Bullet molds for three historical cals - which to choose?

H Wally

H Wally

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I've got three calibers to start casting for:
43 Mauser - bore diameter .450 -The standard 11mm mauser bullet is .446, ideas?
44 Russian - bore diameter .429
.455 webley - bore diameter .455+

I'm looking for a bullet that doesn't need a gas check, and has deep grease grooves if possible.



I would like to know what your preferred mold is for each and why.

Also, does anyone know what the standard bullet weight for the 43 mauser and 44 russian were? I know the 44 Russ cartridge probably varied more than the 43 mauser.


I've found the hollow base webley mold by RCBS but am wondering if there are others out there. ( RCBS 1-Cavity Bullet Mold 45-265-RN-HB 455 Webley (455 Diameter) 265 Grain Round Nose Hollow Base )
 
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I can't tell you a make and mold number but you definitely want a long pointed slug and a hollow base for the Webley. They are far more accurate in my guns that round nosed ones made for the smaller colt 45.

cheers Doug
 
Definitely - have a bunch of loaded basic fb .45 cal boolits that I've been shooting. They work all right, but would prefer the hollow base.

Still, for not fully sealing the bore and light powder charge they still mushroom pretty nicely at 50ft :D

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H Wally said:
I've got three calibers to start casting for:
43 Mauser - bore diameter .450
44 Russian - bore diameter .429
.455 webley - bore diameter .455+

I'm looking for a bullet that doesn't need a gas check, and has deep grease grooves if possible.



I would like to know what your preferred mold is for each and why.

Also, does anyone know what the standard bullet weight for the 43 mauser and 44 russian were? I know the 44 Russ cartridge probably varied more than the 43 mauser.


I've found the hollow base webley mold by RCBS but am wondering if there are others out there. ( RCBS 1-Cavity Bullet Mold 45-265-RN-HB 455 Webley (455 Diameter) 265 Grain Round Nose Hollow Base )
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Webley does not seem to use coning where the bullet enters the barrel. That is why I think the long pointed slugs work better, at least for me. The round nosed bullets shot and did not tumble but I got much better accuracy out of the long pointed ones

cheers mooncoon
 
mooncoon said:
I can't tell you a make and mold number but you definitely want a long pointed slug and a hollow base for the Webley. They are far more accurate in my guns that round nosed ones made for the smaller colt 45.

cheers Doug
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Now I have had the opposite experience with the hollow based bullets and don't get the point of making the more labour intensive hollow based bullets anymore, other than they look purdy.
 
H Wally said:
Hmmm - I'm thinking I may need to look for a .452 mold for my mauser... it slugs to exactly .450 with crisp sharp rifling.
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I'm in the same boat. I have a K Model 71 I'd like to shoot more but I need a mould. The Lyman #451114 looks interesting. It's a .451", 450 grain flat point meant for the Parker Hale Volunteer rifle. It's a bit heavy and you'd probably end up seating it with a couple of grease grooves showing, but I wonder if it would work.
 
Well, on the one hand you probably wouldn't have to worry about the bullet having to jump the freebore...

Curios that there aren't any approx 350gr .452 molds out there. I almost wonder if a 300gr pistol mold might be ok
 
H Wally said:
Definitely - have a bunch of loaded basic fb .45 cal boolits that I've been shooting. They work all right, but would prefer the hollow base.

Still, for not fully sealing the bore and light powder charge they still mushroom pretty nicely at 50ft :D
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The soft lead bullet base might have bumped up and sealed the bore.
 
I recovered a few and no such luck - they deformed a little, but not enough for a good consistant seal.. Keeping the loads pretty light while I get my feel for which ones can take a little more oompf. Wouldn't mind having the right mould anyways.
 
Rifle bullet for the .43 Mauser (okay, purists, the 11.15x60R) was 386 grains for the 1871 and 1871/84 models both. The DIFFERENCE was that the 1884-model slug had a slight flat on the nose and the original '71 had a full round-nose.

They did make a Carbine load for the .43, but it was 55 grains of powder as opposed to 77 for the Rifle loading. You can duplicate the Rifle load with 29 grains of SR-4759, although recoil can be slightly murderous in a Carbine: you REALLY know you've shot something! I would think about 21 grains of SR-4759 should duplicate the Carbine loading.

I am planning to try .45 Auto slugs in my own Kar. '71, just get a .446" taper die to size them down a tad: Lee makes this for $30, which is about $70 cheaper than the correct RCBS mould. I don't need a lot of power: I'm shooting tin cans, not Hottentots.

Good luck!
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For the 43 Mauser, if your bore's groove size is 0.450", then 45 cal bullets sized down to 0.452" will probably work well. The thing to watch out for is that they will chamber without pinching the neck, as the original bullet was 0.446". The M71/84 I shoot most accepts bullets sized down to 0.448" with room to spare, but yours might not accept 0.452". You should have a minimum of 0.002" neck clearance - if not, you'll need to do some neck turning.

Mine likes the heavier (read longer) bullets. Once you have the neck clearance issue sorted out, I'd try a variety of plain base 45 cal bullets sized to 0.452" (a standard Lee sizer diameter) ranging from 300 to 500 grs. 45-70 Trapdoor loads work wonderfully in the 43 Mauser, and SR-4759 can't be beat. I love to experiment with different powders, but SR-4759 seems to always come out on top.
 
My experience with these rifles and I have a few is that the RCBS mold at 386gr. and sized at .446 works wonderful in the 71/84 repeaters. I use IMR 4198 powder. However the Model 71 rifles if you examine them have different chambers and require different bullets.I believe the bore size is the same but the groove depth is deeper in the earlier Model 71 single shot rifles. They were originally loaded with a paperpatch bullet and they have virtually no lead into the rifling.They require a soft lead bullet that will bump up to fill the grooves. I have done chamber casts and the depth of groove has run from 454 to 458 deep. I have experimented with 45LC bullets at 452 and 454 and even had one rifle that would take 458 bullets. The larger bullets cannot always be placed in the cartridge and loaded into the rifles as the chamber neck might not be large enough to permit chambering with a larger diameter bullet. I experimented by running a 45 Colt reamer up into the neck of one rifle to open it so I could use the 45 Colt .452 bullets. The big issue with these older Model 71 rifles is that the ones I have seen have the paer-patch chamber with no real lead angle into the rifling. They are too square. I am planning on getting a reamer produced that will recut the chamber neck and throat area to produce a lead angle and make them more friendly towards standard cast bullets and not require paperpatch bullets.
 
Interesting. I'm almost wondering if I went with absolutely pure soft as possible lead bullets and put an average load of powder in, if a .446 could bump up to the bore diameter and give reasonable accuracy. I bought a bunch of custom bullets at a gunshow on the island that're 365 or 385gr and .451 diameter that I used to slug the barrels and they seemed pretty good... Would rather be able to handload the cartridge rather than have to place the bullet by hand in the chamber or have to do some extensive modifications. I guess this goes on the list of projects :p
 
H Wally said:
Interesting. I'm almost wondering if I went with absolutely pure soft as possible lead bullets and put an average load of powder in, if a .446 could bump up to the bore diameter and give reasonable accuracy. I bought a bunch of custom bullets at a gunshow on the island that're 365 or 385gr and .451 diameter that I used to slug the barrels and they seemed pretty good... Would rather be able to handload the cartridge rather than have to place the bullet by hand in the chamber or have to do some extensive modifications. I guess this goes on the list of projects :p
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been there, done that but...there's another angle to it. Too soft an alloy for the load and the rifling will strip one layer of the bullet causing poor accuracy and tumbling (keyholing). Oh, some leading too :bump:
 
LBT make all kinds of molds of .452" to 360 grs. or more, among the best molds made or design your own on the Mountain molds website. I agree with the poster who tired of casting single cavity hollow base bullets, usually not worth the effort, when you can have molds made in any diameter you want, as many cavities as you want.
 
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