Perhaps I'm missing the point, but the rcmp routinely issue antique status letters that specify 45acp, 44 spl and 38 spl as the calibers on antique handguns, so the law stands as only limiting antique status to the guns chambered in the cals listed. Is it a good idea? Depends on the gun and the ammo, but they do recognize it.
First Antique Gun- some newbie questions, French 1873 MAS
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Perhaps I'm missing the point, but the rcmp routinely issue antique status letters that specify 45acp, 44 spl and 38 spl as the calibers on antique handguns, so the law stands as only limiting antique status to the guns chambered in the cals listed. Is it a good idea? Depends on the gun and the ammo, but they do recognize it.
Now you are rationalizing.
Rationalization (making excuses), a psychological defense mechanism in which perceived controversial behaviors are logically justified
I think we all can agree on this.
Best to avoid having to explain anything to the police or RCMP in the first place. Pick a spot where you don't have to worry about others hearing the gunfire and you will probably be ok. If the authorities do show up they likely won't know the law in this regard and they will err on the side of caution and take you for a ride to the station until they can sort it out. I shoot mine at the outdoor range I belong to. That way there is zero problems.
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- Alberta, let freedom reign!
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And your attacking a practice that has already been legally taking place in relative abundance for the last decade and supported by the RCMP without issue as the straw that will break our camels back.
This is not a new practice and no matter how much you hate it or warn against it will have no effect on the outcome down the line, pandora's box was opened long ago.
So let the newbie enjoy his new currently perfectly legal toy. Because like I said earlier, we're already screwed when the time comes regardless.
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At some point someone is going to purchase one of these 'conversions' and think they can shoot 45acp through it. They will injure themselves and perhaps those around them. Then we are all screwed.
The fewer of these abominations are out there the less likely this will happen so yes I will always attack this misguided practice and I will continue to do so. If you want to change the cylinder and barrel on a Colt I really don't have any issue with that as one is as safe as another. I lament the loss of collector value but that is a small thing compared to safety.
This is another matter. There is only minor advantage to converting this (easier to find brass for reloading) and several disadvantages that I have outlined already. All just to make it easier to sell due to the ignorance of the buyers.
The OP is a good example. He intends to shoot some off the shelf ammo through the thing without even knowing the actual psi of the cartridge all because another person 'said it was ok'. Not very bright.
I purchased an antique 38 once that I was told was in 380 Revolver. The seller told me that I could shoot 38 S&W through it no problem. I slugged the bore. It came out .342 38 S&W is .361 As I am typing this with both hands you can guess that I didn't shoot any 38 S&W. Shooting antiques can be fun and safe if done properly. Extra due diligence is required to make sure loads are appropriate and safe. Conversions such as the one done to this gun only make this more difficult and increase the chance that someone is going to get hurt. All so that Bubba can sell a gun. Pretty reprehensible if you ask me.
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- Alberta, let freedom reign!
It may have been improperly converted. Perhaps instead of shaving a minor amount of material from each cylinder the back of the cylinder may have been shaved. That or the hammer where the firing pin is is broken or damaged. Mine is the opposite. My .455 MAS has super deep strikes.
- Location
- Alberta, let freedom reign!
Reload.
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- Alberta, let freedom reign!
Fair. But also in all fairness, one should do their thorough research before purchasing and firing. It would be foolish to shoot .270 or .25-06 from a .30-06
And especially vice versa, but I'm sure it has been done. Same as 3" in a 2 3/4 or steel shot out of an old full choke 12 gauge.
Fact is, you can't legislate smarts, and as Tyockell said, we're all screwed anyways. Just a matter of time. Heck, global news (spit) already tried wih antiques and LAR mags.
Are you going to give yours up and fudd about why it happened? I'm not.
Yeah, You can't legislate smarts. You are right about that.
Gun makers have gone to great effort to make sure that newer, higher power cartridges can't be loaded in older guns. 357 Magnum is a good example. The only reason it is longer than 38 Special is so that you can't use them in 38 Special guns.
Converting an 1873 to 45acp is the exact opposite. It is a cartridge that is PROVEN to blow up these guns. Buyer beware of course and that is why I posted the information that I have. I just wish more would do their homework before they buy. Then there wouldn't be any demand for these conversions.
As far as it being just a matter of time, I think it is more likely that they will require guns not in their original caliber to require registration. Much simpler, You only piss off the people who were pushing the envelope this way and it is consistent with the original intent of the law.
I have been looking online for the past hour or so for any information on pressures for Cowboy action loads but I'm not finding anything. At least the bullets are soft lead as per SASS rules but I'm not finding anything about pressure other than the vague, 'it is lower'. Even if I could find out what powder is used and the bullet specs etc. I could at least work it out with quickload. If anyone knows more about this then please share.
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You know what, if someone is dumb enough to blow themselves up... well even with legislation it would happen anyways. Besides antique guns have blown up even with factory loads in original calibers.
Generally when people think "antique firearm" they think, "proceed with caution".
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I would hope that they think 'proceed with caution' but I have met a few people at gun shows who get all excited about the 'loophole' the guy with the antiques told them about. All they can think about is how 'cool' it will be to be able to shoot a handgun and they don't even have to get their RPAL.
I have met these people. Darwin is stalking them. It makes me sad that others are so uncaring that they would mislead them just to sell a gun.
My conscience requires that I at least try to set the record straight. It really isn't that hard to learn the steps to make it safe.
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- Alberta, let freedom reign!
Do your bullets "rattle" while in battery? As in do they move forward and backwards easily? Also, is your hammer "pointy"?
This is what mine looks like.
455 Webley is rated at 13,000 psi so about 10% higher than the 11,600 psi recommended. Probably not enough to stress it past its tensile limit so probably ok but that is just my amateur opinion.
Do you reload? Have you slugged the bore? Your bore is probably closer to .452 but you really have to slug your own to be sure. If you reload then you can use .452 soft lead bullets or something even closer to yours than the .455 Webley bullets and you will reduce the strain even further. (with the appropriate load)
If it's light primer strikes I see it as four possible things:
1) In conversions they cut the chambers/rim recesses too deep. This'll show as the face of the cartridge base sitting below flush with the back of the cylinder - how much so depends on length of firing pin. Get a new cylinder
2) Gun dirty and gummed up internally slowing hammer fall. Clean out gun and lubricate lightly.
3) Weak main spring. Hammer won't snap shut when fired and generally seems soft/weak. Replace main spring.
4) Damaged or reworked firing pin. Will not protrude far past recoil plate. May show damage or may have been polished in an attempt to fix it. Replace hammer or have built up/fixed by gunsmith.
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