Berger Bullets on Game(Pics up on last post)

powdergun

powdergun

CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Rating - 100%
253   0   0
Well tonight I finally connected on a decent size dry doe. ( Horns are great but spicey deer sausages are better) I was using my 7 mm RM loaded with 150 gr Berger Hunting bullets because I was on a large field and 400 yard shots often present themselves. However, this doe pops out at 80 yards and stands there as perfect as you please so I line up. I take my time sqeeze and boom. My eyes are are on her for the full shot so I saw her reaction which was nothing. Not a lurch a twitch nothing and she goes bounding off down the trail.

Having previously missed two other deer with my muzzle loader this year I was choked to put it mildly. How the F**** can I miss at 80 yards from a rested shot with a gun I just had out to the range and was hitting 2L pop bottle at 300 yards. I start looking and I find her piled up 40 yards in the bush on the trail she ran in on.

Upon gutting I examine the shot and find the entry wound right where I thought I put it and no exit wound. Both lungs were torn up but not liquified ( take this term with a little pinch of salt) as many other deer I've shot . The entry wound was very large.

From those of you with experience with Bergers ( This is the first time I've used them on game ) what are some of your experiences. I know they are a long range bullet so would the bullet of been going too fast ?

I've dropped many deer in the last thirty years and each one has always shown some sign of being hit with the bullet this deer just acted like nothing happened and bounded away without a limp or a care. I'm very glad she's hanging in the shed and I am well aware the the glorious " Bang Flop " is in fact as rare as a Rider Grey Cup but a deer hit in the boiler room at 80 yards by a 7mm RM should at least twitch a little.

Pics up tomorrow after I get it skinned out.

Cheers
 
Last edited:
Sometimes deer do that.

There is no way to predict or should we expect certain reactions from game when being hit by projectiles, just can't do it with any consistency aside from a large helping of C4, that you can assume a fairly reliable outcome.
 
Hmmmm C4 wonder if I could put a little of that in a 45 cal hollow point. Just thinking.

It was odd as I've watched many friends shoot a deer and shot a fair bunch myself and have never seen a reaction like that.
 
I quit using Bergers when a 190 gr out of my .300 Win blew up on a whitetail's ribs and didn't make it through to the chest cavity. He bang-flopped nicely but got back up. Range was a lasered 440 yards and I was using my F-class rifle of the time on a bipod. My son clobbered it with his little .257 Weatherby and 100 grain NBTs at probably under 30 yards.

Sometimes a guy has to do a reality check. In my case it was to question what exactly I was planning to do that with that rifle that couldn't be done just as well with hunting bullets.

On the subject of bang-flops; I get a very high percent of deer piling right up when hit. High velocity, relatively soft bullets and shots through the shoulders take care of that.
 
They shoot very well out of my rig. Can someone suggest a good 140 gr replacement ? I have a good supply of 140 gr Nosler ballistic tips that work very well out of my 7 08. I went with the Bergers because they shot so well. Guess I may have to load up some of those BTs for next year.
 
Dogleg said:
When Berger first put "Hunting" on a bullet box they were exactly the same as the target bullets, right down to the product number. I even sectioned some. That may have changed now, but there are dozens of bullets out there that I don't have to wonder about.
Click to expand...

SAMMI approved so I suspect they are new. Lower BC too.
 
miykael said:
The Barnes TTSX or LRX will shoot just as good but with no fragmentation problem. I've got my .308 grouping almost 1/2" at 100 and my first deer with it :)
Click to expand...

I've tried Barnes a couple of times but could never get them to shoot well. They are a great bullet but just can't get them to work for me.
 
Simple listen up grasshopper
the term is anchoring
we do as our seniors have tought us to shoot heart and lung
forget it .I have shot 3 deer and one elk this year ,
all shot 1shot dead before they hit the ground 3 shoulder shot 1head shot
shoot the front shoulder the bones explode into the heart and lung
they dy on the spot . Yes you ruined the front shoulder
but no edenaling in the meat bang flop dead .
 
Tikkam65 said:
Simple listen up grasshopper
the term is anchoring
we do as our seniors have tought us to shoot heart and lung
forget it .I have shot 3 deer and one elk this year ,
all shot 1shot dead before they hit the ground 3 shoulder shot 1head shot
shoot the front shoulder the bones explode into the heart and lung
they dy on the spot . Yes you ruined the front shoulder
but no edenaling in the meat bang flop dead .
Click to expand...

Been doing this for years. The old boiler room tuck it in behind the front shoulder stuff is from days passed. With modern rifles shoulder shots are the bomb-da-bomb.
 
Fair enough but Bergers were designed to break up quickly. Would a shoulder shot risk blowing up the bullet too soon ? Other stronger bullets are a different story.

The shot was a front quartering shot. I may have actually hit the shoulder at an angle before it entered the chest cavity. That might explain the large entrance wound. Too dark to really see and I did not feel like skinning it out tonight. Tomorrow will tell I guess.

I usually aim old school as ruining one of the shoulders is something I try to avoid. Perhaps I'm a little out of the loop as I've been tagging out with my muzzle loader for about the last 20 years. Before that I used old speer mag tips ( Loved them but the newer ones I've tried won't shoot well in any of my guns ) This is the first deer in about 20 years that I've taken with my 7mm. Perhaps I thought I was shooting my front loader.:)
 
Last edited:
Shot a moose a couple years back with them and it died so I guess that would be considered by most to be success BUT.... It literally blew up and fragments never even made it to the off rib cage. It was a neat experiment but I'm done with them personally.
 
powdergun said:
Fair enough but Bergers were designed to break up quickly. Would a shoulder shot risk blowing up the bullet too soon ? Other stronger bullets are a different story.

The shot was a front quartering shot. I may have actually hit the shoulder at an angle before it entered the chest cavity. That might explain the large entrance wound. Too dark to really see and I did not feel like skinning it out tonight. Tomorrow will tell I guess.
Click to expand...
The Berger is a match bullet. Some guys started using them for long range hunting and reported the results back to Berger saying they were getting lightning quick kills, wherein the bullet would enter a few inches then explode like a bomb. Berger started marketing a "hunting" line, but they're not much different than the match bullets. I believe the jacket is supposed to be a bit thicker on the hunting line, but in anything I've seen online they look the same.
I witnessed a 190 gr. 300 WM factory HSM load literally explode on a black bear at 40 yards earlier this year. Pathetic.

Bottom line: they don't work well at closer ranges and are best left to targets, which they were designed for. Hornady seems to get it and tells hunters not to use their AMax on game.
 
Last edited:
I have taken several deer with my 260 with 130 gr Berger VLD's. The bullets performed as designed on every one ranging from 10 yards, out to almost 400 yards. All of the deer taken had certain levels of damaged meat, and bloodshot, but they all either dropped in their tracks or piled up in short order. The only one that had an abnormal amount of bloodshot was the one shot at about 10 yards. They do fragment though, some like that, some don't. A fragmenting bullet can result in a quicker (bang-flop) dropping animal. (I won't say quicker kill, just because an animal drops straight down, doesn't mean it's dead instantly) On the flip side a fragmenting bullet can result in less penetration in certain situations. One of the bucks I shot, the Berger entered behind the front shoulder and due to the angle, ended up high in the neck, no exit. When that deer was cleaned, I found several fragments of the bullet, and not one single piece was bigger than a broken piece of pencil lead. Another that I took at about 200 yards, broadside double lung shot, again piled up right away, but she had several exit wounds. In the snow behind where she was standing at the time of the shot were several (5-6) streaks in the snow where bullet fragments passed through.

When I began hunting with a 7mm STW, and velocities are very high, I had read of several problems with Bergers fragmenting on impact due to high velocities. The general consensus, I have read is that impact velocities above 3100 or there about can lead to problems. Several other forums I have read about this on, refer to Bergers as Ham-Bergers due to the mess they make of game.
I hunt for meat, so damaging a bunch of meat in order to have a game animal drop in its tracks, did not take precedence to minimal meat damage, even if the animal runs 50 yards. So I have switched my hunting bullets for mainly Barnes products, and have had great results everytime. (TTSX, TSX and LRX) I did take a moose last season with a Nosler Accubond, it also worked flawlessly, double lung shot, with zero collateral damage to meat.
 
I've tried Barnes a couple of times but could never get them to shoot well. They are a great bullet but just can't get them to work for me.
Click to expand...

I have had no issues getting moa or better, in every rifle that I tried the TSX/MRX/TTSX/LRX in. They do tend to prefer a jump to the lands, but I haven't had any issues getting them to shoot accurately.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom