PDW builds - Lets see them, and share results

my PDW, Build specs
Noveske KX-3 flash suppressor
Troy TRX BattleRail
Tangodown stubby grip
Lothar Walther 7.5" barrel i think 1:7 twist
Aero precision lower
STAG upper
Magpul B.A.D. lever
STAG BCG
Aimpoint Micro H-1
BCM charging handle
Magpul MOE Pistol Grip
Troy fixed front and folding rear sight
Magpul ASAP sling plate for the days when a one pint will do
Magpul MOE stock
VTAC sling
H-2 Buffer

so far so good, probably 1200-1500 rounds through it with no hiccups whatsoever, feels like a staple gun while shooting. I usually shoot and practice drills from 5-100 meters and can usually hold a pretty decent group depending on the range. I can hit the "steel sheep" at 200 9 times out of 10. overall very impressed with its performance. shooting from behind barricades and urban prone are extraordinarily easy, when shooting from behind barricades I find I need to have superb situational awareness to avoid streaking hard surfaces because of height over bore issues and the. Transition drills (to secondary and between dominant and off-hands) is very smooth. very little felt mechanical overswing is felt due to minimal weight up front.the only things I'm going to be adding are a scout light with an offset mount, a Redi-Mag, eventually a 3X Magnifier and when the cone on the KX-3 wears out possibly a battle compe or a KAC triple tap, money permitting. I wasn't happy with the differential colours of the gun when all the pieces went together so I gave it the paint it has now.

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2bad4u2 said:
You did know that this round is considered a short range cartridge, right? The absolute maximum effective range of the .300 Blackout/.300 Whisper/.300 WTF is 300 yards or less, even with supersonic ammo.

Subsonics definitely have a "rainbow" trajectory but that's to be expected under the circumstances.

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. Care to enlighten me?
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According to Rsilvers who is head project manager of the 300 Blackout cartridge, the effect range according to military specifications will be around 440m and the .223 is around 480m. I'll try to find the info.


2bad4u2 said:
f**k me gently! They're definitely making the cases from .223 Lake City brass then. I guess my brass issues are over effectively tomorrow. lol. I guess they don't realize it's against their own laws to export reloading components without an export permit from DOS.
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Actually AWA uses once fired AAC 300 Blackout brass :D

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*** This is the email I got from All Weather Arms: ***

"We do ship to Canada. We use the US post office flat rate boxes and they have a twenty pound international limit so as long as you ordered in one thousand pieces at at time you will be under the weight/cost restrictions. Please let us know if you have any further questions. "
 
c4pyro said:
Out of the muzzle the 45 is at 414 ft/lbs, muzzle of the .223 is 1281 so no cross over really. Again that is comparing pistol 45 to 16 inch AR but I don't think the numbers would change much with a longer 45 barrel and pdw 223. They will change but not even close to crossing over from the looks of it.
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Just to lay some of this controversy to rest heres a link to testing done on .45 in different barrel lengths
www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/45auto.html
 
JoeOnePack said:
According to Rsilvers who is head project manager of the 300 Blackout cartridge, the effect range according to military specifications will be around 440m and the .223 is around 480m. I'll try to find the info.




Actually AWA uses once fired AAC 300 Blackout brass :D

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*** This is the email I got from All Weather Arms: ***

"We do ship to Canada. We use the US post office flat rate boxes and they have a twenty pound international limit so as long as you ordered in one thousand pieces at at time you will be under the weight/cost restrictions. Please let us know if you have any further questions. "
Click to expand...

I don't think you'd find many takers on the .300 Blackout or .300 Whisper being a 440 yard cartridge. That's wishful thinking and a little too much hype in my opinion. I never got into the Blackout thinking this was anthing but a short range cartridge.

It's NOT once fired Remington .300 Blackout brass. The factory brass has only been out in very small sporadic quantities for a relatively short period of time. Like within the last 6 months or so.

I believe what you're looking at is converted brass. Notice where they list the brands available on the site? Well, the sole manufacturer of factory .300 Blackout component brass is Remington.
 
2bad4u2 said:
I don't think you'd find many takers on the .300 Blackout or .300 Whisper being a 440 yard cartridge. That's wishful thinking and a little too much hype in my opinion. I never got into the Blackout thinking this was anthing but a short range cartridge.

It's NOT once fired Remington .300 Blackout brass. The factory brass has only been out in very small sporadic quantities for a relatively short period of time. Like within the last 6 months or so.

I believe what you're looking at is converted brass. Notice where they list the brands available on the site? Well, the sole manufacturer of factory .300 Blackout component brass is Remington.
Click to expand...

You are right about the brass. I must have overlooked that.

About the effective range, those numbers are based on military specific calculations, so I would assume they are accurate. Let me dig up the info now. I'll brb. :D

EDIT - Here is the info on effect range.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2517637
 
They sell 1000pcs once fired AAC 300BLK brass for $100. AND THEY SHIP TO CANADA!!!!!!

http://www.allweatherarms.com/1000-P...0-Blackout.htm

This is an opportunity of a lifetime. 1000pcs of cleaned, resized, primer pocket swaged? Wow....
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HOLY CRAP! Is that ever cheap. You don't even want to know what it cost me to make the stuff out of 221 FB brass. :(


Effective range is gonna vary depending on the barrel length, bullet and velocity. The 300 is a truly multi-purpose round so it really depends on what ammo you are using.

The really cool thing about the Whisper is that it doesn't lose a ton of velocity from a short barrel like the 223. I had no problems dropping 200gr subsonics onto a target at 100 yds using iron sights ..... with a 7" PDW. The really cool thing for me was hearing the "tick" of the big bullet punching through the paper target. :)
 
diananike said:
Just to lay some of this controversy to rest heres a link to testing done on .45 in different barrel lengths
www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/45auto.html
Click to expand...

I received an invitation for an outdoor range day, with testing of different rounds at distance. (out to 300yds) My question to the forum is, would wet phonebooks be a good enough test subject to test penetration of bullets at distance? I'll also be testing a 300whisper with heavy bullets also.
 
Heavy bullets in a subsonic Whisper are essentially pointless. The penetration is HUGE with moderate weight bullets. All the heavy ones do Is waste more energy when they fly out the other side of the target.

We put a 150gr subsonic through both sides of a level 2A Kevlar vest from 100 yes away. The bullet blew through 42 layers of Kevlar and then blew through the 2x4 the vest was attached to and disappeared into the berm never to be seen again.

We also tested in soft media and the same 150gr would blow through more than 16" of media without hardly slowing down.

With penetration like that what would be the point of adding more energy?

The only reason I use up to 200gr subsonics is they make it a little easier to get an AR to cycle properly. There is more data for the heavier bullets and the Lapua subsonic is the most accurate I have used.

The 220's and 240's are totally pointless and a waste of money.
 
Wet phone books don't even come close to ballistic gel - I've tested some Hydra-Shok's, Gold Dots, Black Talons on 3-4 stacked wet phone books - It just punches right through with no expansion.
 
I thought also too, wet phonebooks would allow the bullets to expand and with pages counted, we be able to judge also penetration differences from one bullet to another. In my opinion, being able to stop the bullet and document it's travel in comparison to just being able to pass through an object would be more benefitial. I too have some level 2A vest I could test on but I'm not concerned with whether or not my bullets can defeat it. That being said, I don't plan on hunting phonebooks either but they are cheaper and easier to clean up then hauling dead pigs out to the range to test on, as one of my friends proudly offered to do. I can't imagine sifting through a shot up pig for the remains of bullets. Lol
 
TSE_Justin said:
Wet phone books don't even come close to ballistic gel - I've tested some Hydra-Shok's, Gold Dots, Black Talons on 3-4 stacked wet phone books - It just punches right through with no expansion.
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I'm not too sure what you did wrong but when I tested the Glock conversion vs the standard Glock, I duct taped the phonebooks together and soaked them overnight in a 5gallon pail. When I went through the pages to recover the bullets, the claws from the jacketed hollow points were full of wet paper and I had to pick them clean again but the result was a perfect flower like expansion. Go back a few pages on this thread and you can see the result. Even the FMJ rounds had compacted and buldged out a bit which was pretty interesting to see.
 
Hm... my experiment was recent, the Yellow Pages are getting thinner every edition!

This was just a quick soak (maybe 5 minutes?) not an overnight.

How much penetration did you achieve on the rounds that mushroomed properly?
 
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