Swiss Arms rifles being examined for reclassification?

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nick237 said:
I might just gamble on it ..... Like someone said before I wonder if this will promote a brief sales surge when everything is sorted out and it's deemed legal fingers crossed. I love that black special I've been on a Post where someone had a blue special what's that all about ..... I like blue it's a nice color how many colours they come in? What about a converted qcb Swiss ?
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the blue one was called the blue star, red was the red devil and they also made a heavy metal which was just clearcoated raw steel.

I would love to find a Heavy metal if any were ever imported, even a nice blue star
 
Swampy said:
Wow, with all the external foes we have, we do a dam good job of taking each other apart. I don't own a Swiss Arms Rifle at this time. Based on the arguing across the hall between the two corporate entities here, unless they both help find a solution to this fiasco, I can see a lot of people taking their gun business elsewhere. If the Swiss Arms rifles are re-classified, we all lose, as they will come after another black rifle next. Some good comments in here, but we all lose if we keep bickering and taking cheap shots at each other. Pandoras box has been opened. How we fix it is another matter.
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I think you have missed the whole root of the current debacle here. It wasn't 2 corporations but 1, TSE that started this whole thing rolling. As the facts that have been released demonstrate, CSC did nothing wrong. The firearm in question, incidentally submitted to the RCMP by JR, was found to be a non C/A by design. This is clearly a case of one company thinking they could discredit another for some form of commercial gain. In the end the a very poor decision as we are all witnessing.
 
TSE and CSC, your childish arguing and blaming each other etc is really not the solution here. I know you two are competing businesses, but Calgary is a big place with lots of business for the both of you so grow up. The last thing we need in a situation like this is the firearms community turning on itself.

So for the Kriss rifles, what is going on? Were there C/A's imported much like the swiss rifles? Or is it open season on tacticool sporting rifles?
 
As blaxsun posted in the other thread, the ACR's FRT was also pulled for review, and subsequently reinstated. So there's hope.
 
driller212 said:
So for the Kriss rifles, what is going on? Were there C/A's imported much like the swiss rifles? Or is it open season on tacticool sporting rifles?
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Not entirely sure. Maybe TV can find out for us?

sewktbk said:
As blaxsun posted in the other thread, the ACR's FRT was also pulled for review, and subsequently reinstated. So there's hope.
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Definitely hope.
 
The length some dealers will go to protect their "empires" makes me sick to my stomach. Tattling to the RCMP is just a chump move and I hope it backfires severely. I have no dog in this fight, but I really hope this turns out positively for the hundreds of people who own these rifles. I see a bunch on the EE now trying to dump them and most will probably accept a loss. Ruling or not, people are going to end up screwed because of the selfish actions of someone.

I'm not laying blame on anyone in particular, but I am sure whoever is to blame will be reading this. Think about Calgary for a second. How many used car dealers are there? Do you think they rat each other out to the Ministry of Transportation to get ahead? No, probably not, because the owner of the other dealer would probably go over an lay a beating on them for being such a little #####. Grow the #### up and realize that there is going to be competition out there. If you can't beat them with sales and service then maybe you need to accept the losses or move on.
 
I think our best bet is to contact media outlets -

Apologies if someone has already said that, as I only skimmed the rest of the thread, and most of it was boring rhetoric, grumbling and arguing instead of actually taking action.
I have emailed a considerable amount of 'Conservative' news sites, both in my home city of Calgary, as well as nationally (ie. Ezra Levant and the Sun News Network etc. etc.) regarding this attempt to reclassify, and how we may be seeing a review instance of ' Legal Registration will Lead to Confiscation and Destruction' - I suggest we all do the same.

Since the SwissArms family is literally one of the last modern rifles we as Canadians can purchase legally (face it, the AR15 platform is almost 50 years old, and not a lot can compare with the less than 30 year old SwissArm system - no offense to die hard AR guys ... but they'd rather have us stuck with antiques), I think we should all seriously consider making a hell of a lot of noise regarding this.

I mean, the SwissArms have been sold in Canada for over a decade now -

Thoughts?
 
Good idea Strum, we could basically write a press release informing media companies of the background:

The Swiss Arms rifle represents the best characteristics of NATO, peaceful respectful communities and gun training. Etc.

Stats on number of households in Switzerland with the rifle and gun related crimes. My understanding is the Swiss are #3 in gun ownership and yet are very low in crimes. Never involved in a crime in Canada...

This might be the best case NR Rifle to be examined to demonstrate that the RCMP lab was RIGHT in determining this as a non-restricted rifle.

Notice this message extends an olive branch to the badly battered RCMP, and a unified voice of the active gun community bringing forward a gun that might be easily converted to auto. The checks and balances work. Everything is fine, nothing to see here, back to the news...
 
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SturmGewehr44 said:
I think our best bet is to contact media outlets -

Apologies if someone has already said that, as I only skimmed the rest of the thread, and most of it was boring rhetoric, grumbling and arguing instead of actually taking action.
I have emailed a considerable amount of 'Conservative' news sites, both in my home city of Calgary, as well as nationally (ie. Ezra Levant and the Sun News Network etc. etc.) regarding this attempt to reclassify, and how we may be seeing a review instance of ' Legal Registration will Lead to Confiscation and Destruction' - I suggest we all do the same.

Since the SwissArms family is literally one of the last modern rifles we as Canadians can purchase legally (face it, the AR15 platform is almost 50 years old, and not a lot can compare with the less than 30 year old SwissArm system - no offense to die hard AR guys ... but they'd rather have us stuck with antiques), I think we should all seriously consider making a hell of a lot of noise regarding this.

I mean, the SwissArms have been sold in Canada for over a decade now -

Thoughts?
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I'd hold that until they actually do anything with the FRT's, but that's just me. We still have until June 30th to submit supporting evidence.
 
TenHolePunch said:
Has this list been posted.
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http://static.globalnews.ca/content/interactives/documents/general_news_bucket/A-2012-00068.PDF

As for the conflict between CSC and TSE - who cares?

They're not the one's who are going to be stomping on your face to take your rifles away.

All markets have businesses that are cut throat with one another - just in the gun market, armed government agents from the RCMP CAN and routinely ARE literally brought in open a can of democracy on anyone in the market against anyone else who doesn't play the way they want them to, and are clever enough to game the system to their advantage.

If not TSE or CSC against one another - someone else or some other business will, it's incredibly naive to think otherwise.

Is that a fault of the business? No - there is certainly nothing illegal about them cleverly gaming the system to their advantage. That's just how democratic societies works. The masses create a massive oligarchy through an electoral cycle and if you're well connected and clever - you can (and should) use this abominable, government created machine to your personal advantage.

The fault lies with the entire system. Unfortunately, there is no way to actively take this system down or assert any meaningful change. Just look at what the Tories have done while in power - abolished the LGR while implementing harsher mandatory minimum sentences for paper gun crimes AND allowing the RCMP to tax gun owners through license renewal fees - that overall is really NOT really an improvement from the situation before.

All this nonsense talk of what "we" should do is just that - nonsense.

There is no centralized, collective action that can be taken to rectify this situation. The only thing that can bring about REAL change is distributed, widespread, individual action.

The thing to do now is to engage in passive (individual), non-violent resistance against them, not active (collective), non-violent resistance.

Like I said before - if EVERYONE swaps their non-res guns with someone else (either through sale or trade), it becomes impossible to track down who has what. This is an individual action that has MUCH more power than writing a letter to some pig-trough politician who only cares about getting reelected.

While there may only be 1000 Non-Res Swiss Arms on the books, if conceivably the entire pool of 2 million LICENSED gun owners could own one, and there is no centralized record of who currently owns what, it makes the task for the RCMP and the government of stealing them IMPOSSIBLE.

The same is true with EVERY gun on that list - be it a Swiss Arms, an SR22, a CZ858, or any "Semi automatic copy of assault rifles and submachine guns" that the RCMP want to steal from you.

Again I reiterate - don't blame the businesses for a problem created by the government.

Shop at those businesses, then go into business for yourself. It's way more fun building up and trading your own collection of non-res guns and it's way more gratifying knowing with every non-res gun you buy and sell (from and to another private gun owner), you are passively giving the middle finger to the RCMP and the government gun grabbers.
 
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Haven't read everything in this thread but if they did prohib the Swiss does that mean that all Swiss owners would now become 12.3? If so then all those new 12.3s who ever wanted to buy a FN-FAL, GI M14 or any other CA could do so and then CAs would be around for a few more decades. Or if the Swiss was made 12.5 then the same would apply to the HK91, AK47 etc. Yes I know you couldn't shoot them but still just to have one.
 
harbl_the_cat said:
http://static.globalnews.ca/content/interactives/documents/general_news_bucket/A-2012-00068.PDF
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Stray observation about the high point carbine magazines. They're saying about limiting the pistol magazines to five rounds because they work in the rifle, does that mean no more LAR-15 ten round magazines? RCMP could always change their minds about them just like they change their minds about everything else.

Same for the Beowulf mags. Since I can fit more than five .223 rounds in them and use them in a .223 firearm, does that mean they'll be limited to only two rounds of .50 Beowulf?
 
touch157 said:
Haven't read everything in this thread but if they did prohib the Swiss does that mean that all Swiss owners would now become 12.3? If so then all those new 12.3s who ever wanted to buy a FN-FAL, GI M14 or any other CA could do so and then CAs would be around for a few more decades. Or if the Swiss was made 12.5 then the same would apply to the HK91, AK47 etc. Yes I know you couldn't shoot them but still just to have one.
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Wrong. You can only be "grandfathered" into a Prohib license by a family member by the passing down of Prohib firarms within the family upon the death of the family member. That process is a rather tricky one. If the RCMP bypasses the governement in re-classification of this firearm (which they can) you will be in illegal pocession of the said firearm. They will not be handing out every owner a Prohib license but rather implementing a "by-back" program which we all know is a joke from previous examples. Then after a certain grace period they will be issuing warrents for the sales information on these rifles from the importers and then eventually kicking down doors looking for rifles that where not turned in.

My question is that if i can sell a NR firearm without involving the government or any proof of purchase or sale, how many warrants will be issued in error? As the seller i am responsible for confirming that the buyer has all the proper licensing but i am not required to keep any information about that confirmation but how hard would the RCMP lean on you in trying to "jar" your memory about whom you sold it to?

This story made it into a 4 min piece on the Sun news network this morning. I feel sorry for all the swiss arms owners as they are beautiful rifles and certainaly not cheap and you know the RCMP will not be giving you fair market value.
 
crazydsb said:
Wrong. You can only be "grandfathered" into a Prohib license by a family member by the passing down of Prohib firarms within the family upon the death of the family member. That process is a rather tricky one.
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There is NO process.......If you did not have a Prohib license before a certain date which has LONG since passed, then getting a prohib license is impossible.
 
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