Mannlicher-Schönauer M1903 Carbine Goodness

[Scocou]

Mannlicher-Schönauer M1903 Carbine Goodness

Well, I finally got my Mannlicher-Schönauer Model 1903 Carbine in my grubby paws. In a nutshell - I like it! This little gem is fairly-well mint, it was made in the mid-30's and has been well cared for.

Despite the gaping pit it left in my bank balance, and the lengthy PITA import process (I brought it in from the US) I am happy as a really-happy clam. I can see why these rifles have so favorable a reputation, I have never felt such a natural-pointing, light and easy to handle carbine.

It came with the rare factory 4X Springer-type scope. This scope doesn't require two holes to be drilled in the receiver like the larger model. The handy optic is quick-detachable and allows use of the superb iron sights through a channel in the attached base.

Like all M1903s the action is un-f'ing-believable. It is incredibly smooth and fast to cycle, I'm dying to shoot it but am not sure if I can bring myself to do so. Sorry for the mediocre photos, my camera is err... not great.

Anyone else privileged to own one of these beauties?
Cheers!

 

[lyktohunt]

Yup I used to have one but not a full stock version ,it was along time ago.
I bought it from a gunsmith in Victoria by the the name of Gil Carmichael.I was all excited to shoot it and had bought some European ammo and blasted off a few rounds and I am pretty sure that old gun must have shot just about every animal in Africa because it sure made some nice keyhole holes in the paper. Old Gil suggested I try some domestic ammo as if I remember correctly he said they were slightly larger than the european stuff and he was right it did shoot better. I did end up selling it a gun show in Duncan and I realize now some guy picked up a nice old claasic very cheap.

 

[smellie]

A beautiful piece of equipment, friend!

These are descended from the rifle and carbine made by Steyr for the Greek Army back in 1903, but likely you know that. The commercial ones are a lot nicer and yours is one of the nicest.

If you are a fan of really slick actions, check out the Portuguese Model 1904 Mauser-Vergueiro also. Only action I've ever come across which can possibly claim to rival yours..... and they were made for an army! Saw one at a gun show a couple of years ago, $160 butchered and it had a perfect bore (8x57: good moose cartridge) and, of course, the original magazine with the quick-release floorplate.

Congrats on the FINE purchase!

 

[Noel]

All I can say is that is a very classy looking rig.
What is it chambered for?

I remember doing work experience at a gunshop and I would daily stop by a gun case and drool at the MS in behind the glass. Even a 15 year old can recognize the craftmanship that went into a rifle like that.

Take good care of it but for goodness sake shoot something with it, it begs you to go do what it was made for, making moose steak.
Congrats!

 

[Scocou]

Yup I used to have one but not a full stock version ,it was along time ago.
I bought it from a gunsmith in Victoria by the the name of Gil Carmichael.I was all excited to shoot it and had bought some European ammo and blasted off a few rounds and I am pretty sure that old gun must have shot just about every animal in Africa because it sure made some nice keyhole holes in the paper. Old Gil suggested I try some domestic ammo as if I remember correctly he said they were slightly larger than the european stuff and he was right it did shoot better. I did end up selling it a gun show in Duncan and I realize now some guy picked up a nice old claasic very cheap.

I would like to have a 1/2 stock version some day to keep it company, but this will keep me happy for some time . Too bad you sold yours, and even worse that I didn't buy it!

A beautiful piece of equipment, friend!

These are descended from the rifle and carbine made by Steyr for the Greek Army back in 1903, but likely you know that. The commercial ones are a lot nicer and yours is one of the nicest.

If you are a fan of really slick actions, check out the Portuguese Model 1904 Mauser-Vergueiro also. Only action I've ever come across which can possibly claim to rival yours..... and they were made for an army! Saw one at a gun show a couple of years ago, $160 butchered and it had a perfect bore (8x57: good moose cartridge) and, of course, the original magazine with the quick-release floorplate.

Congrats on the FINE purchase!

Thanks for the complement, I am super pleased with it. I will look into the Mauser you describe but am flat broke (gun budget anyhow) for the near future. I have the Mauser front well covered also, with a near mint 71/84 (1888 prod.) that has an unbelieveable full-length tiger-stripe stock (grade-7 I think, whatever the best was). Mind you the action doesn't compare to the M-S and doubtless the 1904 is better too...

All I can say is that is a very classy looking rig.
What is it chambered for?

I remember doing work experience at a gunshop and I would daily stop by a gun case and drool at the MS in behind the glass. Even a 15 year old can recognize the craftmanship that went into a rifle like that.

Take good care of it but for goodness sake shoot something with it, it begs you to go do what it was made for, making moose steak.
Congrats!

Thanks! The Model 1903 was chambered for the 6.5x54mm cartridge only, later models used different calibers (and/or the same). I will definitely baby this beauty, rest assured . I would love to bag a moose with her but I think this ol' gal (Manuela) deserves a peaceful retirement...

 

[Boomer]

Very nice. That is one of the rifles I have always associated as being a proper hunting rifle, and was years ahead of it's time. You are indeed fortunate.

 

[tiriaq]

These carbines are lovely little rifles. If you handload, though, procede with caution. Headspace tolerances can be interesting, and brass is scarce enough that you won't want to lose them because of separations.

 

[Kevan]

My little 1/2 stock carbine was a gift from my late Father-in law.
He acquired it in 1956 while serving with the UN contingent in Egypt.
At that time, private ownership of firearms was punishable by death, and for that reason the owner had wrapped it up and buried it in the sand for several years, not wanting to destroy it.
Luckily for me, he was determined to find a better home for it than a sand dune.
Since I've had it the little rifle has only taken one deer, but its a dream to carry and a wonderful shooter..... a keeper for sure.

 

[Noel]

Thanks! The Model 1903 was chambered for the 6.5x54mm cartridge only, later models used different calibers (and/or the same). I will definitely baby this beauty, rest assured . I would love to bag a moose with her but I think this ol' gal (Manuela) deserves a peaceful retirement...

I should have known that too!
Great chambering, one of the first ones I ever shot as a kid, but in a Norwegian Krag, still have one of the Dominion 160's in my collection.

Still think it needs to get you one moose. Just one.

 

[Mike Webb]

That is one classy looking rifle and they are smooth. Funny Noel mentioned a Krag as they are pretty smooth as well.

 

[mbogo3]

Slug the bore some are .264 and others .266-.268 Hornady makes some .266 160 grainers............Harold

 

[tjhaile]

Those are so much nicer than the cheaply built but high-priced rifles Steyr Mannlicher puts out today.

The Europeans sure seem to like their high scope mounts for some reason.

 

[Scocou]

Thanks for all the friendly, interesting comments fellows! I'll respond to each below;

Very nice. That is one of the rifles I have always associated as being a proper hunting rifle, and was years ahead of it's time. You are indeed fortunate.

Definitely, it must have seemed like it was from the future in 1903 .

If I had to choose between my small-caliber carbines, I would take it over my SAN Classic Green Carbine and my LMT M4 for the reason you state, it is truly a proper hunting rifle.

These carbines are lovely little rifles. If you handload, though, procede with caution. Headspace tolerances can be interesting, and brass is scarce enough that you won't want to lose them because of separations.

Thanks for the advice! I think I will be honest enough with myself to admit that, while I am competent, I am not a very experienced handloader. As much as I would love to get some 6.5x54mm dies and work-up a load, I think it deserves better than I can give it . I am kicking myself for passing up a vintage box of cartridges at a gun show (Courtenay) a few weeks ago. They were $60 though, so no real pain .

My little 1/2 stock carbine was a gift from my late Father-in law.
He acquired it in 1956 while serving with the UN contingent in Egypt.
At that time, private ownership of firearms was punishable by death, and for that reason the owner had wrapped it up and buried it in the sand for several years, not wanting to destroy it.
Luckily for me, he was determined to find a better home for it than a sand dune.
Since I've had it the little rifle has only taken one deer, but its a dream to carry and a wonderful shooter..... a keeper for sure.

Very cool story, I was glad to read it. I wish I knew the history behind my carbine... I like the 1/2 stock'ers but am really partial to the full stock. Doubtless though I will get a 1/2 stock to keep this one company.

I should have known that too!
Great chambering, one of the first ones I ever shot as a kid, but in a Norwegian Krag, still have one of the Dominion 160's in my collection.

Still think it needs to get you one moose. Just one.

I also enjoy my Krag (-actioned sporter) but somehow it is in a different class from the M-S. Not to belittle it - the prince need not be jealous of the king . I'll think about taking it out, maybe one little moose, we'll see...

That is one classy looking rifle and they are smooth. Funny Noel mentioned a Krag as they are pretty smooth as well.

Defintely high on my list too, I enjoy my Krag as well. Thanks for the complement!

Slug the bore some are .264 and others .266-.268 Hornady makes some .266 160 grainers............Harold

Valuable advice for sure, but most likely I'll let this ol' gal retire from service (hand-loading, at least). Someone took good care of it for 75 years, I know I will screw it up the first time I use it... I could never forgive myself. Likely gonna' be a safe queen.

Those are so much nicer than the cheaply built but high-priced rifles Steyr Mannlicher puts out today.

The Europeans sure seem to like their high scope mounts for some reason.

The new production look good, I would like to use one but agreed - they really don't compare to the originals. Also no Schönauer magazine in the new units...

The scope is high indeed, chin weld territory for sure. It is however very comfortable, and allows for the generous see-through channel so one can get at the irons quickly. Also the action would prohibit a lower mount, unless I miss my guess...

 

[tjhaile]

The new production look good, I would like to use one but agreed - they really don't compare to the originals. Also no Schönauer magazine in the new units...

My main issue with the new Steyr rifles are the design characteristics of the action, some of which seem to be cost cutting measures at the expense of functionality:

-The tubular receiver with a narrow ejection port, which does not lend itself to single loading.
-The pressed in barrel cannot be replaced without specialized equipment, including a hydraulic press.

In addition, there some other features that are poorly thought out:
-The 60 degree bolt throw comes at the expense of increased lifting effort compared with a conventional 90 degree bolt.
-The short stroke firing pin may provide a fast lock time, but will give light strikes with some primers. A heavier firing pin spring exacerbates the heavy bolt lift problem.
-The new Steyrs are push feed, whereas the original Mannlichers were controlled feed.

More discussion can be found here, pertaining specifically to the Steyr Scout:
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155871
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155871

In general, I think that the older bolt actions that were originally designed for military rifles (or were derivatives thereof, such as the Winchester Model 70) are better designs for a general purpose rifle. Most modern designs have changed in the interest of reducing manufacturing costs, rather than implementing functional improvements.

 

[Scocou]

Hmmmn... interesting info, I'll take your word for it. I'd still like to shoot one but won't be expecting much compared to the old M-S models.

I certainly agree with your statement that modern designs are inferior based on the desire to save dough. They haven't made real guns since the 60's, I guess they just cost too much to produce. Likely the art of elegant firearm design is dead (like architecture, cars etc.)
Cheers!

 

[Calum]

Wow dude I tell you one thing, if I had to have one rifle...

What a beautiful rifle.

 

[Tharjoe]

Congrats on a fine rifle! I picked up something similar awhile back.
Mine was made by Holland & Holland and uses a 1902 Steyr Mannlicher action. It's in 6.5x53R (the British .256 Mannlicher). 6.5x53R is the rimmed version of the 6.5x54MS. Despite the confusion on the bore dimensions when the British called it the 256 Mannlicher, mine works well with the 0.264" Hornady 160grain bullets. Some of the barrels in this caliber (and 6.5 Mannlicher Carcano) were intended for the 0.268" bullets.
If you do use yours, you might want to have a look at using the long 160grain bullets. I know that most of the earlier rifles were intended for the long heavy bullets and they apparently (I've not yet tried it) don't do well with short/light varmint bullets.

 

[Mauser98]

That's a Beautiful rifle.

And if anyone was wondering what high quality slow rust bluing looks like, here's a great example.

 

[Scocou]

Wow dude I tell you one thing, if I had to have one rifle...

What a beautiful rifle.

Thanks! I am very pleased with it, I might need to edit my post in the "last ditch rifle" thread... If you're ever up-island I'll let you drool on it . Errr... make that next to it

Congrats on a fine rifle! I picked up something similar awhile back.
Mine was made by Holland & Holland and uses a 1902 Steyr Mannlicher action. It's in 6.5x53R (the British .256 Mannlicher). 6.5x53R is the rimmed version of the 6.5x54MS. Despite the confusion on the bore dimensions when the British called it the 256 Mannlicher, mine works well with the 0.264" Hornady 160grain bullets. Some of the barrels in this caliber (and 6.5 Mannlicher Carcano) were intended for the 0.268" bullets.
If you do use yours, you might want to have a look at using the long 160grain bullets. I know that most of the earlier rifles were intended for the long heavy bullets and they apparently (I've not yet tried it) don't do well with short/light varmint bullets.

Ahhh... also a fine piece of equipment. I would like to get into collecting different Mannlichers but it will be a pricey hobby! Thanks for the tip regarding bullet selection, I'll keep a list in case I crack and take her out.

That's a Beautiful rifle.

And if anyone was wondering what high quality slow rust bluing looks like, here's a great example.

Thanks much! Yes, this rifle is a great example of classy bluing - aside from '30s Colts I haven't found a contender for the prize. As for modern productions, Anschütz holds up pretty well but it doesn't have that 'magic' glow. In fairness it could be age patina that lends it the extra class... Interestingly, the bluing on the Kahles scope has a distinct 'plumb' tint when seen in sunlight. I'd never seen plumb bluing outside of the knife collecting world...

 

[Slimbo]

Like boomer said, it is a "proper HUNTING rifle" Don't keep that baby tucked away in the safe, use it for what it was MADE for...hunting!! (although take damn good care of it during!).