bears/ pistol cals.

diesel64

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First off i'd like to say there is a ton of useful info on this forum. I was looking on caliber and pistol info in regards to bears. If a person was to pack a pistol for hiking and personal safety in Black bear country ( which i live in) what would you purchase. I've owned rifles all my life but I only use a 9 glock for targets. I'm looking to make another buy but I don't know what to get for the purpose Im looking for. I hear 357, 44 mag. I need help.
Thank you
 
So the purpose you're looking for is...jail time?

Clearly you don't know enough to have an ATC, so I'm guessing you plan on carrying illegally.

Seems legit.
 
First off i'd like to say there is a ton of useful info on this forum. I was looking on caliber and pistol info in regards to bears. If a person was to pack a pistol for hiking and personal safety in Black bear country ( which i live in) what would you purchase. I've owned rifles all my life but I only use a 9 glock for targets. I'm looking to make another buy but I don't know what to get for the purpose Im looking for. I hear 357, 44 mag. I need help.
Thank you

;)
Welcome to the forum. Interesting first post. Not that we don't like you, but if you're serious, please understand that this type of posting has a long history here, and you'll provoke a lot of baggage with your question.
 
What would you say to the Police Officer that came knocking on your door when they found the dead or badly injured bear?

Get a can of Bear spray, seems to be much more effective.
 
A handgun is a restricted firearm...it's illegal to carry a handgun unless you are licensed to do so (ATC used by law enforcement, armoured car security, military etc.) for any reason including personal protection, bears or even horny beavers that just won't take no for an answer f:P:2:

really....you should know this if you've owned rifles all your life.

hope this was just a brain fart..if so, welcome to the forum...if not, please gtfo anti troll :rolleyes:
 
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First off i'd like to say there is a ton of useful info on this forum. I was looking on caliber and pistol info in regards to bears. If a person was to pack a pistol for hiking and personal safety in Black bear country ( which i live in) what would you purchase. I've owned rifles all my life but I only use a 9 glock for targets. I'm looking to make another buy but I don't know what to get for the purpose Im looking for. I hear 357, 44 mag. I need help.
Thank you

At this point in time in Canada, you will not get an ATC for recreational purposes; the ATCs are only issued to persons who need to protect themselves while engaged in commercial activities, where both hands are required for working, thus prohibiting the use of a long gun. The logic (if you would like to call it logic) is that while you are engaged in some recreational activity you have the use of both hands and can use a long gun for protection. I consider that view to be short sighted and arbitrary, but that's just me.

If and when you qualify for an ATC, or anticipate qualifying, choose the biggest caliber gun in the smallest package that you can shoot well. Its not prudent to choose long barreled large frame guns that are best suited to handgun hunting. You will have to wear this thing all day, everyday, and if its too heavy or if its in the way, the temptation will be leave it behind. The gun should be resilient to hard use and exposure to the elements, including dust, snow, water, etc. Adjustable sights tend to be delicate. For this reason my primary ATC gun is a .45/8" 44 magnum Ruger Vaquero, which has no crane to spring or adjustable sight to break. The grooved top strap which makes up the rear sight cannot break and have the gun serviceable. A Rough Country rear sight from Bowen Classic Arms for guns with adjustable rear sights is nearly as strong due to its opposing screw windage adjustment and some might prefer the larger sight notch to the grooved top strap. I learned about this when the rear sight on my former Super Blackhawk fell apart under recoil. I prefer to use the heaviest for caliber, hard cast, WFN bullets that I can load between 1100-1200 fps regardless of caliber, but I consider a .357 the smallest bullet diameter that is prudent given the serious nature of this particular application.

The choice of an appropriate holster is as important as the choice of the gun. The ATC requires a holster that has a retaining device, but beyond that you are free to choose whatever you like provided its suitable for open carry, the ATC gun cannot be concealed.. Elements that I look for are a covered trigger guard, to prevent things from unintentionally entering the trigger guard, , an open muzzle so debris can fall through, allow the carrying of extra ammunition on the belt, with a belt wide enough to give ample support to the weight of the gun and spare ammo. Individuals with slim builds can wear shoulder harnesses, but my chest, shoulders and arms are thick enough that reaching the butt of a gun carried in a shoulder holster is a problem. I tried a copy of the Doc Holiday rig made by Kirkpatrick, but the frontal position of the rig put the gun in the way, and I had to furnish a hammer thong as non was provided. I went back to a belt holster, and prefer a pancake design which allows the gun to be carried strong side or cross draw on the support side.
The ATC requires you to provide a letter from your range officer as proof of proficiency. IMHO, shooting 2 dimensional paper targets does not proficiency make, but the law gets in the way here as well, preventing us from using our protection guns on non-dangerous live targets. In bear defense situations, the range is typically short and the action fast, so I would like to see hits on paper within 2" of the aiming point made within 2 seconds of the signal, fired from a range of 5 yards. Learning to engage moving targets is even more important, in that one must train himself to shoot where the target is rather than where it was. Its almost impossible to consider every possible scenario in our training. In a real scenario, the range might be closer, the time constraint can be tight or generous, there is no way to predict whether or not the target will be moving or stationary, obscured or in the open, on level ground or at an elevated position. In each case, the individual must know instinctively where to place his shot.

But this isn't hunting, and a chest shot probably won't save you. Ideally, I'm not shooting at a thousand pound bear, I'm shooting at a hundred pound head. You must learn and understand bear anatomy and behavior; the former so you know how to solve the problem, the later so you can recognize a problem and not shoot bears unnecessarily. Neither is it enough to just shoot the bear in the head, the head is massive and the brain narrow, long, and shallow. In some cases the spine is a better target, in others the hip. Again this is shooting for protection not for sport. One thing to remember is that if it happens to you, you’ll do what you train to do, except that you’ll do it more poorly.
 
To provide something of an answer to the question, a friend took part in a grizzly study in the US in the 1960s, in which the bears were tranquilized and measurements made on the unrestrained, sleeping bears. He told me that everyone in the study group carried a .44 magnum revolver, and they had two backup guys with shotguns loaded with slugs. They only had a bear wake up early once, but he said it was a memorable experience that he didn't want to go through again. Things were not as well controlled then, and my guess is that nobody would do anything quite so casual now.
 
The BC CFO has a standard for approved Wilderness ATC guns (worth a look), carry the biggest handgun you can shoot accurately. Better than that, get a shotgun (even a little one) and load it with slugs.
 
To provide something of an answer to the question, a friend took part in a grizzly study in the US in the 1960s, in which the bears were tranquilized and measurements made on the unrestrained, sleeping bears. He told me that everyone in the study group carried a .44 magnum revolver, and they had two backup guys with shotguns loaded with slugs. They only had a bear wake up early once, but he said it was a memorable experience that he didn't want to go through again. Things were not as well controlled then, and my guess is that nobody would do anything quite so casual now.

They still do it like that here, but with fewer people on site. A bear is typically darted from a helicopter, bear lies down, helicopter lands, measurements taken, the bear is put in a recovery position and off they go to get the next one.

The drugs used today are better than those used in the '60s, which were based on angle dust. A couple of years ago I helped move a large bear. When he's out the guy at the head can grab him around the snout and lift his head. This guy stunk and I didn't want to get along the length of his body if I could help it. As it turned out, by the time we were finsihed I wanted to burn my clothes. So I grab around the snout and he lifts his head (which was about as wide as my shoulders) and bunts me in the chest. "Okay, I won't stick my hands in your mouth then!" From the time we started to handle him, until we got him into the net, he grumbled the entire time, but he was powerless to do anything else. I imagine that being awake but unable to do anything is a bit stressful for them, but provided they're given the correct dose, they're pretty safe to handle. Mind you, another time I watched them dart a large male, one dart and down he went, then this little guy right next to him took 6 and was still staggering around like a drunk. It was funny to watch, but I'm glad it wasn't me getting stuck with those darts. Even a big bear reacts like they hurt. But it goes to show how critical the dose is, and how easily a mistake can be made.
 
Great story Boomer. Here in BC, we use telazol for tranquilizing and it seems to work great. Not sure what they would have been using in the 60's? Definately a science to it, and you never quite let yor guard down
 
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