Heatshields...

ghostwalkah said:
Rockeye: Good to know there's hope for the ATI! I think I'll give a it a shot. I heard the key to installation lies in taking the barrel off (I guess some people just can't be bothered...) & dabbing a few quick drops of LockTite on the screws/switching out the screws for shorter ones.
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yup take the barrel off and bend the rear tabs down on a smaller section of barrel.Then when you slide it back(I bet you don't give a rat's ass about scratches either ;) ) it will be tight.
And yup again to shorter screws.
 
BCRider: Sound advice. Thank you.

Rockeye: Scratches on the finish are essentially a firearm's scars. Chicks dig em, hehehe
I think I'll try the ATI shield w/no GRs (as I already have a set mounted).
 
BCRider said:
I must admit to some occasional desire for a heat shield myself. The info about ruining the front bead sight view is a good one. It would seem that the cure is to mount a rear ghost ring sight and a clamp on front ring and sight that also acts as a mounting pad for the shield to attach. With a front and some sort of rear mount things should come out nice and solid. Of course lining it up the first time and adding some form of indexing mark would be quite important.
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the heat shield I have has sights built in...or rather on.
Just have to line up the rear with the center of the receiver and done.
 
I hate heat shields, though I could maybe see the use {for a not bayonette user} if you turn the gun over to reload, which I don't.
 
Wendell said:
I don't like the look of heatshields, so, for the most part, I don't use them. I think that shooting with warrior gloves (on a civilian range) defines Tacti-cool and looks even more ### than a bayonet on a handgun, so, for the most part, I don't use them (unless the ambient temperature is below zero). When I shoot a long course I try to remember to not touch the barrel. (And sometimes I do and sometimes I don't.) And sometimes I get burned and sometimes I don't. If you want a heatshield, get a heatshield.

Heatshields and gloves have a purpose. So do scarves.

I don't wear scarves either.

Search Functon - how to use
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=326058

P.S.: I'm sorry my link didn't work.

Let's try that again:
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/search.php?searchid=9582146
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ha ha ha post of the month!
 
ghostwalkah said:
Uh, okay.

In my line of employment wearing gloves keeps my hands clean from some of the "garbage" I have to handle =)
Since I wear em while shooting at work, I keep the practice going when I shoot on my own time.

As for the ###ness factor on civi ranges, I avoid it by avoiding civi ranges...

Can't argue with you when it come to the pistol bayo though =)

The scarf keeps that yummy Afghan fecal matter-based dust outta my nostrils =) I've inhaled my fair share over the years to choose differently now.

Thanks for the corrected link, but it still isn't working for me though.
But I think I've pretty much gotten most of the info I was after.
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you been schooled SON! awesome comeback ghostwalkah
 
870P said:
I hate heat shields, though I could maybe see the use {for a not bayonette user} if you turn the gun over to reload, which I don't.
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The ex police guy that gave us a course on shotgun handling strongly suggested to reload by flipping the gun over and hold the receiver. Less likely to fumble and drop the shells in the heat of a situation when the adrenaline is running strong and the hands are shaking. It's less tactical looking but it made a lot of sense.

But an errant finger that happens to find the barrel after shooting 20 or 30 rounds sure wakes a person up pronto! That's where a heat shield would be nice to have.
 
best on on the market only one i will use on my combat shotgun builds is the Factory mossberg parkerised units.
Its made for the mossy but will work no problem on the 870.
bbb
 
I have the ATI heatshield, love the look and functions well. Had to squeeze it around the barrel but it dosn't move. Matches the hatsan perfecty.

all4.jpg


R:d:
 
BCRider said:
The ex police guy that gave us a course on shotgun handling strongly suggested to reload by flipping the gun over and hold the receiver. Less likely to fumble and drop the shells in the heat of a situation when the adrenaline is running strong and the hands are shaking. It's less tactical looking but it made a lot of sense.

But an errant finger that happens to find the barrel after shooting 20 or 30 rounds sure wakes a person up pronto! That's where a heat shield would be nice to have.
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Lets back this up a bit and tie it into the OP's post. Who carries 20-30 rounds of ammunition for a shotgun? Surely LEO's do not. If you knew you were going to get into some trouble why are you using a shotgun? A rifle is a far better option.

Rolling the shotgun over to reload is great, if you've completely drained the magazine. Ideally it is best to replace what you use as you shoot/fight. You fire two rounds, you seek cover or concealment(cover preferred) and reload two rounds, keeping the tube/magazine topped off at all times. Shotguns with their limited magazine capacity and inherently slow reload times are piss poor options for gunfighting.

With all that being said. If you roll the shotgun over there is no need to touch the barrel, ever! If you can't support the shotgun with one hand you need to remove some crap you've bolted on or hit the gym. If you roll the shotgun inboard as demonstrated by the US Army Marksmanship team(its on youtube) you have several options. With effort you can avoid touching yourself with the potentially hot barrel. You can wear a long sleeve shirt. You can wear gloves, or you can abandon the technique as its awkward and stick with the "replacing what you use when you use it" method.

As for heatshields themselves. They're usually metal/steel and bolted directly to the barrel. Sooner than later the heatshield will be just as hot as the hot barrel it is supposed to protect you from. Add to that the additional weight and cost associated. Personally I think they're next to useless overweight crap being flogged under the title of "tactical".

TDC
 
TDC said:
Lets back this up a bit and tie it into the OP's post. Who carries 20-30 rounds of ammunition for a shotgun? Surely LEO's do not. If you knew you were going to get into some trouble why are you using a shotgun? A rifle is a far better option.

Rolling the shotgun over to reload is great, if you've completely drained the magazine. Ideally it is best to replace what you use as you shoot/fight. You fire two rounds, you seek cover or concealment(cover preferred) and reload two rounds, keeping the tube/magazine topped off at all times. Shotguns with their limited magazine capacity and inherently slow reload times are piss poor options for gunfighting.

With all that being said. If you roll the shotgun over there is no need to touch the barrel, ever! If you can't support the shotgun with one hand you need to remove some crap you've bolted on or hit the gym. If you roll the shotgun inboard as demonstrated by the US Army Marksmanship team(its on youtube) you have several options. With effort you can avoid touching yourself with the potentially hot barrel. You can wear a long sleeve shirt. You can wear gloves, or you can abandon the technique as its awkward and stick with the "replacing what you use when you use it" method.

As for heatshields themselves. They're usually metal/steel and bolted directly to the barrel. Sooner than later the heatshield will be just as hot as the hot barrel it is supposed to protect you from. Add to that the additional weight and cost associated. Personally I think they're next to useless overweight crap being flogged under the title of "tactical".

TDC
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Ask the likes of James Watson, Louis Awerbuck or Gabe Suarez how useless are for combat...

Anyway rollover is inferior to loading from the shoulder, with a little practice you can load from the mount at least as quickly while staying heads up and not needing to move the gun anywhere.

Rolling a shotgun to load it makes about as much sense as needing to roll a mag fed carbine.

If a fumble fingers like me, with lots of nerve damage in his hands, can shoulder load a shotgun at speeds competitive with most of the faster guys you see on Youtube, then anyone can!
 
870P said:
Ask the likes of James Watson, Louis Awerbuck or Gabe Suarez how useless are for combat...

Anyway rollover is inferior to loading from the shoulder, with a little practice you can load from the mount at least as quickly while staying heads up and not needing to move the gun anywhere.

Rolling a shotgun to load it makes about as much sense as needing to roll a mag fed carbine.

If a fumble fingers like me, with lots of nerve damage in his hands, can shoulder load a shotgun at speeds competitive with most of the faster guys you see on Youtube, then anyone can!
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I agree, loading from the shoulder is the better option. As for being useless, the shotgun sucks compared to a rifle. I'd gladly take a shotgun over a handgun any day but I'd take a rifle over a shotgun. The range, ease of use, magazine capacity, and rapid reloads of a rifle cannot be matched by a shotgun.

TDC
 
Watched a girl pick up a C2 by the barrel after firing 4 mags [with out jamming, go figuer] through it on the range at wainwright once, bet she was wishing it had a heat shield on it.

they do work ,its just if you need one or not.

and before you get your panties in a knot, yes big differnce between 20 or so rds through a 12ga pump action and 120 full auto through a C2.
 
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390 Dakota:
Your set up looks solid enough.
Have you put many rounds downrange with the shield on?
Curious to know how it holds up to repeated recoil...

TDC:
I didn't intend to have this thread turn into a "Shotgun Vs Rifle in a firefight" discussion, but since it headed that way:
I utilise a rifle (at work) to engage "targets". I am intimately familiar with the advantages, both in rate of fire, range & speed of reload that this platform offers me.
I utilise a shotgun (albeit in a very different configuration than the ones I personnaly own) to open doors, not to fight with...

I need no convincing of the merits of one over the other.

But in light of the whole "gunfighting" turn of this thread: the truth is that my (or anyone else's) chances of needing to employ any of my personal firearms to defend myself in a gunfight are slim to none.
But if such an incident were to occur, I would employ a firearm which "fits the bill".
Obviously, circumstances would dictate my choice. That is, if time were to permit me to get "that picky"...

Some prefer a shotgun over a rifle for certain combat applications.
Some are much more proficient with the shotgun for such matters.
A 9 shot 590A1 can lay down an impressive amount of lead downrange (depending on the range of the engagement & nature of the ammunition used of course).
Proficient users can "tac load" round after round with terrifying quickness (once the tube has been run empty) & keep their oponents quite "occupied", while moving to a location which will afford them the luxury of a "slower" complete reload.
Others, can place a slug quite quickly & accurately in the center of mass of any target at ranges rivaling some shorter barreled/smaller calibered rifles.
My personal opinions need not be mentioned in this matter. These are just simple facts...
However, like everything else pertaining to firearms, these fact are often deliberated (to death) by parties will little to no experience in the actual employment of firearms against other firearm toting human beings...

I believe 870P said it best: ask the likes of those who have actually employed them in combat...
I might even take it a step above & beyond, and say: ask the likes of those who have actually been in combat. Period.
But there is no call for such "comparisons" on my part. We all do different things for a living, and not one of them warrants "bragging rights", nor the title of "authority on the matter".

However, my OP was not inquiring about such matters.

I do not recall speaking about "rolling the gun to reload" it, nor would I consider it.
It's simply not necessary for me to do so.
Keeping the gun in the shoulder may sound like the perfect solution on a static range, but in a dynamic environment, that option may not be the most feasible.
Moving to cover with three feet of steel bobbing around & snagging everything in it's way (let alone "lasing" everyone in it's path) might prove challenging at best.
Operating the gun from the "workspace" is the way I choose to deal with the problem of firearm placement & control while on the move...

So, back to heatshields:
I have burnt myself, while wearing gloves & long sleeves (and a scarf =) despite the precautions I always attempt to take.
Obviously, some will claim that my precautions might be insufficient...
But, due to the volume & speed of fire I try to acheive with my shotgun, a slight slip of my attention resulted in a rather unpleasant accident.
Will this deter me from progressing with my training & attempting to push the boundaries further? Nope...
Will I be paying more diligent attention to my hand placement as I maneouvre the firearm? Most definitely... But honestly, sometimes we all sacrifice perfect "form" for a split second shaved off the shot clock.
Would a heatshield have prevented the burn? Possibly... Which is why I chose to inquire on others' personal experiences with these accessories.

Why do I work so hard at perfecting rates of fire & reloads on a weapon system some consider inferior for "gunfighting purposes"?
Simply because I don't run the woods with a 10.5" AR, packing 10 x 28 rounds magazines. I trek around with a shotgun, which is in many's opinion, a much more "politically correct" (not to mention "legal") alternative.
Who walks around with 20-30 shells anyway? I do...
I "walk around" with lots more than that...
Why? Because, I do... No point in discussing it...
If the need would arise for me to fire them all off in succession, then I'd like to be trained to do so accordingly, that I may perform the task when the moment comes.
When will the need arise? Never, I'd hope...

I don't foresee this training as being "necessary", but it is in my nature to seek ways to maximise the possibilities of all tools I have in my possession. Hence, my personal need to acheive a certain level of proficiency with my 870...

As for the "tacticool" look of a heatshield, I could really care less how others respond to it.
Some may like the aesthetics, some may despise them. But really, none of these opinions will be cause me to lose any sleep tonight.
What's the saying again? Ah yes, (uninformed) opinions are like @ssHoles, every's got one...
The sad reality of forums is that many feel very secure "sharing" their opinions, regardless of the lack of constructive input these opinions may carry. And such individuals do so even when asked to refrain unless said opinions are based on personal experience...
But most (if not all) would surely hold their tongues if they found themselves faced with "real people, in real situations".
I've yet to hear about a shooter walking up to another at a range, and blurting out that "heatshields are just for looks & added weight". I'm sure such a comment would be swiftly answered by something similar to :"Who the f**k asked you, Buds? And if it's too heavy for you, hit the weights & cowboy up! F****t..."

BTW: these comments (or should I say "opinions" =) of mine are not aimed at anyone in particular.
I simply felt the need to state what many think, as I have often found myself sifting through countless "useless" & opionated posts simply to encounter one reply of any worth (I gauge worth by the amount of constructive information that is included).

So...
To those of you who have replied with your own experiences (both positive & negative), I thank you for taking the time to share your input with me.
To those who have graciously shared their opinions, rest assured, now I know how you "feel" about heatshields.
And, I still don't care any more than I did before you "shared" these feelings with me =)

I have decided to trial a heatshield.
I will be able to provide my own feedback on it's installation, sturdiness & "burn preventive capabilities" once it's been received & tested.

TDC: you brought up a very good point and one that pertains specifically to my situation.
[Sooner (rather) than later the heatshield will be just as hot as the hot barrel it is supposed to protect you from.]
Although I had thought about this possibility, I must admit that I am looking forward to actually putting it to the test.
Truthfully, if the heatshield will merely "postpone" a burn, than it is of no use to me whatsoever.

Only time, and lots of rounds will tell!

GhOsT OuT~
 
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870P said:
Anyway rollover is inferior to loading from the shoulder, with a little practice you can load from the mount at least as quickly while staying heads up and not needing to move the gun anywhere.

Rolling a shotgun to load it makes about as much sense as needing to roll a mag fed carbine.

If a fumble fingers like me, with lots of nerve damage in his hands, can shoulder load a shotgun at speeds competitive with most of the faster guys you see on Youtube, then anyone can!
Click to expand...

You should keep an open mind about different techniques, try loading from the shoulder without using your thumb, say it got hurt ,broke,cut, cut off or what ever, this is when the roll over loading works.

or if you're using 6 rd strippers ,try while holding more then 4 rds in your support hand,again roll over works. know when to use it.
 
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