i need a new BIG bang stick.
- Thread starter whitetailwoodsarcher
- Start date
You do not need to step up that far, the 338 does recoil as does the 375, a bit more than a lot of people can handle and especially in a light rifle. I am amazed no one has suggested the 300 Win. it is perfectly adequate for bears and is outstanding on any NA big game. Ammo is available in any store that sells ammo and bullet selection from 110 gns to 220 gns. I used one for years and ended up using 200 gn Nos Parts and I would take on any bear Canada has to offer and not feel undergunned.
I think the 300 WM is a much better all around hunting caliber than the 338 or 375 and if you're capable it is able to stretch way out and touch things better than the larger stuff. I suspect it would take you much less time to get onto shooting the 300 WM than either the 338 or 375.
It is real tough to beat a 300 for all around hunting in NA.
I think the 300 WM is a much better all around hunting caliber than the 338 or 375 and if you're capable it is able to stretch way out and touch things better than the larger stuff. I suspect it would take you much less time to get onto shooting the 300 WM than either the 338 or 375.
It is real tough to beat a 300 for all around hunting in NA.
RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Savage Arms new 116 Alaskan Brush Hunter.
Bone crushing .338WinMag in a back synthetic stock sporting a brushed stainless 18" barrel. Not an uberlight at 7.6lbs, but it will feel like a Manstick in your hands.
Bear Beware, ........I am not food! This short, black stick slung over my back is not a tent pole. It will split you from stem to stern
.
And the best part. This rifle will not break the bank. MSRP $688.00 607.50 at Epps.
Check her out on Savage's home page. She is a beauty.
P.S. I just went to the sight to look at it again, and I realized it's in .375Ruger as well.
The .375H&H was called the Queen of the medium bores by O'Connor. The .375 Ruger has been called the "New King" by Gatehouse. I'm going to call the .338WinchesterMagnum, "First Knight". If you were a bear, which one would you want to face, the King the Queen or the knight who has shown his prowess on the battlefield to be second to no one???
Bone crushing .338WinMag in a back synthetic stock sporting a brushed stainless 18" barrel. Not an uberlight at 7.6lbs, but it will feel like a Manstick in your hands.
Bear Beware, ........I am not food! This short, black stick slung over my back is not a tent pole. It will split you from stem to stern
.And the best part. This rifle will not break the bank. MSRP $688.00 607.50 at Epps.
Check her out on Savage's home page. She is a beauty.
P.S. I just went to the sight to look at it again, and I realized it's in .375Ruger as well.
The .375H&H was called the Queen of the medium bores by O'Connor. The .375 Ruger has been called the "New King" by Gatehouse. I'm going to call the .338WinchesterMagnum, "First Knight". If you were a bear, which one would you want to face, the King the Queen or the knight who has shown his prowess on the battlefield to be second to no one???
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Do you enjoy shooting this rifle? I find the rifle too light for the caliber. I find it has every negative aspect of recoil one can think of. After 3-4 rounds i don't even want to look at it, and I am not exactly a little guy. I have let several others shoot it, they shoot one round, pass it back and say no thanks. Not sure what you have done to yours but this is shooting stock with just a limb saver pad.
cheers
cheers
RememberTheSomme
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
LOL...... good one. I tip my hat to you good sir!
I fired this cartridge prone for only three rounds. It killed on my end,so I know it would be very unpleasant at the receiving end.
With the 185gr TTSX loads it was identical to a .300 Win Mag shooting 180's - my friend has a T3 Lite in .300 WM and we shot them side by side. With max power 250gr Partitions it does recoil more. There are many factors that influence felt recoil.
First, the rifle has to fit you well. Perhaps the stock is too long or too short for you. For example, I found the first generation Remington M700 Mountain Rifle with the hockey puck as a recoil pad quite uncomfortable. It just didn't fit me right.
Next - make sure you are shooting from a comfortable position. A low stool with a high bench for example, will not do you any favours. Also try shooting with shooting sticks while standing.
Then there is the simple fact that some folks are less recoil tolerant than others. If you are used to shooting only .243, .25-06 etc, then the .338 will be a very big step up with between 3 and 4x as much recoil. In many cases practice will help.
On the other hand, there is a fellow I saw on Youtube saying how his T3 Lite in .30-06 kicks like a mule, and how uncomfortable it is to shoot due to the very heavy recoil. He may simply not have the tolerance to recoil, and that is ok.
I have only shot my rifle with the stock recoil "pad", but I did just put a Limbsaver on it a few days ago. I haven't fired it since. I was finding that 4 or 5x 3 shot groups were enough. So I'd stop and not force the matter. I think I should be able to comfortably shoot more than that now.
My friend also has a .375 Ruger in a Ruger Alaskan. With 300gr loads it kicks more.
The last bit of advice is this. There is no shame what-so-ever in coming to a conclusion that a rifle simply has too much recoil. A fellow is much better off using something smaller and becoming proficient with it. He will also have more fun, and that is a big part of our sport - having fun! And along that line of thought, you won't really be undergunned with a .30-06 launching 200gr Partitions at 2650fps. You will have similar trajectory as the 250gr Partition, be able to shoot anything in North America, and it will have almost 40% less recoil in an equivalent rifle.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
In this matter of recoil, if you can't hold for 3 rounds from every field position, the rifle is too much for you. You never know the circumstances under which you might have to shoot, and eventually you'll need a follow up shot or two to get things settled. This isn't necessarily a comment on cartridges as I found a 7.62X54R Mosin Nagant carbine to be one of the most disagreeable rifles I've ever owned. Shooting my hot loaded .416 Rigby was a pleasure by comparison. One wonders what the Kremlin had against their troops. The last time I shot mine (before I pitched it into a deep bottomless swamp) was on a warm summer day and only a T-shirt separated my shoulder from that wicked steel butt plate. Yet take the same rifle, cut that curved butt straight and put a decent recoil pad on it, and its like shooting a different rifle. I gave up on mine because between the wicked butt plate and the crummy trigger to which there seemed to be no solution, I decided to cut my losses and although cash was tight, just invest in a decent rifle that I could comfortably put a lot of rounds through at a single sitting. I think that's when I got my M-17 .30/06 Enfield, which proved to be one of my favorite rifles of all time.
I wouldn't expect the Savage Bush Rifle to be particularly pleasant to shoot in either .338 or .375, but in fairness the rifle was designed for wilderness hunting or protection duties, so was meant to be carried a lot and shot a little. You would expect a day at the range with a rifle like that to rattle your cage. The fact remains though, if you can't hold it for 3 rounds, it doesn't matter how cheap it is, how cool it is, or how much you think you need it's power; the rifle is too much for you, and you need to either download it to a tolerable level, or swap it for a rifle you can shoot. Oh you can play around and spend a bunch of money swapping stocks (attempting to cut a hollow tupperware stock will probably provide you with that opportunity) or adding weight to the factory stock, which will more than likely screw up its balance, but in the end choosing a different rifle will prove to be the most cost effective and practical solution.
I wouldn't expect the Savage Bush Rifle to be particularly pleasant to shoot in either .338 or .375, but in fairness the rifle was designed for wilderness hunting or protection duties, so was meant to be carried a lot and shot a little. You would expect a day at the range with a rifle like that to rattle your cage. The fact remains though, if you can't hold it for 3 rounds, it doesn't matter how cheap it is, how cool it is, or how much you think you need it's power; the rifle is too much for you, and you need to either download it to a tolerable level, or swap it for a rifle you can shoot. Oh you can play around and spend a bunch of money swapping stocks (attempting to cut a hollow tupperware stock will probably provide you with that opportunity) or adding weight to the factory stock, which will more than likely screw up its balance, but in the end choosing a different rifle will prove to be the most cost effective and practical solution.
He said from any field position. I can start rattling off numerous ones that I would not fire even once from prone! Unbraked .378 Wby from prone anyone?
And yes, that Tikka pad is a joke. I am sure I will be comfortable for 2x as many rounds from the bench now.
westcoaster
CGN Regular
- Location
- Central BC
Huh, back to the op's question.
First off, the 308 is perfectly adequate for the chance encounters you are hypothesizing about. As is a 3006, a 7mmrm, a 300wm, etc... However, if you want something with a little more ooomph, a little more "reach out and touch something", thats all good and valid.
The bottom line is more power recoils more. It will also penetrate better at distance.
And then there is the myth of "flat shooting", at 300 yards with np's there is about 3 inches difference between the 308, the 300wm, and the 338wm. At 500 yards there is about 5". The difference is not material.
From my experience there is not enough difference between a 308 or 3006 and the various fast 300's to justify the change. That leaves the 338wm or the 375, oh and before everyone else chimes in - yes that could include the 8mmrm, the 9.3x62, the 9.3x64, the 358 Norma, etc.
For everyday use the 338wm is just easier because cartridges are more readily than for most of the others mentioned and I think we're splitting hairs as far as ability to kill stuff with any of these cartridges.
Put a good recoil pad on it, load it up with 250's(my favorite) or 225's and fill ark with dead critters.
If you are worried about stopping a grizzly, rather then hunting one, then you are into a different type of gun. A stopping round is bigger and more powerful then a hunting round. Don't get them confused. A 7mm, 308, 30.06, and even the 338 are perfect hunting rounds but, to stop a "pissed, hungry grizzly" from turning you into a meal, you are looking at a 375 H&H Mag, as a starter. The rest is up to you.
westcoaster
CGN Regular
- Location
- Central BC
Gibbs, with all due respect, I wouldn't class a 375 as a stopper either as it is near the same piece of lead traveling slower than a 338wm.
Heck, that's why I bought a Rigby.
Gophers, Grouse, Groundhogs, coyotes, deer, bear, elk and moose.
Butcher was surprised with the minimal damage to a deer as he kept being told those big guns did so much damage. It will take the head off a grouse but push the nose of a coyote out the back of his head.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
As a measure of what you should consider your personal maximum recoil tolerance from field positions, sure; if you can shoot 3 rounds well, you can handle it well enough to hunt with it. I could hold 3 shots prone from the .416, (350s ahead of 102 grs of H-4350) and 5 prone from the .375 Ultra (300s ahead of 92 grs of H-4350) was quite doable. Shooting from sitting with the .458, (short shank 500s ahead of 76 grs of H-335) I usually run out of ammo before I've had enough, but that M-70 is only a 3 shooter. None of these rifles were much over 9 lbs, the Ultra was 7 lbs with the factory stock, but the McMillan made it 9 as well. Watching myself shoot the Ultra prone in slow motion is an education. It looks as if the rifle drives my shoulder back 6", but it didn't feel as bad as it looked. I'd post it if I could figure out how, but my computer and my video camera aren't on speaking terms.
I fired as many as 5 rounds from prone with the .416, but it was a foolish exercise, with the same results each time, the 4th shot would hurt (every time), and while 5th shot didn't, my concentration wasn't there to break it cleanly. That's where I hit the wall and I lost the rifle before I could get beyond it.
When I was shooting the .500 Nitro, (580s over 89 grs of 3031) all the shooting was off hand, but after a dozen or so rounds with that 19th Century hard rubber pad, I'd had enough, and I harped the two triggers once to boot. The rifle might have been made in the 1920's but the rubber in that pad had to be a 100 years older than the rifle.
