best nr black rifle?

ztunelover said:
Is that right? Fast light projecticle that fragments at the first sign of anything other than air will have overpenetration issues? Are you sure about that assesment?
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I'm sure he is talking about FMJ's which is what most people shoot. If so, he's right. Which is why my RFB would be terrible for home defense with 147gr FMJ's. Not too worried about the neighbors though since I live on an acreage and they aren't very close.
 
cr5 said:
I'm sure he is talking about FMJ's which is what most people shoot. If so, he's right. Which is why my RFB would be terrible for home defense with 147gr FMJ's. Not too worried about the neighbors though since I live on an acreage and they aren't very close.
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The home defense rounds are ballistic silvertips with the fragmenting poly tip.

And in response to the other guy talking about overpenetration, US DOD studies as well as FBI studies has already proven gypsum boards in drywall are exceptionally capable of sucking out a huge amount of energy out of the 223 round, even more so with varmint oriented loads like the aforementioned winchesters. the only time I can see major penetration issues is if I am using the steel or tungsten core ap bullets and unless I am mistaken I don't think we are legally allowed that type of ammo.
 
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ztunelover said:
The home defense rounds are ballistic silvertips with the fragmenting poly tip.

And in response to the other guy talking about overpenetration, US DOD studies as well as FBI studies has already proven gypsum boards in drywall are exceptionally capable of sucking out a huge amount of energy out of the 223 round, even more so with varmint oriented loads like the aforementioned winchesters. the only time I can see major penetration issues is if I am using the steel or tungsten core ap bullets and unless I am mistaken I don't think we are legally allowed that type of ammo.
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All centerfire rifle rounds will penetrate soft body armour. Only AP handgun ammo is prohibited in canada. AP rifle ammo is not including hardened core variants.

Tdc
 
boss351cleveland said:
Varmint ammo like Vmax wont even penetrate a gopher , it just vaporizes him , theres no bullet left just tiny shards of lead ..
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I can assure you they do penetrate. You simply don't find and fragments of the projectile because they pass right through. The "detonation" you see with varmints is mostly due to hydrostatic shock. Have a search for the infamous LeMas bullets. They were nothing but moly coated ballistic tips rounds and they very much dropped living animals with them. There is or was a video of their testing on pigs and they were quite effective.

TDC
 
Swiss Arms

Difficult to beat any of them - Standard 550 - 20.78" Barrel / 551 - Carbine 14" Barrel / 553 - CQB 8.9" Barrel

Throw a Trijicon scope on one of them and your done.

IMHO of course ...
 
I dont see the point of talking about the CQB I an NR thread. However I love my Elcan Spectre DR! Bought used holds zero has great reticle.
 
ztunelover said:
Why not a nice red dot on a cqb rifle? Hensoldt, triji rmr, aimpoint micro way better options.
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a good 1-4 like the trijicon, nightforce or s&b short dot work as wel as a reflex sight on low power yet give you magnification whe. you need it. reflex sights are not ideal for anything over 75 yards
 
dizzy said:
a good 1-4 like the trijicon, nightforce or s&b short dot work as wel as a reflex sight on low power yet give you magnification whe. you need it. reflex sights are not ideal for anything over 75 yards
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Given the trajectory of the 223 round, I'd have to disagree with that statement - a decent red dot will do anything iron sights will do, only quicker, out to 200 yards.
 
dizzy said:
a good 1-4 like the trijicon, nightforce or s&b short dot work as wel as a reflex sight on low power yet give you magnification whe. you need it. reflex sights are not ideal for anything over 75 yards
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I am sure a competent shooter can take a dot out farther than that, a magnified optic is also heavier than a red dot, and quality magnifiers like the ones you mentioned are also a fair bit more expensive.
 
I don't know where the discussion about cqb came in....this is clearly a non restricted thread. I guess some guys just like airtime.

Anyhow, the overwhelming answer to the question posed in the op has been answered and is the swiss arms.

Thanks guys
 
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