; it's probably a pretty simple thing to fix once you have it figured.

You say the gun is stove-piping. By that we mean an empty case not fully ejected, and trapped more or less vertically against the breach by the slide as it's closing...yes? I know this may be obvious to most here, but I've had people tell me their guns were stove-piping before when it was actually a feeding problem, so clarity is important.

If this is indeed the case the first and most likely place to look is the ratio between recoil spring and power factor. If you are over-sprung for your particular load it means it is not generating enough recoil energy to cycle the slide fully. It will be ejecting soft and the slide will be closing before the empty has a chance to clear the breach and trapping it. So it may actually just be a case of bumping your load up to 135 or 140 to put things in the correct balance. 130 pf is pretty marginal for a competition gun anyway.

There are other things that can cause this:
*Incorrect extractor tension (doubtful in a new gun)
*Incorrect feed lip dimension letting fresh round present too high, knocking the extracting empty out of line with the ejector (also doubtful in a new gun).
*Bulged brass on the fresh round also kicking the empty out before full extraction (possible but doubtful if you're not getting feed problems as well).
*Coarse chamber causing too much case drag during extraction and bleeding off slide energy (possible but unlikely). Doesn't hurt to polish it anyway though.
*Rim variance in 9mm cases. Varying rim dimensions = varying extractor tension (relatively) so you may be getting a few cases that are just too far under tolerance for your particular gun.
*Crappy magazines. Some mags are just not going to work...ever. Number your mags and check to see if jams occur always with the same mags. If so, replace as necessary. FWIW: for the CZ a lot of guys swear by the Tanfoglio small frame mags.

That's all I can think of for now. I have too many thoughts of Christmas turkey dancing in my brain. So good luck and Merry Christmas!
 
All my magazines for every pistol a every rifle are numbered. I use a Sharpie on stainless mags and a paint pen on blue ones. Any time a gun jams, I glance at the mag number. After a while, iInotice that EVERY jam is with mag #3. Not difficult then to figure out what the problem is - the mag.

If problems occur with all the mags, then the problem is the gun or ammo.
 
Thanks Rob for stating this is not a break in issue. I have been following this form and the cz form for 2 years and am tired of people saying this is a break in issue. These guns are not built tight and never were. I must agree that these guns like hot loads and when you powder them down it's a fine balance of tuning to get them to work just right. And with the mags, cz and tangfolio, put ten rounds in and slowly strip them out. You will find the first 5 come out slowly and nose dive and the last five snap out fast with lots of tension. With a full mag the spring is actually spring bound and has less tension then a partial mag. This is a cause of many of the feed related problems. The answer to this is a 15 round mag only loaded with ten.

Merry Christmas
 
Sorry Perry but springs just don't work that way. The MOST force the spring will generate on the follower is at full compression whether they are coil bound or not. If you're running into any trouble with the rounds coming out it's due to this extra pressure pushing them so hard against the lips that there's more friction to overcome.

I have to agree that saying the guns are tight is a mistaken description. But there's no doubt that some have a rough feel when new. And those will smoothen up with use. The slicker feel to the slides as they "break in" means that the power of the recoil can push the slide back farther since there's not as much energy lost in fighting the roughness in the rails.
 
I've got a little over 900 through my Shadow now and not a single malfunction yet. Ammo has been Winchester white box 115 grain.

Just started working on some reloads. First 30 going from 120-130pf in batches of ten worked flawlessly.

The only thing I've changed in mine has been the mainspring to a 15lb one. I keep the pistol fairly clean and lubricated with white lithium grease.
 
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