Need help with newly bought factory 9mm ammunition... (picture).
- Thread starter Requiem
- Start date
You personally took these from the store to your home and at no point did anyone else have access to this ammunition? Ever??
This is big-time scam! Even someone selling reloads wouldn't pack a mixed bag like that in the same box.
Something very strange is going on here.
This is big-time scam! Even someone selling reloads wouldn't pack a mixed bag like that in the same box.
Something very strange is going on here.
Not necessarily reloads - WCC is the headstamp used for US Gov 9mm produced by Winchester under contract. Looks like the primers are crimped in - pretty hard for a reloader to crimp in a primer. It would appear, however that you got the leftovers - looks like 115, 124 and 147 Ball in the same box - have you weighed the rounds, that would let you know in a hurry. Either way, that shouldn't have left the plant like that - I'd take it back too. Second look, some of those ARE reloadslooks like someone's sh*t ammo collection. Unreal.
No way man.
Even within those weight ranges shells have very close to the same OAL.
Either those are someone trying to return reloads for a refund or they were loading those at the winchester factory at 11:30 New years eve.
What's a chance of this happening at reputable gun store like Al Flaherty's... and to the rookie gun owner... and rookie CGN member with just a handful of posts.
There might be more to this story.
Not impossible, but...
There might be more to this story.
Not impossible, but...
Well thanks for the vote of confidence. I'm headed to Flaherty's tomorrow. I'm going to ask him to open other boxes from this batch and see what's up. I'd be surprised if they are not the same. I'm not saying the store is dishonest... they might have bought a batch on good faith and never had anyone check them out.
Also, if you check my previous post in the preceding days, you see that I was actually refered to Flaherty on this very forum and was very happy to have found a place near. http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=696434 Of course that could all still have been part of my elaborate plot to... achieve not sure what exactly, but anyway... I would need to have lots of time to waste.
I'll update tomorrow.
Having been on both sides of the counter, I'll propose what I believe is a likely scenario for what happened here. A guy enters the store with a pistol to consign, along with the pistol is a cardboard box containing a few boxes of ammo, a spare mag or two, a cleaning kit and maybe an Uncle Mikes holster. The pistol gets written up, the owner leaves the stuff and takes his receipt. The phone rings, counter guy answers and deals with it. A regular comes in and BS'es for 20 minutes, leaves. It's lunch time, while having lunch the pistol is function checked and tagged for sale. Counter guy comes back from lunch, and takes the crap out of the brown cardboard box - seperates the ammo boxes. A guy comes in looking for a silenced Desert Eagle in 50, counter guy tells buddy to get a life, guy's a bit "off" so the counter guy moves the 3 boxes of 9mm off the counter and absent mindedly puts them with the rest of the 9mm - guy leaves after waisting 15 minutes of counter guys life talking about training children to shoot AK's in Nigeria, and asking to buy an AK. Someone else comes in and actually buys a gun, counter guy does the paperwork, faxes it and calls the CFO, gets put on hold. Guy comes in to buy 3 boxes of ammo, asks counter guy for ammo, the CFO comes on the line after being on hold for 20 minutes, he simultaneously grabs the 3 boxes of ammo and writes them up while taking care of the CFO call.
Is that right? NO. Should it happen? NO. Is it devious? NO. Was it intentional? No. Does it sound like it could be what happened?
The fact is that working in a gunshop will teach you more about how many strange people there are in the world, than any other legal activity.
Is that right? NO. Should it happen? NO. Is it devious? NO. Was it intentional? No. Does it sound like it could be what happened?
The fact is that working in a gunshop will teach you more about how many strange people there are in the world, than any other legal activity.
Trust is earned, not given.
Attacking last remaining gun store in Toronto, just when they are giving an honest effort to expand their business, is not taken kindly here.
In decades of shooting under my belt, I have never ever seen reputable gun store sell reloads, as factory ammunition.
This is an illegal act, and could shut them down for business permanently, and all this is coming from someone who just joined CGN.
All that being said, it is not impossible, but highly unlikely.
If it happened, I am certain that store was duped and will deal with affected customers fairly.
ambishooter
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Southeastern Canuckstan
I definitely agree with this. Let's wait for what will Al Flaherty's gonna say. As a shooter from Toronto, this is the only one serving the area and I must say the staff are good and knowledgeable. Let's give them a chance to clear this issue.
And I can attest to that. OP here, final outcome of this situation below.
I went to Flaherty first thing in the morning before coming in into the office. The gentlemen there were very courteous & helpful. The main guy (manager maybe, I don't know them personally) asked to see the bullets I was bringing back, inspected them and rapidly agreed that I was correct and that there was something wrong with them (and unlike some people on this forum, never suggested that I might be responsible).
He sent me to the back where the ammos are stored with a younger clerk who started opening boxes to find & validate a replacement. After opening 5, it became obvious that they all suffered from the same problem. We found one that looked better (all the headstamps were the same, and they all had the same height), but even then they showed bulging around the bullet seating. All the similar boxes of 50 I saw there were flawed. That was also the only brand they had.
But then the guy fetched a "value pack". They are the same winchester 115gr, but they come in boxes of 100 and are just loose in the box without the neat little styrofoam holding tray. Even to my untrained eye, it was immediately obvious that these were right. The headstamps were all "win 9mm luger", they were all equally clean and shinier than the others, they were all the same height, and they showed no bulging what so ever.
Since I had bought 3x50, the guys proposed to give me one of those and keep opening boxes of 50 until we found one that was OK. I told him that I had somewhat lost confidence in the boxes of 50 and that I would be more comfortable grabbing 2 value packs, paying for the difference as appropriate.
The guy didn't hesitate for a second and apologized for the inconvenience. I paid the difference and left a satisfied customer. Incidentally, the value packs are cheaper, so I put in only $6 more and left with 50 bullets more (2x100). So I'm happy.
Props to Flaherty's for handling this like pros. They are currently pulling their boxes of 50 off the shelves and opening them to check. Discussing amongst themselves, they mentioned that they'd bring it up with the winchester guys. So it looks like it was a bad batch.
Thanks everyone for their input.
P.s.: I can also post pictures of my receipts, visa slip, and exchange receipts if my word is still being questioned.
Last edited:
- Location
- Halifax, NS
I can't believe they nickel and dimed you for $6 after giving you that crap. I still doubt this falls on Winchester. What would a major ammunition manufacturer gain from selling obviously flawed ammo? Why would they even load brass with a different head stamp?
I'm not saying it was one or all the employees at the store, I'm just saying I'd be very supprised if the 50 round boxes left the factory in that condition.
I'm not saying it was one or all the employees at the store, I'm just saying I'd be very supprised if the 50 round boxes left the factory in that condition.
