Trophy Hunting
- Thread starter sheephunter
- Start date
You hit the nail on the head regarding hunting for horns and not the meat.......that's me. One of my objectives is to harvest a mature animal, moreover to enjoy the wilderness by seeing, hearing, smelling and feeling her as long as I can. Like I mentioned in a previous post and I will repeat it many times over, that a true trophy hunter will pass-up many substandard animals to reach their minimum, otherwise go home with their tag in their pocket. This year I told my son that I will not shoot anything except that "big four" mule buck I was scouting. If I could not harvest him then then my 8 year wait for a special mule buck tag remains in my pocket. Long story short the buck was harvested and the meat cut/wrapped given to a needy family. Need a trophy hunter give more?.............without the money facture added in. My said statement is to those who are ignorant regarding hunting or trophy hunting.
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What I meant by "reasonable" was that the article was not anti hunting or anti trophy hunting.
Do you have a link to "debunking" of the article?
Ding Ding we have a winner.
h ttp://www.skinnymoose.com/bbb/2009/01/19/rebuttal-dr-valerius-geist-responds-to-newsweek-article-on-trophy-hunting/#ixzz1kDLAUPKb
This is Geist in response to Coltman's paper, which is basically the exact same as Festa's paper, which this article is based on. If you catch my drift. You could also try reading the Festa paper which this article is based on and draw your own conclusions.
- Location
- Ft. Mac. Alberta
I don't have an issue with trophy hunters or guides as a group persay, but some hunters and guidesthemselves are total jackwads!
I used to guide myself, but this issue is not about hunters judging ourselves ( which actually we are our own worst enamies!), but what the pu]blic thinks of us.
I have no fixed answer for sure, don't watch hunting shows, and am not a trophy hunter in what I perceive to be the true sense because I kill my animals for the freezer.
if they have headgear, it's because i have a tag for them.....
Cat
I used to guide myself, but this issue is not about hunters judging ourselves ( which actually we are our own worst enamies!), but what the pu]blic thinks of us.
I have no fixed answer for sure, don't watch hunting shows, and am not a trophy hunter in what I perceive to be the true sense because I kill my animals for the freezer.
if they have headgear, it's because i have a tag for them.....
Cat
To each their own... Some hunt for meat, and some for the challenge of a mature representative animal... As long as all laws and acceptable ethics are followed (no wasting of meat)... Then that is an individual choice that each must make for themselves... It does the hunting community harm when hunters start "in fighting..." Many locally consider me to be a trophy hunter, which I am not per say... I have taken some fine animals, but I still hunt "primarily" for meat, but I will pass on jeuvenile and smaller adult animals to harvest a larger (male) animal... Sometimes they have big racks or skulls, so be it... As long as the freezer has enough to last until next season, I'm good... I admire the dedication and single-mindedness required to pursue truly mature and experienced animals... On the other end of the spectrum, I admire the casual ease and "experience appreciating" nature of those who harvest the first fat doe to come along and then swap tales in front of the fireplace while dining on tenderloin...
It seems to me that Geist is responding to the article (Its Survival of the Weak and Scrawny) and not so much the paper quoted in that article.
Are you serious Duffy?
Why yes I am.
Rebuttal: Dr. Valerius Geist Responds To Newsweek Article On Trophy Hunting - See more at: http://www.skinnymoose.com/bbb/2009...sweek-article-on-trophy-hunting/#ixzz1kDLAUPK
See it says right there in the title of your link. It is directed at the article.
A quote from Geist in your link "Contrary to any impression conveyed by Darimont et al, but especially the reports in the public media, the premise, that humans are a primary agent of change on their prey is not new. It’s old hat, very old hat. We have been change agents from early prehistory as aboriginal hunters, and what we did not exterminate, survived at times in a dramatically different form. - See more at: http://www.skinnymoose.com/bbb/2009...sweek-article-on-trophy-hunting/#ixzz1kDLAUPK
He seems to be saying that the premise is not new it is old hat and Geist agrees that it is correct. How is that debunking Darimont's paper?
Well for the past decade I have heard stories of Alberta sheep possibly going into the draw system for various reasons, primarily a population drop and trophy quality. However it wasn't an issue that I was overly concerned about because I don't hunt sheep, therefore did not follow through on educating myself. There was one good comment that I agreed upon where one person mentioned that it is not the hunters who decide the fate of the sheep but the regulators.......made sense to me. If population and trophy quality is down then regulate it as what they (Alberta Government) did with the mule deer. Today the quality and quantity of mule deer are robust than back in the 1980's when they introduced the draw.
It seems that a few zones have been on draw for 6-7 years. They would seem to be a once in a lifetime draw. There are a few that have been drawn 2 and 3 times.
How about a draw for 3/4 curl and larger, and general for full curl across the board.
If a province-wide draw was instituted it would undoubtedly be on the priority system. I'm only aware of one sheep draw in the province right now that is not on the priority system, where the possibility of drawing more than once before everyone else in the draw exists. I understand a few people have drawn it multiple times...something not too unexpected if you are a student of statistics at all. Why this draw wasn't a once in a lifetime draw like goats and bison in the first place perplexes me but I suspect and hope it will be in the future. If a province wide draw were set up with the priority system, basically it would turn into a once in a lifetime opportunity just because of the sheer number of applicants. I don't support any province-wide draw. There is no need for it.
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I didn't mention a province wide across the board draw. Only a draw for 3/4 curl, which should be 1/lifetime. And a full curl general tag for all zones. This would allow the rams to grow to full curl AND help cull the huge broomed off rams that otherwise die of old age.
It would seem to open the door to shooting a number of even younger rams than we are now as well. Truthfully I could count the number of sub legal old broomed rams in 4/5 zones that I've seen on one hand. In full curl zones it's another story. Like I said earlier, If someone could prove to me that there were population problems and that more restrictive hunting regulations were more than a temporary stop gap to a larger issue, I would support them. So far I've seen nothing but my mind is always open to new research. Perhaps the current work that Kneteman is doing will shed some new light. It would seem idiotic to do anything until his research is done. It may well hold the key.
Antelope has been on a draw for as long as I can remember. Not a once in a life time draw. And I have hunted antelope Trophy, non-trophy many times and archery once.
I don't see why any sheep draw should be a once in a life time draw.
The over all sheep population may be stable but the "trophy ram" population is under a lot of pressure. A draw would take some of that pressure off and control the harvest better.
I don't see why any sheep draw should be a once in a life time draw.
The over all sheep population may be stable but the "trophy ram" population is under a lot of pressure. A draw would take some of that pressure off and control the harvest better.
Duffy, it would be a once in a lifetime draw because of the very low harvest goal. You can't compare any other species that's on a priority draw to it. Say you gave out 500 tags per year to 25,000 applicants. You could draw a tag every 25 years. So maybe for some it would be twice in a lifetime.
